Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Never played WFB but the 40K demon listmyight be an intro into that arena (if I could just find players of course-now there's a challenge)

If one is building a 40K demon list, how much effort would be required to make that a WFB list for standard sized games? Additionally, would there be significant differences in types of units I'd have to have? Lets say 2,000 points fo 40K demon love- how would that compare to an WFB list?

You should buy the book. Preferably from an FLGS, of course.

The characters/greater daemons cost considerably more in Warhammer, so that may reduce your army size a bit. The whole army works differently (starting on the table, for one thing) in Warhammer, so direct comparisons are tricky.

You may want to check out the Mustering Field forum on TWF. Lots of folks have been doing Daemon lists lately for WH.

http://warhammer.org.uk/PhP/viewforum.php?f=5

You would have to mount your Daemons on square bases of course. However I doubt many people would object to you using square based models in 40k anyway, so they should be useable in both games.

If they are already on round bases, here are your options:

1) Blue tack them onto your movement trays. If you're careful, you can glue flock between the gaps, and your tray will look fine.

2) Order the awesome GF9 movement trays that fit round bases.

Units like Greater Daemons and Juggs/Fiends/Beasts/Screamers will be an issue. If your opponent doesn't mind, just keep them on their round bases and know how wide they are supposed to be.

Good gaming!

You can make some of the round bases fit inside square bases with some creative modelling. You place the round one on the square one, then trace the line, then cut plasticard to make the square one as tall as the round one on the square one and base it to your liking.

But it doesn't work with all round sizes, particularly the big greater daemon bases.

Is square basing (particularly for the bigger boys) a real issue in WFB? The troops can use these options and trays, but the big boys might be more of an issue.

I'm just thinking this might be a way to field a WFB entry but am not into a great expense if thats required to really do this.

ClarenceL wrote:

Units like Greater Daemons and Juggs/Fiends/Beasts/Screamers will be an issue. If your opponent doesn't mind, just keep them on their round bases and know how wide they are supposed to be.

Units like that are easy. Just cut out some appropriately sized cardboard and blu-tac them to that

Good idea.

jfrazell wrote:Is square basing (particularly for the bigger boys) a real issue in WFB? The troops can use these options and trays, but the big boys might be more of an issue.

I'm just thinking this might be a way to field a WFB entry but am not into a great expense if thats required to really do this.

It's a HUGE issue. Los is determined by your base. You can not use round bases in fantasy.

I don't know if the square equivalents in WFB are bigger than the round ones in 40k. Hopefully they are, since blue tacking round over square would be an awesome solution.

What one of my friends is doing is using magnets on the bottom of the round MCs bases and magnets on the tops of the Square bases. He just came across a lot of those little bone bitz from the ghouls packs so he's going to make it appear as if his MC demons are standing on huge mounds of bones. Easily removable to play 40k and vice versa.

As most people have said the square base thing can ( will) be an issue but some blue tac/magnets will fix it pretty easy.

One thing to Note though. In 40k your average 1500 point army will be something like this ( rough guess , general decent list)

Keeper of Secrets (insert other Greater Daemon)
Hearld of Tzeentch on disc
Hearld of Tzeentch on disc

12 daemonettes + icon
12 daemonettes + icon
6 daemonettes
7 Plaguebearers + icon
7 Plaguebearers + icon

5 screamers
5 screamers
5 screamers

1 Daemon Prince
maybe a soulgrinder

In fantasy at 2000 points the same models will look more like this

Keeper of secrets ( sitting at around 650 points)
Hearld of Tzeentch with disc ( sitting around 150ish)
Hearld of Tzeentch with disc ( sitting around 150ish)

15 daemonettes with standard and champ + daemon icon
15 daemonettes with standard and champ + daemon icon
14 plaguebears with standard and champ + daemon icon

6 Screamers
6 screamers

This leaves the Daemon prince, a couple screamers, and the soulgrinder sitting out ( nothing big really since the Daemon prince can be used instead of the Keeper)
That list is sitting around 2000 points. The real issue is the Hearlds are out in the open with no units to hide in, The 3 core units really should all be 20 to 25 strong ( ie need to buy 10 more daemonettes and 6 plaguebearers) and while the screamers are really kinda nice in 40k they are only decent in fantasy. The 3 core units could also use a Herald of there own god since they pick up bonus goodies for haveing them.
The Plaguebearers would get regen, and the daemonettes would get always strike first. Basicly what im saying is you will have to pick up some extra models to play fantasy since units are bigger and points are cheaper, your average lesser daemon losses 5 points each going from 40k to fantasy, but the support daemons ( screamers, nurglings, seekers, ect) all almost double in points.

