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Made in us



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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Westerville, OH

So--just out of curiosity--what is the advantage to priming with Gesso, over spray primer?
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Madrak Ironhide







I think the big thing is avoiding poor weather conditions. I haven't actually
tried it myself, but syr here has, and a few others.

DR:70+S+G-MB-I+Pwmhd05#+D++A+++/aWD100R++T(S)DM+++
Get your own Dakka Code!

"...he could never understand the sense of a contest in which the two adversaries agreed upon the rules." Gabriel Garcia Marquez, One Hundred Years of Solitude 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Westerville, OH

My friend is always worried about priming in winter, this might be right up his alley. Thanks Mal!
   
Made in us
Darkwolf






New Hampshire

stormtitan wrote:So--just out of curiosity--what is the advantage to priming with Gesso, over spray primer?


Avoiding fumes
Safe (?) indoor use
Better control of "globs"

But I haven't used the stuff... though I am sick of stinky fumes

What I play:

Hockey players wear numbers because you can't always identify the body with dental records. 
   
Made in ca
Tinkering Tech-Priest





Canada

5 months out of the year i cannot use spray primer do to it being -20 to -45 outside this article was quite handy thanks
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Madrak Ironhide







I hope everything turns out well. Let us know!

DR:70+S+G-MB-I+Pwmhd05#+D++A+++/aWD100R++T(S)DM+++
Get your own Dakka Code!

"...he could never understand the sense of a contest in which the two adversaries agreed upon the rules." Gabriel Garcia Marquez, One Hundred Years of Solitude 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
[.]






.

I recently purchased some black gesso as well, for just these reasons.

I'll pass along my findings ASAP.

   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Thanks for the article! I'm in a location with insanely high humidity (90+% most of the year) and controlled areas that don't allow much spraying to be done anyway, This is exactly what I need to be able to get started on my next army! I fully intend to be using this method for a full army, and hope to start a P&M blog up for it soon.
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Madrak Ironhide







Make sure to test it out to see if you like the results first. Some people love it,
and others still prefer to spray or brush.

DR:70+S+G-MB-I+Pwmhd05#+D++A+++/aWD100R++T(S)DM+++
Get your own Dakka Code!

"...he could never understand the sense of a contest in which the two adversaries agreed upon the rules." Gabriel Garcia Marquez, One Hundred Years of Solitude 
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan





SoCal

Heya, as an artist who has used those mediums in other areas already, just wanted to chime in about how to thin down the gesso.

One of the reasons why the gesso stopped adhering so well after thinning past 20% with the tamiya thinner was that the thinner only included a thinning agent, with no extra binding agents to make up for there being so much more solution.

So I'd actually recommend just as Liquitex recommends to get some matte medium and mix that in alongside your other thinning agents. In this case water will do fine.

Matte medium is used as an adhesive in a lot of cases in the art world, and the extra binding agents in the medium help make up for the thinner gesso mix, thus helping the thinner coats stay attached to the miniature.

   
Made in gb
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin






Bedfordshire, UK

Awesome, I'm buying me some gesso!

   
Made in us
Hellacious Havoc






NC

I for one have tried this and have had 0 luck with it. Used the same brands in the Article but my results turn up with either very very thin stuff or loss of detail so bad that you can not make out the mini. I have tried thinning it, just throwing it on there and nothing seems to work. What am I doing wrong? I really would like this to work!
   
Made in us
Hierarch




Pueblo, CO

I use Liquitex's Black gesso, and have had a lot of success with it, no thinning required, though I do a brush application as opposed to an airbrush application. As far as loss of detail goes, I've not had a single problem with this.

I find that if you just brush it on, and make sure to do a bit of touch-up to make sure that you can still make out some minimal detail after you've applied it, you should be okay, though you may have to do a bit of spot touch-up to cover where the gesso may have shrank off (the only "issue" that i've had with this priming medium).

Things I've gotten other players to admit...
Foldalot: Pariahs can sometimes be useful 
   
Made in us
Hellacious Havoc






NC

Dronze wrote:I use Liquitex's Black gesso, and have had a lot of success with it, no thinning required, though I do a brush application as opposed to an airbrush application. As far as loss of detail goes, I've not had a single problem with this.

