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HQ
Grand Master- holocaust 165
3 grey knight termies 1 brother captain 199

Eliets
4 grey knight termies 1 brother captain- incinerater 255

4 grey knight termies 1 brother captain- incinerater 255

Troops
6 grey knights 1 justicar- 2 psy cannons 250

6 grey knights 1 justicar- 2 psy cannons 250

6 grey knights 1 justicar-1 psy cannon 225

6 grey knights 1 justicar- 1 psy cannon 225

Heavy
3 land raiders- extra armor (255) 765

that list could be hard to beat

Hmmm. I like the troops - lots of squads. Why the number 6 though? Seems like an odd number. Personally, I don't think regulard GK's are worth using. Did you consider running 3 or 4 squads of IST's and their chimeras or rhinos? That might be a better alternative. Also, I know that you have the 3 terminator squads set up like that so you can do 1 in each LR, but maybe a 10 man squad would be the way to go.... that's tough to kill.

Using GK in Ard Boyz is truly Ard.

You're gonna have trouble taking out armor at range, but you already knew that. Let us know how it goes!

Ozymandias, King of Kings

Hmm.

Maybe double check the rulings on psycannon. Don't have FAQ handy but in the original printing they ignored cover as this was not mentioned specifically in the weapon entry - you might want to make sure this is still the case before packing your bags. If that's the case, paraphrasing Ozy, it could have a shot.

wight_widow wrote:Hmm.

Maybe double check the rulings on psycannon. Don't have FAQ handy but in the original printing they ignored cover as this was not mentioned specifically in the weapon entry - you might want to make sure this is still the case before packing your bags. If that's the case, paraphrasing Ozy, it could have a shot.

Psycannons do not ignore cover per the last FAQ. But on the plus side, they are only AP4, so all MEQs get a save anyways.

Demonhunters scale up well at 2500 points, but pure grey knights still have a lot of "issues". This army that you posted suffers from what all gimmik Land Raider armies suffer from, and that is if your oppoenent can kill Land Raiders you lose, if they can't you win.

Psycannons do NOT ignore cover saves as a clarification, says so in the new pdf faq on gw's site.

As it goes, I think you'll be hard pressed to win with this in ard boyz, for a few reasons:

1) its daemonhunters

2) very low model count since you went pure GK, you only have 4 scoring squads of 6 men each. Shrouding is nearly useless (lets be honest, Im a GK player myself) and although you pay 25 points a model, you still jsut have the same 3+ save that every space marine has. At 2500 points, your opponent will have no trouble killing 25 space marines by the end of the game.

3) Against the normal tough ard boyz lists, (8 MC nids with 120-180 gaunts, 6-7 land raiders, 100-180 orks with lots of other goodies) you're just going to be overwhelmed and unable to take out large numbers of cheap models before getting overwhelmed, or unable to take out heavily armored lists.


But, I do appreciate trying to play an army you enjoy even if it is pretty much the worst in 40k, however, you may want to consider adding in some extra bodies in the form of IST's (inquisitorial storm troopers).

Some general suggestions:

Your anti tank/anti MC/anti Termi is sorely lacking. An easy place to get this is with a 5 man IST squad with 2 plasma or 2 melta for 70 points, put them in a rhino, and for 120 points you seriously start buffing up your AT. How large you field these is up to you, if you play them as throwawas suicide squads, small is best, if you want them to be scoring, play them as 10 man. Id suggest playing 4 of these as throwaway squads.

6 Grey knights is too few, and too easy to take out. I'd consolidate it to two squads of 10 men each, keeping the dual psycannons on each squad.

A popular choice recenty is the inquisitor/2 mystics in a landraider (they can purchase it as a transport if you'd like!) in order to defend against deepstriking. Taking free shots with any squad within 12 inches of the squad at any deepstrikers/summoned daemons is a great bonus for the cost of the 2 mystic/inquistor (a whopping 32 points). The landraider transport for them could get you a bit more AT, give your opponent another LR to have trouble dealing with, and keep that deepstrike defense alive.

