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Hello,

Been thinking about which WM or Hordes faction I might go with. I'm normally attracted to evil factions so Cryx, Legion, and Skorne look interesting to me. And I'm leaning towards Hordes because the warlock/warbeasts are more flexible for on the fly changes.

I'm a bit hesitant to chose Cryx because apparently it's Bane Knights and Bile Thralls are just so good, and I don't want to grab an OP faction. The Legion also looks interesting, but I keep hearing that is pretty OP as well or an "easy" button. So I am looking at Skorne, and well, does it have any decent shooting? It seems to be all melee, which reminds me of Hordes of Chaos (bleh).

I know that Cygnar is the shootiest of all the factions, but the models don't appeal to me very much.

Cygnar and Khador are probably the shootiest, but you can get VERY shooty with a merc pirate force (riflemen, deck guns, Bart, mariners, etc.)

Skorne has venators and their catapult, and the cannoneer, and the basilisks both provide for buffs and ranged attacks. And the gladiator can two-hand throw things . Depending on which 'lock you take, you could go pretty shooty with 'em, but that's not exactly their strongest suit. I see skorne as much more combined arms than pure shooty, whereas cygnar (for example) can go almost pure shooty with a Haley denial list.

Don't forget the Karax kneel so that everything can shoot
OVER them.

You could choose Cryx and then NOT play Bane knights or bile thralls.

Just a thought.

With the existing releases, pretty much any WM faction can be built with a good sampling of dakka. All the factions can have some powerful combos. Generally, Cygnar and Khador would be the best options for ranged firepower.

None of the Hordes factions offer lots of dakka. Legion has some good beasts, notably the Seraph, and Trollbloods have firepower with their warriors. But, they all do better by putting a sword to the face.

There are generally easier ways to shut down incoming ranged attacks than incoming melee attacks. With cav now in the game, I really feel that ranged attacks are at the bottom of the triangle that is melee, magic, and ranged attacks.

Captain Bart

Mule
Mule
Mariner
Precursor Knights +UA

= Tons o Dakka

I have never thought of Skorne as being very shooty. They get the Cannoneer, and Venerators are solid but that's it, really. Trolls are shooty, especially with their shooty 'lock, and Everblight is definately shooty. Fast, shooty, high DEF and hard hitting, what's not to love.

I don't know if Everblight is very though. Lots of "Archahs!" and fire breathing shark-dragons.

Is Cryx shooty? They have those little shooty Warjack thingers. And magic.

LoE is one of the shootiest and most effective ranged army that can back itself up with decent hth in the same list.

PoM has decent range and nothing is stronger within 11 inches than crazy zealots.

Cryx is magic type shooty.

Revenant pirates have psitols but are pretty expensive. Bile thralls do have a spray weapon, although most people go with the purge special action.

If you want more, you pretty much have to go with merc units.

Khador is pretty shooty, with the 701st list being mostly WA.
You also have Destroyers, Behemoth, Mortars, and (the double tapping) Assault Kommandos.

Don't forget the sniper crew.

How do Assault Kommandos do in game? I've only faced
them once...

From what I hear and theorize, they do very very well vs. infantry. Thats it, just arm < 16 models because of the gun's low pow.
Up side is they can waste practically any unit they come across.

You say you don't want an OP faction, so here are some suggestions if you want a challenge.
Cryx Pirate-themed, Merc contracts, or Skorne.

Cryx - Avoid the Banes and Biles and take Revenants, Black Ogrun, Raiders, and Spider-chassis Warjacks. It works, but it's a totally different flavor than what the weapon master Banes and exploding Bile balloons provide. Deneghra and E-Skarre are two good Warcaster choices as both can help your undead-piratey guns actually hit stuff.

Merc contracts tend to be weaker than the main factions, but are by no means an auto-loss. Their synergy can be a challenge to master, but dedicated Merc players tend to love their armies.

Skorne - I don't even know where to start. Perhaps it's just the local scene, but people here seem to avoid Skorne altogether. I've had maybe four games against them. Their slow pace and lack of pathfinder really seem to hurt them a lot. They have some good combos though.


