Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So what does everyone think about Raveners for v5 rules.
What I mean is... At 44pts. (extra talons, spinefist) I belive that this is a great unit (4 would be enough).
v5 seems to be mostly about capturing objectives and contesting them. Raveners have speed, deep striking ability, and LD 10.
Not bad when you have to take an objective while the rest of your swarm is hitting the line somewhere else. Sure they are not super durable. However, with the new cover save rules, they might hold up a bit longer. More of a thorn in your opponets side rather than a game wining unit. What do you think?
Am I the only one who just isn't excited about genestealers anymore. With the rending nerf, they just don't seem to have the bite they once had. Don't get me wrong they might still have their place... but just not as dangerous as they used to be, eh... I hate to say that I might not bring them anymore (I'll have to play test to see). What do you think?

raveners are definately more a thorn in an opponents side. they can only contest objectives, not capture them. they will get shot more with the new true LoS rules, even if they will get a cover save. deepstrike is a little more risky with all terrain counting as dangerous and the mishap table. theyre useful, but not fantastic.

standard genestealer tactics will have to changeto make the most of them. you will have to pick and choose your targets more carfully now, rather than just running them at eveything. you also have to take their placement into account now that al of the enemies guns will be able to shoot you most of the time. on the other hand with the changes to prefered enemy, the rending nerf is almost canceled out for genestealers with feeder tendrils, and with the changes to scouts they become a much bigger threat to armies that would have shot them off the board before.

all in all genestealers are still pretty good, you just have to think a bit harder about how you play with them now, and that isnt a bad thing.

More of a thorn in your opponets side rather than a game wining unit. What do you think?

Scuttling stealers are a thorn in the opponets side via flanking. Gaunts screening the good stuff again is a thorn in the opponents side.

Ravenors just don't mesh well with the 5ed rules. They lose from the rending change more then most, as they are bound to outrun feeder tendril support. They don't gain much from the new assault rules, as a group of em will wipe out opponnets and are too vulnerable to shooting and a single one will get swamped via charge reaction instead of wiping the killzone and staying in combat another turn.

Only thing of interest to me is the 6 point deathspitter, althouh I think it probably isn't worth using in the end.

Am I the only one who just isn't excited about genestealers anymore. With the rending nerf, they just don't seem to have the bite they once had. Don't get me wrong they might still have their place... but just not as dangerous as they used to be, eh... I hate to say that I might not bring them anymore (I'll have to play test to see). What do you think?

Give genestealers the 1 point feeder tendrils. That gives them a reroll on missed hits. That gets them back up to their original MEq killing stats. That also grants unist with models within 2" the same ability. So that unit of guants or rippers that are screening your stealers are boosted. The new leaping warriors you'll consider taking again could also benefit. I think you'd be crazy to shelve the stealers personally.

Or give the Feeder tendrils to the Broodlord, and acid maw the the Genestealers. reroll to hit and wound, with rend.

You don't send Raveners off by themselves anymore.

That kind of stupidity is done with.

What you do do, is send them off as a pack on a flank...or toss them at the enemy when your other units do.

They are good in certain army builds. When you want a large charge range to keep people from setting up on your CC fexes, for example...raveners do well.

Toss in some leaping rippers to hold the enemy and you can hold the enemy on the next turn with a ravener charge, then break them with a fex rush.

In objectives missions with Raveners you can deepstrike them into the action near objectives and charge that unit which would shoot up your stealers after the stealers win combat on another unit.

One problem CC armies will have in 5th is the loss of consolidating into other units, fast Raveners can help by tying up nearby units to support your main CC rush.

I still like stealers in 5th, they are troops and they fight effectively in CC.

Posted in wrong thread, sorry.

And now for my actual post...

Gaunts can screen and feeder tendrils give a reroll to hit, making ‘stealers an excellent troop in 5th.

Raveners are a tougher case. Spinefists look like a bargain, but using them just once means you’re dooming the ravener to the inevitable return fire – better to keep the out of LOS or charging into combat, same as always. The only time I considered using them was when I knew I was within 18” and didn’t need to fleet before assaulting, but that just didn’t come up that often.

Raveners aren’t that effective on their own, as they’re bound to be brought down by countercharge, but single raveners were never that effective in fourth ed – they couldn’t reliably beat many opponents, and hormagaunts were a much better choice to tie an enemy unit up for a turn as their greater wounds made it much more likely they’d stick around for a turn.

But single raveners were and still are excellent support units. Unless you’ve got the dollars and patience to buy and assemble gargoyles, or a wild hope that flying warriors will become much, much cheaper, then it’s likely you’ll have three spare FA slots. Three separate raveners can work together to beat most line units – expect to see lots of five man tactical units, and expect to see raveners beat them decisively. Meanwhile they’re three separate units that have to be shot at separately, and are free to separate to support different assaults made by other units.

Losing the ability to control objectives hurts raveners, but probably ensures they’ll be played in a way that fits their fluff, so it probably isn’t such a bad thing.