Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So...now that the Avatar doesn't block line of sight to the Farseer, doesn't this render Fortune/Farseer useless?

You Fortune the Avatar.
Enemy kills Farseer.
LoL.

IMO if you still wish to run this tactic Eldrad is required, as he can Fortune the both of them still creating a nice heavy hammer and anvil, but I'm thinking Eldrad would be better off doing something else or take him out of the list and just have the Avatar run alone?

Model the avatar with a ridiculous tabard hanging between his legs. LOS blocked.

....its called "joining a squad". Just a little thing that some characters do to keep safe from shooting.

Harlequins with a Seer do the job nicely, dont have to worry about shooting. HtH? Harlequins 6" away from the avatar seems like a safe place to be to me.

Deadshane1 wrote:....its called "joining a squad". Just a little thing that some characters do to keep safe from shooting.

Harlequins with a Seer do the job nicely, dont have to worry about shooting. HtH? Harlequins 6" away from the avatar seems like a safe place to be to me.

I...never thought of that, lol.

Wow, I'll admit I feel slowed now, is that how everyone always did Farseer + Avatar?

It is even better if you put Eldrad with a warlock(s). Either from a warlock squad or from a guardian squad with a warlock. That way Eldrad/farseer can benefit from embolden. It is even more unlikely that you will fail a psychic test with an emboldened reroll.

I just thought of something, what about a Farseer in a Wave Serpent with a squad of 10 Banshees?

Banshees don't really need to be rushed onto the field so the serpent can move 6" up with the avatar each turn, and the farseer can fortune him from inside and also doom if anything is in range, and when combat is near they can all pop out and strike a doomed unit.?

It will work, but you have to watch out for the serpent. If it goes down, your girls are in trouble.

Lonely_Penguin wrote:

Deadshane1 wrote:....its called "joining a squad". Just a little thing that some characters do to keep safe from shooting.

Harlequins with a Seer do the job nicely, dont have to worry about shooting. HtH? Harlequins 6" away from the avatar seems like a safe place to be to me.

I...never thought of that, lol.

Wow, I'll admit I feel slowed now, is that how everyone always did Farseer + Avatar?

yeah i didnt realize that one to with the harlis lol i feel like a total eldar noob now, time to go shine my armor i guess =(

th12t33n wrote:yeah i didnt realize that one to with the harlis lol i feel like a total eldar noob now, time to go shine my armor i guess =(

I wouldn't feel to bad, that combo is a 600 point chunk of units, with 11 models or so, both HQs, and it shoots.... Nothing? Pretty good assault unit, but awfully expensive in points and slots to make a single Eldar MC tough to kill. Plus what do the harlequins do while standing with the avatar who doesnt fleet to protect the farseer keeping him fortuned?...? (its an academic scenario)

Good luck.

I usually have all the parts in my footslogging Eldar list to do this. The harlies (all 6 of them) cost 162 and Eldrad costs 210. Not quite 600, but why quibble. The Harlies stay behind the MC's and as the army moves up the harlies get ready to assault/counter assault. It seems to work really well.

Augustus wrote:

th12t33n wrote:yeah i didnt realize that one to with the harlis lol i feel like a total eldar noob now, time to go shine my armor i guess =(

I wouldn't feel to bad, that combo is a 600 point chunk of units, with 11 models or so, both HQs, and it shoots.... Nothing? Pretty good assault unit, but awfully expensive in points and slots to make a single Eldar MC tough to kill. Plus what do the harlequins do while standing with the avatar who doesnt fleet to protect the farseer keeping him fortuned?...? (its an academic scenario)

Good luck.

The avatar doesn't fleet, but he can still run, which makes this CC unit much more viable.

You don't need me to tell you that the Avatar is a bad man in CC. I am 3-1 vs bloodthirsters with him in 5th ed. Bad bad man.

Darrian13 wrote:I usually have all the parts in my footslogging Eldar list to do this. The harlies (all 6 of them) cost 162 and Eldrad costs 210. Not quite 600, but why quibble. The Harlies stay behind the MC's and as the army moves up the harlies get ready to assault/counter assault. It seems to work really well.

bingo

Well ok I guess with cheaper harlies, b ut Im thinking there are a ton of easy counters for that, like say, just rolling the sight distance and blowing all the harlies away...

Or roling up a flamer in a rhino or chimera and erasing the harlies...

Or DSing by them and wiping them out...

Meh good luck.

All very possible options but somehow my opponents usually prioritize the Avatar and the 3 wraithlords in front of the harlies and they evn spend more effort on the dire avengers than the harlies. I am not saying they are invincible, just very survivable.

Sounds like a good castle. Sure.

Why prioritize a unit (Harlies) that you cannot shoot at?

Augustus wrote:Well ok I guess with cheaper harlies, b ut Im thinking there are a ton of easy counters for that, like say, just rolling the sight distance and blowing all the harlies away...

The problem is that you have to roll the sight distance. The average on 2d6 is 7 => 14" sight distance and you got a 58% of rolling that or better. If you start streching that out further, things get ugly. 18" => 28% chance and 20 => 17% chance. Lets also not forget that if you try and shoot them but don't roll a distance high enough, your unit can't shoot that round. How much do you really want to risk that? Lets also not forget that the average charge range for the harlies is 15.5" so if you get fairly close and fail, you're going to get eaten. Oh yah, and if you are moving in on them from the front, there is an avatar closer to you than the quins are by roughly 4-6 inches.

Or roling up a flamer in a rhino or chimera and erasing the harlies...

Its one of the better ways to deal with them, but the eldar player is going to see it comming and if he's good, try his best to stop it. And don't forget that there is still an avatar between you and the quins.

Or DSing by them and wiping them out...

This is the method that is most likely to suceede since you can get close to them without having to risk getting charged before you get to do anything. The problem is that anything that lands near these guys is going to get killed off by the rest of the eldar army next turn, so you can't really do it with expensive things like terminators. It works great with IG vets though since they are cheap.

Regardless of what you end up doing, it is nearly impossible to take out the farseer in one go due to wound assignment rules. The wounds are going to be spread around across the squad so only a few (or possibly none at all) will end up on the farseer. Then any wounds that are on him get a 4+ I save (possibly with a reroll depending on where fortune went) and you got to get though 3 wounds to kill him. While it can be done, it just isn't so simple as run up and rapid fire.

My favorite bodyguard for Elrad, or any farseer, is a unit of 3-5 wraithguard. They make him fearless, he fortunes their armor & cover. Include a warlock for rerolls (or enhance) as an option.

It's an elite slot unless you go up to 10 WG, though.

I wish they made plastic WG, then I might actually buy and play with them more instead of asking my friends if they mid me proxying them for a game. :(

Just use 10 Wraithlords as proxies.

What do you mean you don't have 10 Wraithlords?!

What kind of Eldar Farseer are you?!

Lonely_Penguin wrote:

Deadshane1 wrote:....its called "joining a squad". Just a little thing that some characters do to keep safe from shooting.

Harlequins with a Seer do the job nicely, dont have to worry about shooting. HtH? Harlequins 6" away from the avatar seems like a safe place to be to me.

I...never thought of that, lol.

Wow, I'll admit I feel slowed now, is that how everyone always did Farseer + Avatar?

Yup! Well I'd do guardian's with a warlock with conceal for a 5+ cover save... but that's because I try not to use clowns. I've heard of others using multiple squads of Dire Avengers or Guardians trying to maximize on Avatars ability to make everyone fearless.