My advice is to speak with Lemartes about your army. He took a GK army last year for 'ardboyz and could have gone to the finals with them if he wanted.

I think Deadshane's Demonhunters Tactica is a perfect way to play pure GK for 'Ard Boyz.

You should scrap the incinerators in the termi squads and give them psycannons instead...one to the squad, one to the brother captain.

Psycannons are better on terminators because they dont have to remain still for the full range on them. Psycannons in PAGK squads cause you to lose a little mobility if you want to fire at range....not good.

If you have to bring incinerators, bring them in the PAGK squads. They should be riding in the LR's anyway, they'll be able to pounce out and fry whatever they like if you want to go that route.

I'm not a big fan of special weapons in PAGK squads anyway. You pay big points for the priviledge of losing your Nemesis weapon and true grit skill. Storm bolters are good enough....great actually.

You're definatly on the right track for a pure GK force though.

Here's what I'd take as far as an army that looks like the one above.



HQ

Brother Captain w/psycannon (his mission is to deep strike and psycannon the rear of an enemy tank, he's cheap enough to risk it...a throw away leader)

Brother Captain Stern w/Retinue of 3 terminators w/1 psycannon (Here is you're forceweapon, Stern allows you to ignore the 1x Grey knight HQ Choice problem. Made extra tough thru the retinue rules of 5e)

ELITE

3xTerminator w/2xpsycannon (one cannon on the Brother captain)

3xTerminator w/2xpsycannon

TROOPS

6xPAGK w/ Justicar-Targetter, psycannon bolts (this unit doesnt give up ANY mobility OR HtH ability from special weapons. The justicar is a special weapon guy anyway with an AP4 Stormbolter that ignores invulnerables....and he doesnt even lose his HtH weapon)

6xPAGK w/ Justicar-Targetter, psycannon bolts

6xPAGK w/ Justicar-Targetter, psycannon bolts

6xPAGK w/ Justicar-Targetter, psycannon bolts

FAST ATTACK

5xPAGK w/2xIncinerator, Justicar-Targetter, Psycannon bolts (this unit is so that you can feed the need to burn things...if you really want to use incinerators. I personally would use these points to bolster my Troops Squads...7 more PAGK's with points to spare...Thats 14 more stormbolter shots that dont have to wait for a reserves roll to be effective.)

HEAVY SUPPORT

GK Land Raider w/Smoke (they dont really need extra armour...but smoke is useful)

GK Land Raider w/Smoke

GK Land Raider w/Smoke


....this army puts more units and more guys on the table, and doenst lose any abilities off of the list that was posted above...and its able to do all the same things...and a few more.

targetawg wrote:Psycannons do NOT ignore cover saves as a clarification, says so in the new pdf faq on gw's site.

As it goes, I think you'll be hard pressed to win with this in ard boyz, for a few reasons:

1) its daemonhunters

So?

2) very low model count since you went pure GK, you only have 4 scoring squads of 6 men each. Shrouding is nearly useless (lets be honest, Im a GK player myself) and although you pay 25 points a model, you still jsut have the same 3+ save that every space marine has. At 2500 points, your opponent will have no trouble killing 25 space marines by the end of the game.

You must be using shrouding wrong then. Not rules-wise, Tactic-wise. Shrouding saves me ALL THE TIME. My last game my BT opponent had 4 plasmacannons trying to fire at grey knights at range the whole game....he got two shots off...and one deviated off of me. (the other one hurt pretty bad, killing a Stormbolter terminator )

3) Against the normal tough ard boyz lists, (8 MC nids with 120-180 gaunts, 6-7 land raiders, 100-180 orks with lots of other goodies) you're just going to be overwhelmed and unable to take out large numbers of cheap models before getting overwhelmed, or unable to take out heavily armored lists.