Now if you want dakka:
Cygnar is the undisputed champ of mid/long-ranged fire.
Khador rivals them a bit with their mortars and bombards (combine this with Sorscha for mucho pain-o), otherwise they are powerful at short/mid-range.
Protectorate has a light mix of everything, but excel at short range (firebombs!).
Cryx has a mix of range as well, but they tend to just distract you with it until they get their spells and/or melee beatsticks into range.

Trollbloods are the dakka Hordes faction, but they back it up with melee monsters.
Legion can go dakka heavy with Striders Archers and Seraphs, but they also mix it up in melee.
Skorne is primarily melee focused with a dash of ranged.
Circle is the magic heavy faction, but they've also got a solid bit of short/mid-ranged units.

Hordes is a bit different in the balance between ranged/magic/melee. The reason being that while assassination still works, it's usually necessary to tackle more of the opponents army than it can be in Warmachine due to the Fury mechanics. In such an environment, a mixed army tends to be more successful than a specialized one.

malfred wrote:How do Assault Kommandos do in game? I've only faced
them once...

They do what IFP don't. And thats kill lots of small things. With Double tap and 2 melee attacks they kill alot of low arm models. (trenchers O.o) While IFP kill single large targets the best, PoW13 pikes and CMA.

maybe I'll try Assault Kommandos instead of Widow Makers. Or maybe I'll do the sensible thing and get both.

Tacobake wrote:maybe I'll try Assault Kommandos instead of Widow Makers. Or maybe I'll do the sensible thing and get both.

Or all of it in my 750 list
eIrusk-
5x MoW ST
Drakun w/dismount
IFP+UA+2add
2x mortars
widowmakers
Kommandos + 2 additional
5x Uhlans
Ayanna&Holt
750 pts without a single jack

nice.

ya i only lost with it once against a menoth player, won every other game wiht it

On a side note, I've been away from WM/H for a while, what are Ayanna & Holt good for and what factions do they work for?

I have not been on dakkadakka for a while, but I came on and saw this and had to reply. I play cryx, no bile, no bane knights. I love my pirates (1 or 2 units) with rengrave, denny, couple pistol wraiths, machine wraith, skarlock and arc nodes, and fill in the rest(stalker, gundrun, bloat, boomhowler, mech thralls but no biles or banes as I do not even own them). I wanted to try to avoid the norm. I mainly play for fun, but I entered 1 tourny once and won. Stalker was MVP

I know what most people say about machine wraiths, but I can start controlling the movement of a 100+ point jack with a 21 point model it is all good. Also my opponents HATE the pirates as the just keep coming back. I also think the combine is just going to make them so much better. Cannot wait. Plus the undead pirate models are great, so are the ogrun boarding party which is what I will probably get next. Pirate monkeys!!! I love it.

I second magine's sentiment's although I play a bit different. I mix up my lists for variety but Renfield and the pirates are extremely useful; they can either act as a very durable speed bump or with the death blow they can put major hurt on even a heavy Khador jack. The Black Ogrun can also unload major damage although even with their high wounds they don't seem to last long if an opponent focuses on them.

If NoisyMarine doesn't want to take the 'lazy' way out, it still doesn't mean completely avoiding the infamous units. I occasionally use biles, but I don't take a huge unit, run them forward, and then pop them all to win games. Take a small unit, use buffs to get some shooting out of them, and use them as a screen for the unit you're really using for the task. I have one 8-strong Bane Knight unit. I don't use them in every game, and my opponents don't hate them any more than the rest of my units.

A typical list core for me would be either 1) Asphyxious with a unit of 8 Knights, a couple arc nodes, skarlock, 2 pistol wraiths, and then whatever strikes me or 2) Terminus with full pirates and Renfield, Seether, and the units above.

I have never been successful with getting the machine wraith to actually get a jack to work for me, but on the other hand my opponents waste so much time and energy trying to counter/expel/kill it that the end result is just as productive, so I can't complain.