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Made in gb
Been Around the Block




Hi folks,

I know a lot of you are hardcore tourney players, and was wondering if you can help me sirty up my Daemons for a 2250 tourney in 4 weeks, please?
No Special dudes allowed (Or I'd obviously take Fateweaver and Blue Scribes for uber bentness).

1 Herald
Master of Sorcery
Flames of Tzeench
Chariot of Tzeench 225

Will likely take Beasts to slow down enemy cavalry and dragons. Obviously he can choose whatever BRB lore he likes.
Also adds drive by dakka.

1 Herald
Spell Breaker
Flames of Tzeench
Chariot of Tzeench 225

Magic Defence guy.


1 Herald
Master of Sorcery
Flames of Tzeench
Chariot of Tzeench
BSB
Great Banner of Sundering 300

Some magic defence with the Banner.

1 Herald
Spell Breaker
Flames of Tzeench
Chariot of Tzeench 225

Another scroll dude.

Plan with these 4 is that they use their 20" fly to stay out of charge arc of hard units and unleash 4D6 shots per turn hitting on 4+/5+ as well as launching 2 x D6+1 x S D6+1 shots as well as 2 other spells such as Wolf Hunts, Beast Cowers, etc.
Burning Head gets quite fruity on a 20" movement model.

5 Furies 60

5 Furies 60

5 Furies 60

General march blocking and annoyance. May even charge soft targets (Such as arthritic one legged Gnoblars on their own, or suicide charge wizards in non ASF units to wound or kill them).


5 Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer
Siren Standard 157

5 Seekers of Slaanesh
Standard Bearer
Siren Standard 157

Saucy ladies. Their role is to murder gunlines and enemy fast cav on turn 2. Can also combo with Wolf Hunts off the 2 Sorcery Master Heralds.
Even if march blocked their 10" movement means they can dance from the enemy all day.
A lot harder to catch than the slower and non-fast cav Flesh Hounds.
Also cheap enough to throw at units to kill wizards in the front rank.
If they get the flank against soft stuff, they can likely win combat.


10 Horrors 120

10 Horrors 120

10 Horrors 120

The slow part of the list. At least they give me 3 dispel dice and 3 semi threatening fireballs per turn. They also make surprisingly good road blocks vs units that lack heavy static CR (Which should be march blocked to heck anyway).

6 Flamers 210

6 Flamers 210

Maybe they don't synergise well with the list, but can hopefully avoid slow stuff with their M6 skirmishing, as well as blasting slow stuff before it gets there. With 2 S5 attacks each they can likely handle any fast units that get to them.

71 models.
19 Flyers
10 Movement 10 fast cav
12 M6 skirmishers
30 M4 fodder core units

13 power dice, 9 dispel dice, 2 scrolls.
That's 5 Flickering Fires per turn + 2 other fruity spells such as Wolf Hunts.
(These longer range spells come from my General and BSB Heralds, worth more vp).

I am now lacking in high strength high WS attacks, but I've already beaten double Stanks and Waltar, even with my slow hounds, and I am hoping that this faster list will be even better at evading slow tanks.
(Won by approx 700vp as I killed all but the Stanks, 1 Flagellant and 5 Knights. I lost some stuff to cannons sadly).

I see the main threats as being gunlines, heavy magic and knights.
Gunlines I am hoping the Seekers can deal with, as well as 4 helluva fast flying chariots.
Heavy magic should be handled by -2 to casting a lore, as well as 2 scrolls and 9 dispel dice.
Knights I hope I can delay with Furies, before breaking through a flank and ending up behind them, unleashing havoc. Beast Cowers on the right unit can stop their whole army from getting any closer, hopefully.
Slaanesh has me worried. A Siren or 2 could mess me up big time...

So, seems quite nifty to me.

Had 3 games so far around this theme. No Seekers in those 3 games.

1) BT general, 3 chariot heralds and no dogs. Was against a mirror army. Went quite well as I massacred him, but I dislike having 550 points in one easily cannonable place.
I was also disappointed that it took the BT 3 turns to chew through 10 Horrors he'd flanked, and that was with 6 Flamers helping out in the 3rd round.

2) Swapped the BT out for a 4th Herald and 2 units of 5 Flesh Hounds. Played against Empire with 2 cannons, Helstorm and Waltar. And some infantry stuff. Got a draw as I made a cock up and my General died turn 2. Also lost another herald as I went for a daring chariot charge and got my herald killed by 2 spearmen.
I didn't nail his Waltar.