So what you're saying is that Grey Knights are handicapped against top teir and certain abusive lists? There's a news flash for ya! (by the way, grey knights STOMP big bugs easy.)

But, I do appreciate trying to play an army you enjoy even if it is pretty much the worst in 40k, however, you may want to consider adding in some extra bodies in the form of IST's (inquisitorial storm troopers).

Playing PURE Grey Knights is an attempt to make a statement and SEE how high up the ladder you can get. Piss on IST's.

Your anti tank/anti MC/anti Termi is sorely lacking. An easy place to get this is with a 5 man IST squad with 2 plasma or 2 melta for 70 points, put them in a rhino, and for 120 points you seriously start buffing up your AT. How large you field these is up to you, if you play them as throwawas suicide squads, small is best, if you want them to be scoring, play them as 10 man. Id suggest playing 4 of these as throwaway squads.

Six twin linked lascannons certainly DO suck for Anti-tank. I mean, where's the power? I dont understand how anti-termi is lacking in an army with scads and scads small arms firepower. Grey knights use stormbolters and Psycannons to kill terminators, and you know what....they die. The mentality that you NEED plasma or high AP to kill terminators is a NOOB veiwpoint in the extreme.

6 Grey knights is too few, and too easy to take out. I'd consolidate it to two squads of 10 men each, keeping the dual psycannons on each squad.

actually, its a really good number....8 is a little better, but six is a solid unit, and can outshoot 10 space marines at range 13-24 more often than not barring heavy weapons. Besides, didnt you just comment that his scoring units were weak? Now you're suggesting consolidating them into TWO scoring units....not only lessening the scoring units, but losing a total of 4 bodies? That's smart.

A popular choice recenty is the inquisitor/2 mystics in a landraider (they can purchase it as a transport if you'd like!) in order to defend against deepstriking. Taking free shots with any squad within 12 inches of the squad at any deepstrikers/summoned daemons is a great bonus for the cost of the 2 mystic/inquistor (a whopping 32 points). The landraider transport for them could get you a bit more AT, give your opponent another LR to have trouble dealing with, and keep that deepstrike defense alive.

Pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights...................

(why do peeps keep coming into PURE grey knight posts and keep trying to pawn off their tired old inquisitors on us? We're trying to do the best with WHAT WE HAVE, not build the best possible list in an attempt to compete with the cookie cutter HARD lists out there....sheesh!)

Like it or not, part of the DH are their Inquisitors.

"Pure" means nothing since they are only part of the DH forces.

Stelek wrote:Like it or not, part of the DH are their Inquisitors.

"Pure" means nothing since they are only part of the DH forces.

Dont be arguementative.

Everyone knows what "Pure Grey Knights" means. The OP obviously wants to go this route...otherwise he'd have inquisitors.


If I want to build a dark elf witch cult list and use ONLY witches, a PURE witch army if you will, what help is it when someone suggests that I need a Talos?

Since neither "impure" GK nor "pure" GK have won any tournaments, I ask you why quibble?

Suck is suck.

Stelek wrote:Since neither "impure" GK nor "pure" GK have won any tournaments, I ask you why quibble?

Suck is suck.

Because some people actually play this GAME for FUN. If someone can have FUN playing Grey Knights, thats all the reason one needs to quibble.

...oh, and the Australian GT was won by Grey Knights in 2004....in your face.

Gee, I'm pretty sure everyone else knew I was talking about the US. You did too. Yet, the lame comment.

I'm pretty sure everyone knew the discussion is about a tournament in the US called the 'ard boyz', we aren't talking about playing to have fun anymore. You knew too. Yet, another lame comment.

Oh well.

Stelek wrote:Gee, I'm pretty sure everyone else knew I was talking about the US. You did too. Yet, the lame comment.

...all I did was point out that Grey Knights HAVE won in a tournement, this is a multinational board, in case you didnt realise. I simply said something before one of our mates from 'down under' did.

What did you say?