I find that if you just brush it on, and make sure to do a bit of touch-up to make sure that you can still make out some minimal detail after you've applied it, you should be okay, though you may have to do a bit of spot touch-up to cover where the gesso may have shrank off (the only "issue" that i've had with this priming medium).


I am brush applying with both the white and "clear" or colorless gesso and making the clear or colorless black or what ever base color I would like to use. I will try a few models tonight and post the picks once it has dried to show my results to perhaps get some pointers on what is going on.
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




I picked up Liquitex Clear Gesso and painted a few last night. I painted one model more lightly, and the other more heavily, to see if there was a difference. I got VERY different drying results after 12 hours--nothing as nice as shown in the article. A fair amount of detail was lost on the heavier application, in fact, so I may be scrubbing them down with Simple Green cleaner to get back to the base surface.

Is there a difference in gesso's? Or do you think I should thin it? I had hoped to avoid that... just one less step to deal with.

I will say that the "surface feel" of the dried gesso is very rough, like a fine-grained sandpaper. Feels great.

Anyone else get results that surprised them like this, and did you find a solution?

James

 
   
Made in us
Hellacious Havoc






NC

jamesmhebert wrote:I picked up Liquitex Clear Gesso and painted a few last night. I painted one model more lightly, and the other more heavily, to see if there was a difference. I got VERY different drying results after 12 hours--nothing as nice as shown in the article. A fair amount of detail was lost on the heavier application, in fact, so I may be scrubbing them down with Simple Green cleaner to get back to the base surface.

Is there a difference in gesso's? Or do you think I should thin it? I had hoped to avoid that... just one less step to deal with.

I will say that the "surface feel" of the dried gesso is very rough, like a fine-grained sandpaper. Feels great.

Anyone else get results that surprised them like this, and did you find a solution?

James


As you see above I had the same issues as you with both white and clear. With that luck I have not tried black because I dont want to waste anymore money
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in southern England.

I use the white gesso with colours mixed in.

I don't thin it or glob it on thick. Any paintlike substance containing particles is going to build up a thicker layer when it dries down from a thicker glob.

So basically I paint it on and don't worry much about painting it very evenly.

I haven't had any problems that I recognise, with it drying too thick. Maybe I am less sensitive to loss of detail.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Madrak Ironhide







Kilkrazy wrote:I use the white gesso with colours mixed in.

I don't thin it or glob it on thick. Any paintlike substance containing particles is going to build up a thicker layer when it dries down from a thicker glob.

So basically I paint it on and don't worry much about painting it very evenly.

I haven't had any problems that I recognise, with it drying too thick. Maybe I am less sensitive to loss of detail.


*cougholdmaneyescough*

DR:70+S+G-MB-I+Pwmhd05#+D++A+++/aWD100R++T(S)DM+++
Get your own Dakka Code!

"...he could never understand the sense of a contest in which the two adversaries agreed upon the rules." Gabriel Garcia Marquez, One Hundred Years of Solitude 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in southern England.

Partly that, partly I don't care what individual figures in an army look like close up. That's not the way I use them.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




As for detail, if you look at some of the photos from the OP he was quite "sloppy" in glopping it on, and yet you can still make out every groove and bump on the model after only a few hours' drying time.

I went back to the shop where I picked up the "clear" gesso and exchanged it for the same stuff used by the OP. I'll try that tonight and post back how it goes. Perhaps it is quite different after all...

 
   
Made in us
Hellacious Havoc






NC

jamesmhebert wrote:As for detail, if you look at some of the photos from the OP he was quite "sloppy" in glopping it on, and yet you can still make out every groove and bump on the model after only a few hours' drying time.

I went back to the shop where I picked up the "clear" gesso and exchanged it for the same stuff used by the OP. I'll try that tonight and post back how it goes. Perhaps it is quite different after all...


Look forward to seeing/reading your outcome!
   
Made in us
Pewling Menial



Atlanta, GA/USA

I've been using the black gesso since the article came out. I've used it on the plastics that came with the necromunda box oh-so-long-ago, and all the resin bases I've been working with over the past few months. If I get it too thin, it will tend to not adhere all that great (even after washing the miniatures), but that's easily fixed by another second coat (this tends to happen on large even surfaces, not in recesses). No matter what, this is "thicker" on the model than a good spray primer, but I expected that.

