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I posted I 500p Eldar list a while back to get some imput before I bought something useless (thanks for the feedback btw). Now I have had a chance to play at least a little bit to see how different units perform on the field, and I have read the new rules and realised I might want a troops choice that is meant to move forward, since troops are needed to capture objectives.

So, here is a new 500p list for you to pick appart if you kan (:


HQ
Farseer with Fortune - 85p
Three Warlocks with one Enhance and one Embolden - 95p

TROOPS
5 Pathfinders - 120p

10 Guardians with a Star Cannon - 105p

10 Storm Guardians with 2 Fusion Guns - 97p

TOTAL: 497p


Does it look playable? Too small lists for any brilliant strategies, but the Seers Council and the Storm Guardians will move up, with the Council acting as the spearhead and the Guardians mopping up and capturing points. I am thinking of adding a Shining Spear for the last 3 points. However, while it is nice to have a powerfull shooting weapon in the Council, is it really worth loosing an attack in CC to get it?

And while I am writing, some general questions. In larger games, should Pathfinders be maxed out, or should they be a small squad? And what about Storm Guardians? A warlock with conceal or a transport and a warlock with enhance perhaps? Or go for a really large unit rather than a small one? Same question for the Council I guess. Max them and get a transport, or is that just overkill ànd risky?

In general, I'm not a fan of storm guardians anymore these days. However, if you are going to take them, I would suggest that you give at least one of them a flamer. It will really help thin out the ranks of the enemy before you assault. You may even want to get 2.

For the other guardian squad, you may want to swap out the star cannon for a scatter laser. If you are shooting at MEQ's with the star cannon, you kill .8 on average. If they get 4+ cover (as is often the case these days) that goes down to .41. A scatter laser will kill .55 (on average) regardless of cover. It also has a better chance of damaging light vehicles due to having twice as many shots. All this and it costs less. So, if you find that you are often shooting at MEQ's that get no cover, then stick with the star cannon. On the other hand, if you think you are more likely to go up against horde armies, marines that tend to get cover, or lots of light vehicles, then the scatter laser is the way to go.

As far as the singing spear goes, it’s kind of an all or nothing thing. You either give them to the whole squad so that they can go around shooting them, or you skip it entirely and have the squad run around focusing on getting into assault. Mixing and matching only makes is so you are kind of bad at both. If your plan is to have the seers run in front of the guardians, then stick with the witch blades. One thing you will want to do though is try to get another body into the squad. Right now, with only 4 members, its both a bit light on hand to hand punch and on cover area to hide the guardians behind. If you drop the star cannon from the guardians down to a scatter laser and then ditch embolden and/or enhance, you should have enough points for another warlock.

As for pathfinders, I find that smaller squads tend to do better than larger ones. The only difference between the two is that smaller ones take break checks more often but at the same time, allow you to cause more pin tests on the enemy. Oh yah, and they can hold more objectives if necessary.

There are several options for storm guardians. The most successful version I've seen is putting them in a transport, giving them 2 flamers and a warlocks with destructor. 3 flamer templates do a lot of damage. If you are going to try and run them up to the enemy, conceal is probably the best idea if there isn’t' going to be a screening unit running in front of them. If they do have a screening unit (seers, wraithguard, scorpions, etc.) then enhance can give them a bit of a boost in power.

With a seer council, I like to give mine fortune, doom, and enhance, keep them all with witch blades and run them towards enemy tanks and/or really tough units. There isn’t' much point in giving them a transport since they are fairly fast on their own and they are super tough. Just try to avoid getting in rapid fire range and shot with large amounts of small arms fire. I normaly run the squad as 1 farseer and 5 warlocks. It tends to be enough to get the job done, although another warlock wouldn't hurt anything.

Thanks for the input. I wanted Storm Guardians after reading the new rules, to get more troops that can hold objectives. Still not sure if it is a good idea, but I feel I need something that can move forward and capture points. In general they are going to be support for the better CC units, so they will move up behind and then jump in to boost a combat going badly or intercept any tanks or walkers. Hence no flamers. I guess I'll see if that will work or not, and then revise the plan.