Since neither "impure" GK nor "pure" GK have won any tournaments, I ask you why quibble?

...on a board that has Americans, Canadians, Australians, U.K., heck even China.

I'm pretty sure everyone knew the discussion is about a tournament in the US called the 'ard boyz', we aren't talking about playing to have fun anymore. You knew too. Yet, another lame comment.

Oh well.

....so its impossible to 'have fun' playing in the 'ard boyz'? Its all business, is that what you're saying?

Everyone hear that, if you plan on going to the 'Ard Boyz' tournement, fun is not a factor....oh wait a minute....

"At its heart though, the 'Ard Boyz is about having fun. So don't be a git! (stelek) In other words do your best to win, but win nicely."-Taken from the tournement packet.

Ordinarily, whenever I play a GAME its about having fun, regardless what sort of prizes are at stake. GAME=FUN isnt that at the heart of why we're all here in the first place?

Not you I suppose, you're simply here to provoke.

Stelek is so cute when he gets all uppity.

I know Lemartes has done well enough with his GK force in tournaments. He's pretty much noted for taking armies everyone says suck and doing great jobs with them.
He might not win every time he takes them, but he doesn't stake his IQ, manhood, or social standing on how well he does at tournaments.

Few responses for ya, and for the record, he didn't say he wanted pure GK ever, he said he had a GK list for ard boyz, thats it.

Deadshane1 wrote:

targetawg wrote:Psycannons do NOT ignore cover saves as a clarification, says so in the new pdf faq on gw's site.

As it goes, I think you'll be hard pressed to win with this in ard boyz, for a few reasons:

1) its daemonhunters

So?

Nice lack of a response. I responded to the psycannon cover save question as it had been raised in the thread. As far as the "So?" Im not even sure why you put that up, other than your general trolling in this thread. The reason I said daemonhunters will be hard pressed to win is because in the 40k world, they're one of the more under-powered armies, I play them myself, sometimes in tournaments, they have serious flaws due to an outdated codex, rules that do nothing, and high points for models that dont get any more survivable than ones 10 points cheaper.

Deadshane1 wrote:

2) very low model count since you went pure GK, you only have 4 scoring squads of 6 men each. Shrouding is nearly useless (lets be honest, Im a GK player myself) and although you pay 25 points a model, you still jsut have the same 3+ save that every space marine has. At 2500 points, your opponent will have no trouble killing 25 space marines by the end of the game.

You must be using shrouding wrong then. Not rules-wise, Tactic-wise. Shrouding saves me ALL THE TIME. My last game my BT opponent had 4 plasmacannons trying to fire at grey knights at range the whole game....he got two shots off...and one deviated off of me. (the other one hurt pretty bad, killing a Stormbolter terminator )

Nope, shrouding is all around ineffectual. Your BT opponents and opponents in general are playing poorly if they cant figure out how to get around it. Its at a distance of 3d6 x 3, max distance being a whopping 54 inches, minimum distance of 9 inches, and an average of 27 inches. Since deployment zones are only 24 inches apart, more often than not shrouding = useless, and not something one should depend on in a tournament environent, where you can't just pick out the one game in the recent past that its performed wonderfully, but rather need to be consistent game to game. It's like poker, if you play a bad hand you might get lucky, but more often than not, you just end up nickel and diming yourself into the poor house because you're chasing that one lucky hand. In order to win tournaments it requires SOUND tactics, not hopes and dreams for your opponent to roll poorly.

Also, if your opponent has any sort of mobility, he can make shrouding even more ineffectual.

Deadshane1 wrote:

3) Against the normal tough ard boyz lists, (8 MC nids with 120-180 gaunts, 6-7 land raiders, 100-180 orks with lots of other goodies) you're just going to be overwhelmed and unable to take out large numbers of cheap models before getting overwhelmed, or unable to take out heavily armored lists.

So what you're saying is that Grey Knights are handicapped against top teir and certain abusive lists? There's a news flash for ya! (by the way, grey knights STOMP big bugs easy.)