3) Played vs 2 Stanks, Waltar and cannon, plus 2 x 5 Outriders, 2 Wizards, Priest, 6 Knights, 5 Knights, 5 Pistoliers, 15 Flagellants + 10 X-bows.
Won by 700 odd as I wiped him out apart from 2 Stanks, 1 Flagellant and 5 Knights.
I lost a lot to cannon + Stanks (1 Herald, 1 Chariot, 2.5 Horror units, 3 Flamers).

So, I'm losing the Flesh Hounds' hittiness, but gaining greater mobility and 2 more units that can charge 20" in a turn.

So, filth or garbage?


Cheers,

Gazzor

   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut




I am certianly no hard core fantasy player. (I bearly know the game) but arn't your heralds a bit exposed with no chariots just standing around on thier own? Or do they go with the horrors?
   
Made in us
Elusive Dryad




I think that the ladies are on the soft side of what you're trying to use them for. I'd give them one charge against a dwarf gunline before they're made combat ineffective. Empire's a different story, as those units tend to be squishy. I agree about the GD being too big of a target, and flying firebolting chariots are great amounts of fun.
All the best,
ED
   
Made in fi
Jervis Johnson






I'm not so sure about this list. Greater Daemons are all very very good for their price and I wouldn't play a game without one. I'd much rather also go with Flesh Hounds instead of the Seekers, and I haven't yet made up my mind about the chariots. I give all my Tz Heralds wings so that they can be deployed inside units in the early parts of the game, and then move out at the right time. The chariots aren't expensive though, so I don't exactly dislike them, but I do see Flames of Tzeentch on Heralds a little on the expensive side. To me this list seems like a watered down version of the previous SoC army. Everything is shooting, except there's only one 'Flamer gunner' riding each chariot, and there are no Changebringers and no Lord of Change.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/06/02 17:03:13


 
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




Thanks for the replies guys.

Russell, they do have chariots. Super 2+ anti shooting ward. Nice. And the 5+ armour save may even come in handy.

Etherdude. Agreed on the squishy Seekers. Hence my changes below.

Therion, I'ce taken on board some of your points, hence the list below. Also, I like the chariots. Was playing vs Skaven. Charged 5 hounds in the front of 25 clan rats.
He wasn't worried until I then declared a flank charge with a flying chariot for a +4CR swing, plus any due to impact hits. I was then set to roll up his lines with the hounds and the chariot (Which would realign to pursue in the same direction as the hounds). He conceded at that point.

I am hoping that 3 flying rank breakers allied with 4 fast units, 2 of which hit very hard, will make this a very combaty army vs soft troops, whilct being fast enough to avoid nasty hard stuff.

1 Tzeench Herald
Master of Sorcery
Spell Breaker
Chariot of Tzeench 225

1 Tzeench Herald
Master of Sorcery
Spell Breaker
Chariot of Tzeench 225


1 Tzeench Herald
Battle Standard
Spell Breaker
Chariot of Tzeench 225


5 Furies 60

5 Furies 60

5 Flesh Hounds 175

5 Flesh Hounds 175

5 Seekers
Standard
Siren Banner 157

5 Seekers
Standard
Siren Banner 157


10 Horrors 120

10 Horrors 120

10 Horrors 120

6 Flamers 210

6 Flamers 210

   
Made in fi
Jervis Johnson






Super 2+ anti shooting ward

What do you mean by this exactly?

The new list looks quite good. It has a lot of small units and multiple threats to enemies. How do you plan to kill Bloodthirsters and Star Dragons though? All I can think of is receive a charge against the Flesh Hounds, pass some ward saves, roll small for instability and then flank on both sides with more Hounds and Seekers and hope for the best.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/06/06 03:34:02


 
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




Super 2+ anti shooting ward


The fact the Herald is hit 1 in 6 times by any shooting, whilst the rest go on the chariot.
Admittedly the chariot may not stay around, but better losing 60 points and fly than a character and some major magic.

Fair point on the BT and Dragon, etc.

One idea I'm considering is getting Hounds into the rear arc and then Wolf Hunting them in. Dogs are winning by 3 before their 8 S5 attacks or the BTs 7 rerollable S6/7 attacks. Would be tight, that's for sure.

Or take Lore of Light and cast Cleansing Flares with it in 12" range. It doesn't get it's MR against that does it?

Not sure about taking my own muntering big guy. I know for a fact that at the tourney in 4 weeks there will be CD with 2 Earth Shakers and 6-8 spear chukkas. Not friendly ground for a big guy.

What would you suggest?

Lots of nice options with the variety of spells at least. Should be a refreshing change to my magic heavy bunker VC.


Cheers,

Gazzor

   
 
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