Will I keep using it? Yes, on most models. Forgeworld models, with their amount of small detail... no... I'll keep using good spray primer for that. But most stuff - yeah.
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in southern England.

If you want to thin acrylic paint it's a good idea to do it with liquid acrylic polymer additive. This allows the thinned paint to have as much resin in it as unthinned, so it can form a good strong film on the model.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
Human Auxiliary to the Empire




Manchester, NH

I, for one, have been using this stuff for the past week or so and I love it. Conditions here in Maine are frequently cold, making this a great alternative. I will say that after you brush on your initial coat of the stuff, unthinned, you really do need to go back and brush out the gloppy sections. The article says as much. I got a large bottle of the stuff, certified non-toxic, at Wal-Mart for around $7. This is going to last me for a long while.

"Those too weak to follow their own dreams will always find a way to discourage others"

http://gamingimperium.blogspot.com/ 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
[.]






.

So many opposite reports!

It makes me wonder if we need more details here.

Type/manufacturer of Gesso.

Thinning agent used (if any).

Etc.?

   
Made in us
Human Auxiliary to the Empire




Manchester, NH

Brand: Daler Rowney Acrylic Gesso Surface Preparation Primer
Thinning Agent: None

"Those too weak to follow their own dreams will always find a way to discourage others"

http://gamingimperium.blogspot.com/ 
   
Made in us
Hellacious Havoc






NC

Alpharius wrote:So many opposite reports!

It makes me wonder if we need more details here.

Type/manufacturer of Gesso.

Thinning agent used (if any).

Etc.?



I agree and some pics would be helpful too of the different brands/types ect.
   
Made in us
Human Auxiliary to the Empire




Manchester, NH

I take back what I said about Gesso. It was obscuring so much detail, I Simple Greened my stuff and I'm starting from scratch with black primer again. I only noticed because my second tactical squad showed up and made me notice how much detail had been clogged by the stuff. Might have just been that brand. I'll use it to prime my scenery and that's it.

"Those too weak to follow their own dreams will always find a way to discourage others"

http://gamingimperium.blogspot.com/ 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




te3b0r wrote:
jamesmhebert wrote:As for detail, if you look at some of the photos from the OP he was quite "sloppy" in glopping it on, and yet you can still make out every groove and bump on the model after only a few hours' drying time.

I went back to the shop where I picked up the "clear" gesso and exchanged it for the same stuff used by the OP. I'll try that tonight and post back how it goes. Perhaps it is quite different after all...


Look forward to seeing/reading your outcome!



Sorry for the delay... had some family/health issues come up and Winter's been a rougher than expected.

I picked up a bottle of the same stuff shown in the thread by the OP. Unless the MFR has changed formulas, it would be no different.

My results are noticeably different, but only a bit better, with some more detail, but still nothing like the degree of fine detail he achieved. I work in Kansas, so it's either very humid (spring/summer) or very dry (winter) most of the time, with only a bit of nice humidity in spring and fall for short period. These paint trials were performed in winter, with very dry air.

I can only surmise that either (a) formula has changed; (b) a thinner was used. I don't really believe that standard deviations in temp/humidity would matter or the MFR would include cautions and tips on the bottle or their web site.

I will say this. The "tooth" of the surface is marvelously rough and "grippy," almost like a very fine wet sandpaper. And, it does a very, very good job of sticking to the surface. I tried it on a number of figures, metal and plastic, including an unprepped Lego alien of my son's (!), and the stuff is very difficult to scratch off. It is an excellent primer in that regard. With this and a few coats of paint and sealer/finish, I believe it would take a lot of effort to mar a paint job. I had to soak the Lego figure in Simple Green for an hour before I could scrub the stuff off with a toothbrush.

I don't believe I can achieve the OP's results (wish I could!), but I really like Gesso's tooth and adhesion so I think thinning it will be more than satisfactory for me. If I find otherwise, I'll post back. Late perhaps, but I will!

J



 
   
 
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