I didn't realize I needed to post a news flash in order to not have a smarmy comment thrown back. Its a point that needed to be addressed. Everyone knows going to the ard boyz (and a tournament in general) you probably are going to be trying your darndest to win, no one said you aren't trying to have fun, but winning is important in competitive play last time I checked.

And for the record, Big bugs will maul GK 9/10 times if played by a semi-intelligent player. The model count of the well made big-bug lists are far too high for a GK list to compete with, along with all of the MC's. Its not a failing of the GK player imo, its a failing of the nid dex being pretty abusive currently.

Deadshane1 wrote:

But, I do appreciate trying to play an army you enjoy even if it is pretty much the worst in 40k, however, you may want to consider adding in some extra bodies in the form of IST's (inquisitorial storm troopers).

Playing PURE Grey Knights is an attempt to make a statement and SEE how high up the ladder you can get. Piss on IST's.

Once again, he never said he was trying Pure GK. No need to be rude. IST's have their place in armies, and are fun models to play with imo.

Deadshane1 wrote:

Your anti tank/anti MC/anti Termi is sorely lacking. An easy place to get this is with a 5 man IST squad with 2 plasma or 2 melta for 70 points, put them in a rhino, and for 120 points you seriously start buffing up your AT. How large you field these is up to you, if you play them as throwawas suicide squads, small is best, if you want them to be scoring, play them as 10 man. Id suggest playing 4 of these as throwaway squads.

Six twin linked lascannons certainly DO suck for Anti-tank. I mean, where's the power? I dont understand how anti-termi is lacking in an army with scads and scads small arms firepower. Grey knights use stormbolters and Psycannons to kill terminators, and you know what....they die. The mentality that you NEED plasma or high AP to kill terminators is a NOOB veiwpoint in the extreme.

IMO, the person who tosses around the term 'NOOB' in caps on a forum is pretty much that of a young teenager, or someone who never got past that phase of development, but of course, just my NOOB opinion.

SIX TL LC mounted on three targets, once those are neutralized, you're up gak creek my friend. On top of this, with the new obscured/cover save rules, 6 TL LC's arent quite what they used to be.

And torrent of fire can down terminators, but GK don't put out enough models to torrent of fire them effectively unless you double team a squad of termies with a few squads of GK's. And keep in mind, those terminators you're just mowing down by the handful...well they have the same guns as you. And they have assault cannons. And they have a better save. What happens when they torrent of fire you in return? Or are you just assuming you'll always get the first round of shooting?

Deadshane1 wrote:

6 Grey knights is too few, and too easy to take out. I'd consolidate it to two squads of 10 men each, keeping the dual psycannons on each squad.

actually, its a really good number....8 is a little better, but six is a solid unit, and can outshoot 10 space marines at range 13-24 more often than not barring heavy weapons. Besides, didnt you just comment that his scoring units were weak? Now you're suggesting consolidating them into TWO scoring units....not only lessening the scoring units, but losing a total of 4 bodies? That's smart.

I suggested consolidating his scoring units in order to make a couple, rock hard scoring units that would be much more difficult to move, and then adding in MORE scoring units in the form of IST's. Try to keep up.

Deadshane1 wrote:

A popular choice recenty is the inquisitor/2 mystics in a landraider (they can purchase it as a transport if you'd like!) in order to defend against deepstriking. Taking free shots with any squad within 12 inches of the squad at any deepstrikers/summoned daemons is a great bonus for the cost of the 2 mystic/inquistor (a whopping 32 points). The landraider transport for them could get you a bit more AT, give your opponent another LR to have trouble dealing with, and keep that deepstrike defense alive.

Pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights, pure grey knights...................

(why do peeps keep coming into PURE grey knight posts and keep trying to pawn off their tired old inquisitors on us? We're trying to do the best with WHAT WE HAVE, not build the best possible list in an attempt to compete with the cookie cutter HARD lists out there....sheesh!)

