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I would like to share a list I have dreamed up after seeing a guy's list at GW's yesterday.

HQ:

Master with Storm Bolter & Power Weapon.

ELITES:

Terminator Squad x5 with 2 Assault Cannons.
Terminator Squad x5 with 2 Assault Cannons.
Terminator Squad x5 with 2 Assault Cannons.

TROOPS:

Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.
Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.
Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.
Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.
Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.
Tactical Squad x 6 with Lascannon & Plasma Gun.


This is 1500pts exactly. The guy used LST instead of terminators. I asked him if he was from Wisconsin because his list was so cheesy!

I would say this list is somewhat less cheesy and sticks more to the infamous min/max "THEME"

I don't have the terminators to do this list and am wondering if I even should? Would anyone of you look at this and cry cheese and not want to play it?

I personally dont see why people do the six man las/plas as it is a waste of points, then again that imop. Why would you not want to test your army vs his. Its not like the assault cannon is the bane of all items as I have faced it many times. Next if you play his game then yes it might be a tuff battle but then you would be falling into his trap. There are to many sides to work here to name them all to strip this list of its power. Set up allows you to place terrain so set it all up in the middle to block out all of his los. Then snip him off for the few units that set up for los.

Apostolos,

The 6 lascannons would give mech armies a decently hard match on open terrain. But in any kind of complex terrain, a well played mech army can use its superior mobility to kill one piece at a time.

Against horde armies, I think this list would have a hard time. Outside of 24 inches, you really can only place 6 shots a turn. Not very much. Inside 24 inches, the horde will most likely only suffer one turn of shooting before moving into an assault and then your tac squads will suffer greatly.

If you really want to go with the min/max theme, I'd suggest the following changes:

HQ:
Master with Terminator Armor, PW, SB (120)

Elites:
Terminator Squad x5 with 2 Assault Cannons (240)
Terminator Squad x5 with 2 Assault Cannons (240)

Troops:
Tac Marines x5 with Las/Plas (100)
Tac Marines x5 with Las/Plas (100)
Tac Marines x5 with Las/Plas (100)
Tac Marines x5 with Las/Plas (100)

Heavy:
Devestator x5 with 3 ML (135)
Devestator x5 with 3 ML (135)

Fast:
Landspeeder Tornado with Assault Cannon, HB (80)
Landspeeder Tornado with Assault Cannon, HB (80)
Landspeeder Tornado with Assault Cannon, HB (80)

Thats 1480 points with significantly more firepower than what you submitted. Not an army I would have fun playing but it does pack a good close range AI punch from the speeders and termis, 4 independant lascannons for tank hunting, and 6 missile launchers to fire krak or frag as needed.

Take care,
Mike K.

- *oof* (I just threw up in my mouth a little)

- I ask as sincerely as someone who loathes this sort of 'game play' can...and I realize you did say min/max, and that it is, so no flak from me there. SO, to the question: What is the appeal of playing this kind of army?

Whats the appeal of any tri falcon eldar or nidzilla? At least everything in this army can be killed with relative ease.

Freefall wrote: - *oof* (I just threw up in my mouth a little)

- I ask as sincerely as someone who loathes this sort of 'game play' can...and I realize you did say min/max, and that it is, so no flak from me there. SO, to the question: What is the appeal of playing this kind of army?

Playing the toughest lists out there makes for extremely good gameplay, but only if its against someone else using the same kind of list. me and my friends are all big cheeseballs, so anything goes. thats just the way some people play.

i think apostolos' list is better, but...why the master? LD 10 is good, but for 120 points I'd rather spend extra on the epistolary. Libs can do much it's crazy...and the term lib model is one of my favs

I also find las/plas to be something of a waste. You can save some points by dropping the plas and beef up the dev squads...I'm also a fan of using hb squads, but MLs should be fine.

As for "cheesy" lists, I can't speak for anyone else, but I think the game is more fun when both you and your opponent are using the most efficient lists you can.

Efficient lists are fine, but the game just seem fun to play with a list like that. It's a point and click game, pretty boring.

Actually, I would say avoid it as rumored 5th ed changes and the resultant new SM codex will remove this list as an option from the game and you might as well get used to Termie squads with 1 heavy per 5 guys and 10 man Tac squads.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

I wouldn't call those lists efficient. I'd call them brittle - they're armies for a boring point-and-click game that becomes a boring die-and-flee game if either your luck doesn't hold up, or your opponent stops co-operating by attacking and demolishing your units one at a time, and spreads their attacks around.

these lists would fall like dead leaves in autumn.

Bastirous---I happen to agree with your assessment. But he asked for a list with a min/maxed theme and that is what he got.

ok sorry to hi-jack the post, but does ne1 know if i use the scions of mars trait and upgrade a techmarine to a hq choice can i still take say a 5 man hq in a rhino transport attached to the techmarine hq?

Saying sorry beforehand doesn't make it acceptable. Your question ahs absolutely nothing to do with this thread. Go ask this on the YMDC forum, or wait for someone to give you a reply on your own thread. Or just read your codex.

Also, please don't use chatspeak. Things like "ne1" make my eyes bleed.

thank you for saying that, i was about to say the same thing, so you spared my breath (which makes me question then why i typed this?)

anyway about the list i think that min/maxing is ok, but just don't go to the point where the list takes a few casualties and runs like hell. to take down the las/plas squads, or dev squads would be one round of shooting for a good IG list, and CC would be a joke. just wait til the new marine codex comes out before you go making this list because as the other marine codices have gone so far they won't be able to min/max like this any more

bike + artificer armour > terminator armour.