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Okay, here's my take on an Eldar army. I have enough models available to make a decent start at this army (30 odd guardians) so I decided not to go full mech as seems to be in vogue with most eldar players these days.

HQ
Eldrad-210
Avatar-155

The standard one-two punch. Good with guardians as they now don't run, have a little counter-assault and benefit from doom/guide/fortune.

TROOPS
4x10 Guardians- bright lances 4x 110
sit in cover and shoot- mid/late game make a move with eldrad and avatar for the objective.
1x10 Pathfinders- 240
10 rending anti-TMC/whatever shots. 10 so that they don't run when taking casualties and can sit in the deployment zone should Eldrad et al decide to move off and do something else.

FAST ATTACK
10 Warp Spiders- 220
fast movers/anti-horde and light vehicle. doom/guide this unit and stuff start disappearing quickly. I probably need withdraw on this unit so will play test.

HEAVY SUPPORT
3x Fire Prisms- holofields, spirit stones 3x160

1745 Points- 61 infantry models, 1 Monstrous Creature, 3 skimmers.

Options that seems pretty easy to do without majore reworkings of the list: drop a Prism- take a wraithlord w/ EML/BL for more countercharge. Split pathfinders into two units: weaker individually but a) more scoring and b) more targets - same goes for warp spiders.

A Warp Spider Exarch is always a good idea. His shooting is more cost-effective than a normal Spider. Also, 10-person Spider squads are unwieldy, at least in my experience.

No reason to have a 10-man Pathfinder squad. Split them.

Hmmm you'll want vectored engines in 5th, fyi.

I'd also change those bright lances to scatter lasers...
You have enough anti-tank firepower in 3 prisms. Honest!
You don't have much anti-infantry firepower except at 12" when it's already too late really.

Warp Spiders aren't bad, but light anti-vehicle (in 5th edition) they are not.

Problem with doom is if you are within 18" with Eldrad, either he's a unit (in 5th) and will get shot dead or your guardians are too far forward.

Run vypers. Alot of people pooh pooh it, but mass vypers in 5th is a son of a bitch. Personally I'd lose Eldrad myself, or at least add a unit of harlies to protect him--the Avatar can't protect him, not even fortuned. Not in 5th.

Agreed on the scatters, now that you mention it.

What's so good about Vypers in 5th?

vehicles do not die....even open topped. not if they are eldar.

vehicles do not die....even open topped. not if they are eldar.

Why are warp spiders less efficacious in V5 against light vehicles?

He's talking about the fact that glancing hits have zero chance of destroying a vehicle outright short of immobilizing it which is a good point that I'd forgotten about.

Vectored engines on the Prisms is a good idea and one I'd considered but it is basically 60 points that I thought would better go towards more troops same with the exarch thing.

I played around with it and tweaked a little- it changes the feel of the list substantially but it is still basically a backfield list that sits and shoots.

Avatar 155
Farseer- fortune, runes of warding 100

6 Harlies- kisses, shadowseer 162

10 Guardians- scatter lasers 95
10 Guardians- scatter lasers 95
6 Pathfinders- 144
5 Pathfinders- 120

2 Vypers- scatter laser 110
2 Vypers- scatter laser 110
2 Vypers- scatter laser 110

Fire Prism- vectored/holo/stones 180
Fire Prism- vectored/holo/stones 180
Fire Prism- vectored/holo/stones 180

Dropped Eldrad, gained a small counter-charge squad and it's absolutely murder on hordes. Weaknesses - massed AV12+ among other things. comments?

Has anyone tried using Fire Prisms in 5th yet (PDF or otherwise)?

Blast weapons all roll a scatter die. If they scatter, roll 2d6 - BS for distance. I'm skeptical Fire Prisms will be very effective anti amor units. And if they are not effective, you really don't have much to counter armor 13+.

Interesting list. Lots of skimmers all around and curious to see just how durable they are. In my own games, my Vypers have been a bit more survivable. Curious to see how 6 fare.

Well glancing hits can kill vehicles, by rolling lots of 5 and 6. However Warp Spiders need a 6 because they are AP - weapons...so they're really not going to attrition much away.

The reason VE are needed is when you get immobilized so you don't just blow up.

Your fire prisms are great units, definitely worth saving but odds are the weapons will be stripped off and then you'll have fancy tank shockers. Just setting expectations so you aren't disappointed.

Vypers, while good, are more likely to blow up.

Mass AV12 is only other Eldar, and with multiple prisms and lots of S6 weapons you can focus fire into one vehicle at a time while keeping the rest stunned...and if you roll a 6, you'll shoot 'em outta the sky (or at least immobilize 'em).

Your revised list looks good, but I have two criticisms.

1. More Guardians, less Pathfinders is better IMO. Pathfinders are hard to shift, but they also blow for going after anything afield. More Guardians are a god buy, whether at the expense of less Pathfinders, less Vypers, or both. You need bodies to hold objectives, and resiliency.

2. I still think Eldrad is worth more than the Farseer that you have now plus one squadron of Vypers. I'd put him in there instead, but YMMV.