This was not a PURE GK post as you keep seeming to think. I think you need to pull your head out of the fluff of the game and quit acting so "righteous" about "your" army. Not everyone has this vendetta against all models in the DH codex that doesn't feature the wording "grey knight" in the title. If people want to suggest helpfully other choices and variants they've heard about, you can either not respond if it bothers you that much (was this your post?) or be polite in return.

Grow up.

/endrant

targetawg wrote:Few responses for ya, and for the record, he didn't say he wanted pure GK ever, he said he had a GK list for ard boyz, thats it.

No, he didnt, but then again with the list he posted doesnt it seem obvious what units he wants in his army?

Nice lack of a response. I responded to the psycannon cover save question as it had been raised in the thread. As far as the "So?" Im not even sure why you put that up, other than your general trolling in this thread. The reason I said daemonhunters will be hard pressed to win is because in the 40k world, they're one of the more under-powered armies, I play them myself, sometimes in tournaments, they have serious flaws due to an outdated codex, rules that do nothing, and high points for models that dont get any more survivable than ones 10 points cheaper.

The "SO" was meant in reply to your #1. "It's Daemonhunters" isnt any sort of reason that an army will be hard to win with. There are people out there that do just fine WITH daemonhunters.

Nope, shrouding is all around ineffectual. Your BT opponents and opponents in general are playing poorly if they cant figure out how to get around it. Its at a distance of 3d6 x 3, max distance being a whopping 54 inches, minimum distance of 9 inches, and an average of 27 inches. Since deployment zones are only 24 inches apart, more often than not shrouding = useless, and not something one should depend on in a tournament environent, where you can't just pick out the one game in the recent past that its performed wonderfully, but rather need to be consistent game to game. It's like poker, if you play a bad hand you might get lucky, but more often than not, you just end up nickel and diming yourself into the poor house because you're chasing that one lucky hand. In order to win tournaments it requires SOUND tactics, not hopes and dreams for your opponent to roll poorly.

Also, if your opponent has any sort of mobility, he can make shrouding even more ineffectual.

This post PROVES to me that you're using shrouding incorrectly. Deployment distance doenst mean a thing unless you deploy your troops ON THE LINE. I dont. Typically, units that are wanting to utilise shrouding to its utmost (terminators) deploy farther back, most of the time, on the board edge. If you figure the max range of a psycannon is 36", and the average roll of an opponent trying to beat shrouding is 30-33" (a result of 10-11 which is dead average) then your shrouding should be VERY useful if you utilise PAGK targetters so that you can know exact distances and maneuver, while firing, to your maximum ranges to engage the closest units. Units beyond the unit that you are targetting acutally will have a VERY hard time engaging your troopers as they will have to roll BETTER than average to fire on your units. You CAN utilise shrouding and play the odds, thats not hoping for opponents to roll poorly, thats playing the odds in a game. This is of course all theory, experience on the battlefield is what makes it work.

....and it works.

And for the record, Big bugs will maul GK 9/10 times if played by a semi-intelligent player. The model count of the well made big-bug lists are far too high for a GK list to compete with, along with all of the MC's. Its not a failing of the GK player imo, its a failing of the nid dex being pretty abusive currently.

WOW, you need to get out more. If you have any terminators in your army at all, say at least 2 smallish units and a force weapon leader, either Stern or a GrandMaster. Big bug players are in serious trouble.

They cannot outshoot you if you run landraiders, and if they get close enough Terminators can destroy hive tyrants easily in CC...if there's no Hive mind in synapse Force weapons kill off Carnifexes before they even swing.

Practice your maneuvering.

Once again, he never said he was trying Pure GK. No need to be rude. IST's have their place in armies, and are fun models to play with imo.

...and once again, its obvious what he wants to run in his army. Otherwise, where are the inquisitors? Inquisitors can OBVIOUSLY add a lot to the list...where are they? Oh yea, he's prolly wanting to run PURE.