As for Star Cannon/Scatter Laser... I thought the Star Cannon got 3 shots o_O

I guess thats what you get for assuming things are like the last time you played. In that case I will probably change it to the Scatter Laser and then add an aditional Storm Guardian. Of course... I will actually need to get Storm Guardians. At the GW shop I was informed they don't stock them anymore. I probably could convert them using normal guardians and my million CC-weapons from various places. Except my bitsbox got stolen ><

I would shoot for DA's in this point level. I know you can take the Guardians for only 80pts, plus the cost of the weapon plateform, but DA's in a 500pts game are pretty good.

They get a 4+save with a 18" assault 2 weapon for only 120pts at 10 men. I found that they are better for small games. The Guardians are fine, but you have to remember that they only have a 5+ save, and they are going to be using the weapon plateform alot, so they may not get a 4+ cover from other units. It's really easy to thin them out.

Since you have the 3pts left, I would give the Spear to the Farseer. He only has 1 attack on his base profile anyway, so the 1 attack lose is not as big as if it was for one of the warlocks. Plus, this will give you a little punch for tanks.

Hm, I guess DA's might be a good unit to come running with to take objectivs instead of Storm Guardians. Keep them behind the CC troops and soften things up, and then move in right at the end to claim stuff. Never thought about them as troops.

I don't see how the Farseer only having one attack has much to do with things? One lost attack is one lost attack, and he has better WS than the Warlocks so it has more impact when he looses an attack. Of course, he also hits better with the spear when throwing.

Think of it this way. Farseer gets 3 attacks on the charge in close combat. He hits on a 3+, and wounds on a 2+. They still get their save.

With the Spear he gets 2 attacks on the charge hitting on a 3+, and wounds on a 2+. They still get their save, but then a Predator rolls up, he hit's the pred on a 2+ because of his BS, and rolls S9 against the AV of the tank.

You loose an attack but gain anti-tank ability.

True, but I could just charge the predator since the whichblades strike at s9 at tanks. If I throw the spear at the tank, I can't charge anyone else after all.

I think, I have to look that up in the new rules to make sure.

I'm pretty sure the Witchblades only allow you to wound on a 2+. I dont think they get any bonus for AV.

In the new rules the user of a Witchblade counts his strength as 9 when attacking a vehicle. I only skimmed it, I can check again later, but I think the rule was pretty clear cut. I was a bit supprised too, since thats what really kills the spear for me. Can´t throw them, but still.

Anyway, I think I might try changing the Storm Guardians for Dire Avengers. They can move up with the Council and use their firepower to soften things up, and then capture objectives. Or so I hope. Still unsure about what to do with the exarch. If bladestorm is worth it, and if I should take defend (seems kind of likly they will be hit by stuff like assault marines). At least it saves me from having to buy Storm Guardians, since they don't have them in stock at the store here anymore ^^

Silverwarrior88 wrote:I'm pretty sure the Witchblades only allow you to wound on a 2+. I dont think they get any bonus for AV.

Witch blades have been strength 9 against vehicles since the 3rd edition codex (well, ok back then they tripled your strength, but that came out to 9 on every model capable of getting a witch blade). Regardless, anything that can be brought down by a spear at range will go down to witchblades in hand to hand. Marine players always look at me funny when my farseer charges their dreadnaughts...till the dreadnaughts blow up. Then they just look on in horror. None of them ever see it comming. With the new damage chart, that's become more dangerous so I may not do it anymore.

Lightbringer wrote:Anyway, I think I might try changing the Storm Guardians for Dire Avengers. They can move up with the Council and use their firepower to soften things up, and then capture objectives. Or so I hope. Still unsure about what to do with the exarch. If bladestorm is worth it, and if I should take defend (seems kind of likly they will be hit by stuff like assault marines). At least it saves me from having to buy Storm Guardians, since they don't have them in stock at the store here anymore ^^

If you are taking dire avengers, an exarch with bladestorm is required. Its just too good for how little it costs. Defend and the shimmershield are only worth it if you are going to be using the dire avengers as hand to hand tar pit. Since you don't have any other hard hitting units to really back them up, I would skip defend and the shimmershield at this point.