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In testing out the 5th edition rules we were playing a series of 500pt. battles on a 4'x4' table and one of the games featured the Annihilation Mission with the Dawn of War deplyoment. 500 pts of Orks vs 500 pts SM. Orks deployed first just about in the middle of the board, as forward as possible, one units of 20 some Shootas in some ruins and 20 some Sluggas along with the Warboss and PK Nob just to the right of them.

Facing them somewhat centered near the back of the marine deployment zone about 19" away, was a squad of 6 Marines with a plasma cannon and a plasma gun and a Vet Sgt with BP/PW. They were joined by a Captain with a Storm Boleter/PF. Off to the left side and deployed in the ruins of another building were a squad 5 scouts with 4 snipers and a heavy bolter. The marines had another tac squad with flamer deployed in a rhino in reserve and the Orks had a group of 6 Stormboys with a PK Nob.

On the first turn all the Orks surged forward, running at top speed as the marines blazed away at them. Unfortunately for the Marine Player his shooting was sub-par and his reserves did not come on in either the 2nd or 3rd turn and as the marines failed to do enough damage the Orks promptly wiped both the 1st marine squad and the scouts from existence. As the Orks started to mill around the back edge of the marine deployment zone and with the battle for all practical intents and purposes being over at that point, the question arose as to whether the game was over from an official standpoint at that time? If the starting force in an annihilation mission is wiped out before any reserves can deploy, do you continue to have the the reserves roll to still deploy? If so, what if the force controlling the field just continues to move, perhaps spacing out troops to limit the deployment zone of his foe to an impractically small area? Does the game continue until the end is triggered by random turn termination or at the point that deployment becomes impossible?

Obviously this would not often occur but we were not sure what to do if it does. Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

Reserve rolls continue, bear in mind that Reserves will automatically come in at a certain point. Now if you manage to completely block his table edge, he's screwed.........

I'd say [that if these] two conditions [exist, it]would terminate a game early.

1. No more troops are on the board.

2. The opposing player can no longer legally deploy reserves onto the board.

That would be rare to have that happen, but if it did, what can the other player do? You could play out the turns, but why bother?

Edited because my hands didn't type all the words my brain wanted them to type.

Valhallan42nd wrote:I'd say two conditions would terminate a game early.

1. No more troops are on the board.

Why exactly?

There are no rules stating that if you wipe out what is currently on the table you win the game. Units in reserve are still in reserve and will arrive as normal. You don't start a game against a Drop Pod/Daemon army and tell them: "you lose because none of your models are on the table".

If you are talking about "troops" as in "troops choices" remember that any unit can still contest an objective (which means as long as you've got any models in your army you can play for the draw) *and* that if you completely wipe out the enemy force you win the game.



On another random note: In all the standard missions (including dawn of war) you can always choose to keep your entire force in reserve. Take that Daemon players!

I think Valhallan was stating that both conditions would need to be true. There is no rule stating that even if such a result was achieved the game would end, but it could be difficult to continue, but that would need to be worked out with your opponent.

I'm sorry, I was not clear. I was saying that if BOTH conditions exist, then the game should end.

Valhallan42nd wrote:I'm sorry, I was not clear. I was saying that if BOTH conditions exist, then the game should end.

By "troops" do you mean FOrce Org selection Troop or do you mean any unit regardless of Force org selection? If the first, Yak's point still stands, you can play for the draw by contesting or even a win by wiping out your opponent.

What I mean is small "t" troops, not Troop selections. Perhaps it's better to say if you have no units on the board.

Pragmaticly, if one has nothing on the board, and nothing can come onto the board, well, then the games over for all pratical purposes, so it's time to get a lunch break/dinner break/beer.

In our situation there were enough Orks left to pretty much seal off the board edge and we determined with a combination of Stromboyz coming on board and with the Boyz running, they could probably make it. Rather then play it out we decided to end the game at that point. I think such situations would indeed be rare and if any of the reserves could deep strike it would be relatively impossible to stop the reserves coming on. It was just a combination of good luck on the Orks part and bad luck on the Marines. Ultimately we played 4 - 500 point games that day and they were all very competitive except that one. And that even game potentially turned on his snipers having a chance to pin the reduced mob that was advancing on his Marines in the center and then failing to do so, ensuring the Marine collapse.

I appreciate the comments and guidance provided, Thank you all.

Hialmar wrote:In testing out the 5th edition rules we were playing a series of 500pt. battles on a 4'x4' table and one of the games featured the Annihilation Mission with the Dawn of War deplyoment. 500 pts of Orks vs 500 pts SM. Orks deployed first just about in the middle of the board, as forward as possible, one units of 20 some Shootas in some ruins and 20 some Sluggas along with the Warboss and PK Nob just to the right of them.

On the first turn all the Orks surged forward, running at top speed as the marines blazed away at them. Unfortunately for the Marine Player his shooting was sub-par and his reserves did not come on in either the 2nd or 3rd turn and as the marines failed to do enough damage the Orks promptly wiped both the 1st marine squad and the scouts from existence.

You do know that in the Dawn of War deployment mission, unless you declare certain units are officially "in reserve", all other units in your army automatically arrive on turn 1 from your board edge, right?

So the Space Marine player should have gotten his entire army on turn 1 except for any units he wanted to keep in reserve (in order to deep strike or outflank, for example).

Yes we thought that was the case, and and were also trying to incorporate as many of the rules as we could in the games we played just to get the feel for them. If we had used slightly larger armies we would have had a mix of reserves as well as troops moving on in turn 1.