SIX TL LC mounted on three targets, once those are neutralized, you're up gak creek my friend. On top of this, with the new obscured/cover save rules, 6 TL LC's arent quite what they used to be.

Easier said than done in 5e. Especially if you run landraiders at long range instead of throwing them in peoples faces at close range. LR's are the new falcon my friend. If you know how to run them, there is no reason that you should have 2-3 of them left at the end of the game.

And torrent of fire can down terminators, but GK don't put out enough models to torrent of fire them effectively unless you double team a squad of termies with a few squads of GK's. And keep in mind, those terminators you're just mowing down by the handful...well they have the same guns as you. And they have assault cannons. And they have a better save. What happens when they torrent of fire you in return? Or are you just assuming you'll always get the first round of shooting?

Terminators arent hard to take out, they're not. It's not really even worth arguing. You do NOT need plasma to do it either.

I suggested consolidating his scoring units in order to make a couple, rock hard scoring units that would be much more difficult to move, and then adding in MORE scoring units in the form of IST's. Try to keep up.

Yea, the SUICIDAL IST units you mentioned go a long way towards objective grabbing, good call. You're going to grab objectives with Guardsmen (who are meant to die anyway after they unleash their guns)....GUARDSMEN, when you have fearless marines availiable.

This was not a PURE GK post as you keep seeming to think. I think you need to pull your head out of the fluff of the game and quit acting so "righteous" about "your" army. Not everyone has this vendetta against all models in the DH codex that doesn't feature the wording "grey knight" in the title. If people want to suggest helpfully other choices and variants they've heard about, you can either not respond if it bothers you that much (was this your post?) or be polite in return.

Grow up.

Sorry to offend you. You might be a little thin skinned for the internet however. I didnt bash you THAT hard. You know, people tend to disagree sometimes on these forums, you DID realise that didnt you? There was nothing THAT rude about my post to you...unless you're looking for an arguement.

Man what a silly thread this has become.

I'm glad the comp happy aussies have managed to make a tourney system where GK can thrive.

Sadly, this doesn't apply to the rest of the world--so I stand by what I said, where comp rules the GK suck.

Of course, you DO know this. You're just being smart, and that's fine. I'll point out the truth until you give up.

Next.

Of course the ard boyz is supposed to be fun, but much like the Indy's bring out the holes, so too does the ard boyz attract a great many flies. I won the only one I cared about.

Next.

I personally believe this list isn't any kind of hardcore. It's better than a normal GK heavy list, but that's only because it's at 2500 points.

I can take a 2000 point army and put this army away. GK are that bad. Anyone who knows how to run GK knows how to beat them. Let's see how difficult it is:

I start 12" in. You are 34" away on your table edge just itching to fire psycannons at me.

I move 6" and run D6". I take a turn of your fire (on my 4+ cover save). I keep moving my assault troops forward while my torrent of gunfire units get ready to fire on turn 2.

Then I, miracle of miracles, "see" you because you are only 22-27" away from me. Then I torrent your GK away.

Gonna assault me with your Termies? Allright, I've got my sacrifice squads ready to go and my counters standing by to smash them. Meltas ready to pop Land Raiders, yep.

See, you write neat advice but GK are easily beaten in 5th because you can't play the 6" shoot n'scoot with your termies because everyone can catch you in short order (1 turn) and blow past your shrouding.

I run Sisters in my 'impure' GK list because I want people to try to get range on my GK units. That gives the Sisters targets, and I will take 12 Sisters over 6 GK every day for midfield domination. The grey knights HAVE to run away, or they get gunned down like...marines.

I hope people understand that GK as a army are beyond difficult to use, but if you go up against someone as good as you are....odds are you are going to lose.

By the way, once again on the subject of this not being a list for PURE grey knights. I'd like to point out that the title is, "Grey Knights list for 'Ard Boyz" and his list features nothing but Grey Knight units.