What it looks like you're saying is that the different units have different capabilities between the two (WFB vs. 40K). I have a decent variety so that is ok. For example I have 44 BLetter's done, and am working on 20 demonettes with a thought for 20 more so big troop squads should not be an issue.

Thats actually positive news.

You can totally make a good list in WHFB.

There are 'round to square' bases you can buy off the 'net.

thanks all-very helpful.

John;

Check out http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/HOUSTON_WFB_LEAGUE/

Pretty much the group of WFB players.

Also http://www.houston77th.com/77Contents.html

That's those guys with their own 'clubhouse'.

Thanks Groggy

keep the round bases and build a 'frontage template' to place under trhe front ranks of your unit. This will determine your actual game frontage. If flank charged or shot by cannon in the flank calculate the actual basing of the unit with another smaller template (which could be as little as some measuring rods cut to size.

All in all its easier to play 40K with square bases than warhammer fantasy with round. rebasing is probably your best option.

Either buy the GF9 trays with round holes, or rebase the models. Anything else is not going to work in fantasy and is only going to result in argument.

Orlanth wrote:keep the round bases and build a 'frontage template' to place under trhe front ranks of your unit. This will determine your actual game frontage. If flank charged or shot by cannon in the flank calculate the actual basing of the unit with another smaller template (which could be as little as some measuring rods cut to size.

All in all its easier to play 40K with square bases than warhammer fantasy with round. rebasing is probably your best option.

Yah, I really would not have a problem with someone playing 40k with square bases. Fantasy is a different matter entirely though, because, as mentioned earlier, it determines your LOS. If you want to shoot, for instance, you'll only be able to shoot at things in the unit's front arc.

With some variance would you say a competitive 40K list is moderatly competitive in WFB (or only needs moderate tweeking)?

Probably not. But it won't need a zillion more models either.

The Maulniac answers the real question yet again.

Grignard wrote:

Orlanth wrote:keep the round bases and build a 'frontage template' to place under trhe front ranks of your unit. This will determine your actual game frontage. If flank charged or shot by cannon in the flank calculate the actual basing of the unit with another smaller template (which could be as little as some measuring rods cut to size.

All in all its easier to play 40K with square bases than warhammer fantasy with round. rebasing is probably your best option.

Yah, I really would not have a problem with someone playing 40k with square bases. Fantasy is a different matter entirely though, because, as mentioned earlier, it determines your LOS. If you want to shoot, for instance, you'll only be able to shoot at things in the unit's front arc.

thanks for pointing that out, that was very helpful.

Movement trays really aren't that hard to make for round bases.

Get some plywood or mdf. You generally need 5 1/2"x4 1/2" rectangles.
You need a drillpress (preferred) or regular powerdrill.
1 26mm spade bit.
Accurate measuring instrument (steel rules are good).

You need two layers. The top layer has holes in it for the bases to fit into. The bottom layer is there to stop the bases falling all the way through.

I've done it before. It does take a bit of time, but it's generally used by 40k tournament players here for making a display board for their army (at tournaments), but the principle for a movement tray is the same, only they're a little smaller.

GF9 trays are $10 well spent.

I will also put my hat in for the GF9 trays. they are fairly innexpensive and keep your models lined up perfectly.

Plus, after trying to make my own with all sorts of materials, I found that I couldn't make the tray for much less than one already made and at that point, it was better to purchase them than try to make them on my own.

If I had a choice between ready made trays and having to DIY, I'd get the pre-mades.

If I needed a custom one (like for a display base for my army), then I'd do it myself.

I've not seen the GF9 trays, but if they do the job, then go for them.