Looking at it further- I just don't like Guardians. They need a TON of support for them to be anywhere near halfway effective and it really isn't something I want to invest the points in. Honestly, why do I want to take 40 guardians only to have to spend another 365 points in HQs (eldrad + avatar) and 162 points in Harlequins to make sure that they A) don't run off, B) actually kill something when they shoot, and C) don't get run over by assault squads?

Now, we're not exactly spoiled for great troop choices in the Eldar codex, and with the recent confirmation that jetbikes are indeed scoring, I believe I can add them back in to better compliment the list. I do of course understand that this negate the original thread title because it's no longer a firebase with mobile elements but more a shooty vp denial list- but here goes anyway.

There's two versions to the list. one is more "serious," the other one is a little more "fun" whatever that means. Would like comments on both. Note: probably neither are very efficient.

Version A- "for serious"

Farseer- fortune, guide, spirit stones, jetbike, spear 158
Farseer- fortune, guide, spirit stones, jetbike, spear 158

6 Jetbikes- 2xshuriken cannon + warlock w/embolden, spear 205
6 Jetbikes- 2xshuriken cannon + warlock w/destructor, spear 110
3 Jetbikes- shuriken cannon + warlock w/destructor, spear 134

2 Vypers- scatter lasers 110
2 Vypers- scatter lasers 110
2 Vypers- scatter lasers 110

Fire Prism- holo/spirit/vectored 180
Fire Prism- holo/spirit/vectored 180
Fire Prism- holo/spirit/vectored 180

basic idea- run the entire army as basically a big fast moving block- Fire Prisms get fortuned, vypers get guided. The end.

List 2: "the fun one that gets invited to parties"
Fuegan-205
Maugan Ra- 195

3 Wraithguard- spiritseer w/conceal 151
Wave Serpent- scatter lasers, spirit stone 125

3 Jetbikes- shuriken cannon, warlock w/embolden singing spear 129
3 Jetbikes- shuriken cannon, warlock w/desturctor singing spear 134

2 Vypers- scatter laser 110
2 Vypers- scatter laser 110
2 Vypers- scatter laser 110

Fire Prism- holo/spirit 160
Fire Prism- holo/spirit 160
Fire Prism- holo/spirit 160

Eggs and a single basket meet. Eggs proceed to all jump in said single basket. Everything basically is the same except for a giant target flying down the field with 3 wraithguard a warlock and 2 PLs inside. The good is that the PLs actually have an invulnerable save and if they jump out of their own free will, it's a pretty deadly anti-tank unit (that's more expensive than any tank in the game). if they should (miracle of miracles) actually surivive to charge something- well, it gets nasty. The good part is that the jetbikes, vypers and Prisms will probably not be shot at for a turn while all this happens.

Looking at it further- I just don't like Guardians. They need a TON of support for them to be anywhere near halfway effective and it really isn't something I want to invest the points in. Honestly, why do I want to take 40 guardians only to have to spend another 365 points in HQs (eldrad + avatar) and 162 points in Harlequins to make sure that they A) don't run off, B) actually kill something when they shoot, and C) don't get run over by assault squads?

Maybe because those 365 + 162 points are effective in themselves? Eldravatar isn't exactly a ROVOD Lord.

Now, we're not exactly spoiled for great troop choices in the Eldar codex

We pretty much are relative to most codices. Even granting that Guardians and DAs are merely mediocre-to-okay, jetbikes and Pathfinders are both good. Two good Troops choices is more than DE, Orks, Necrons or vanilla SMs get.

On to the lists.

List 1

One Farseer needs RoWard.

Why Embolden in one squad? It's not like you can usually choose which one gets shot up.

List 2

Spiritseer--why? Concel on a 3-WG squad--why?

Won't say more because it's basically a joke list. If fun is handing your opponent a victory on turn 1, sure, it's fun.

Runes of warding- granted forgot about that. Embolden for so that the fasrseers can join and reroll PoTW.

Conceal on the WriathGuard to give Fuegan and Maugan Ra an invulnerable save. I understand that it isnt' exactly effective, but *Shrug* I was an exercise in seeing how to deliver two PL's into combat as quickly as possible...

And in regards to troop choices. A shoota boy mob, a 100 point 2 DL warrior squad, las/plas marine squads and (to a lesser extent) Necron warriors are all so much better buys in the context of the armies they support that it isn't even funny.

Maybe I'm just being a moron but can you tell me what Eldar troop choices bring to the table in Eldar armies besides relatively expensive bullet catchers/objective takers?

Okay, I thought of one thing- rending shots from (expensive) pathfinders.

Right, Embolden does makes sense. I forgot about that aspect.

Why not just put them in Falcons? Or would that be too cheesy for a fun list?

Never claimed Eldar Troops were better than others, just that our variety of usable options is. We have two obviously superior ones and two decent ones. Orks have to use Boyz, Marines have to use Tacs, etc.

Just to clarify one question about vypers earlier in this thread:

Vypers are going to kick ass in 5th edition because they get to slam into tanks with new Ram Value rules. 45 point kamakazi sounds awesome. Or, even a 65 kamakazi that waits to strike until he is no longer shoooting-effective