....The title of the thread isnt "Daemonhunters list for 'Ard Boyz".

This is a PURE GK thread...obviously.

@Stelek

I assume you know how competetive the Aussies are then...how much gaming have you done down there?

Nothing you just posted changes anything.

People are going to want to run Grey Knights, they will continue to do so. It's what they want to do for whatever reason: they like the fluff, they want to really challenge themselves, they got the models 'on the cheap', whatever.....

There is also a correct way for running this army, as handicapped as it is. Some people are willing to give advice to that effect. Some of that advice can be really good....for a list as handicapped as this one.

You never heard me say "Run Grey Knights this way and you will win every game regardless." or "This is the best army to run if you want to win games" or anything of the sort.

It's been a while since I've been down to Australia, about 6 years now. Since I have a buddy I knew for years here living down there now, it's not like I'm suddenly "unaware" of the tournament scene. What I said is the way it is. GK haven't won any major tournaments. The aussie ones have comp, the rest don't. What part of that distinction isn't clear enough?

I'm running Grey Knights. I'm running it for the reasons you list.

Despite the fact there are IG, Inquisitors, and Sisters in my army I love it's "fluff" despite it's suck level being pretty high.

Am I not running 'Grey Knights' because I don't have 40 of them in my army? Please, spare me the fluff crap ok?

The way you say to run the army, I find serious flaws in that advice but since I don't want to be the ONLY person giving out decent advice on dakka I've steered clear. I encourage you to refine your ideas and make the internets a better place for GK everywhere.

Putting in advice on how to run all kinds of GK armies would be a much better use of your time than arguing with me on what is or isn't 'pure' GK.

I think if all the flavors taste of le suck, what's it matter if the flavor is orange suck or cranberry suck?

I don't think it does matter personally. We can have different opinions, right?

Deadshane1 wrote:By the way, once again on the subject of this not being a list for PURE grey knights. I'd like to point out that the title is, "Grey Knights list for 'Ard Boyz" and his list features nothing but Grey Knight units.

....The title of the thread isnt "Daemonhunters list for 'Ard Boyz".

This is a PURE GK thread...obviously.

My point is this:

Fluff + Ard Boyz = Lolz.

Get it? Great.

Not being an hole is one thing, wanting to have "fun" is another.

Trying to be the best with one of the worst? There's a limit to my ability to ignore reality and in a tournament environment where you are going to feel the pain against very hardcore take-no-prisoners lists, shouldn't we at least tell the guy this is a great fluffy apocalypse detachment but is incredibly bad for the ard boyz?

Whether it's "pure" or not has nothing to do with that fact. There's alot of ways I'd run GK in the Ard Boyz to make them competitive and this list isn't a threat to anyone.

If you think losing three games is a good place to be, fluff masters, then please, come to Utah so I can finish you off in 2 turns. I'll even let you roll for me. :S

does yurmom have anything to say about this. I mean, not to intrude or anything, but we have one guy arguing that this list can only be a pure GK list and F U to anyone who suggests different, while we have another guy arguing that no one should bring an army to play for fun because thats to stupid.
I want to know what the OP has to say, mostly becuase hes the one bringing PK to the Ard Boyz, and whether or not he wants to compete is up to him.

BTW, Stelek, I would love to go to Utah and bring my ultimate fluff army. My Black Templars are all about armored spearhead, with 60% of the force in rhinos, with three LRCs carrying Helbrecht and his beefed up command squad. Super Fluff (almost no anti-tank until I drop squads with meltas). I would like to pit my list versus this pure GK list and see who wins, and who has more fun (both probably).

1)Im sry to tell you kid, but ur gonna get swarmed by the Orks... you dont wanna know how EZ it is to beat small GK armies with Hordes

2) You shouldn't even be using GK in the first place if you are playing Orks. Use SOB, as they are the best army in the game for beating hordes (flamer heavy, lots of ap 5 bolters)