Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello All,
Looking for input and suggestions to my guardian heavy list. I'm an old Ulthwe player with an obvious affection for guardians that I just can't shake.

My idea is to field a non-static shooting list based around a farseer/avatar center. I've included 2 WLs as my anti-tank. The vypers are intended as cheap mobile support as well as last turn(s) objective deniers and general annoyance. My biggest dilemma is the counter assault element. Besides the Avatar, I was thinking the Harlequins with Shadowseer but not sure how effective this would be. Idea would be for Farseer to join them, fortune Avatar with Shadowseer protecting farseer and harlies. I don't currently own any harlequins at this point so wasn't sure how effective this really is as they are quite fragile it seems.

I've considered running Eldrad with a squad of fortuned banshees (which I do own) but then I'd be depending on two fortunes a turn to protect his unit as well as the Avatar. Other option seems to be farseer accompanying Scorpions but that seems to me to not utilize their useful infiltrate ability?

I play against a variety of armies in my local gaming store and am looking for a fun and fairly competitive list as most players there play with competitive armies. I Would appreciate any and all suggestions for improvement, weaknesses, etc.
Thanks!

HQ:
- Farseer w/Fortune, Doom, Spirit Stones (130)
- Avatar (155)

Elites:
- 5 Harlequins w/Kisses, Troupe Master w/Power Weapon, Death Jester, Shadowseer (224)

Fast:
- Vyper w/Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon (60)
- Vyper w/Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon (60)
- Vyper w/Shuriken Cannon, Shur iken Cannon (60)

Troops:
- 10 Guardians w/Scatter Laser (95)
- 10 Guardians w/Scatter Laser (95)
- 10 Guardians w/Scatter Laser (95)
- 10 Guardians w/Scatter Laser (95)
- 10 Guardians w/Scatter Laser, Warlock (120) - Warlock in this one for added wraithsight protection for the WLs

Heavy Support:
- Wraithlord w/ Bright Lance, Missile Launcher (155)
- Wraithlord w/ Bright Lance, Missile Launcher (155)

HAHAHA I like it!

I like it because its insane and would be hilarious and fun to play with.

Get rid of the ML on the WL, find something other than vypers for your FA maybe some shining spears I would say.


Good luck.

I'd question the choice of shuricannon x2 on the vypers. Doesn't mesh well with 5E vehicle rules...

I like it!

I've had a good amount of luck with vypers with EML, gives you a nice mix of anti tank and anti troop. Also they can sit back and fire from 48

H.Q

Consider Eldrad for your Farseer, it is an Ulthwe army after all.

Elites.

You cant go wrong with Harlies, though rending isnt what it was I like the Death jester, makes it a proper troupe rather than minimax.

Troops.

Hmm, include one unit of Storm Guardians with 2 melta guns. give some of the squads missile launchers and take two warlocks. This measn yuou can split the WEraithlords if you need to.

Fast attack.

I support the comments questioning two shuricannon. Take missile launcvhers so you can stay back at 48" range.

Heavy Support.

Ok, while this works I would prefer to recommend boosting the wraithlord in assault. Flamers and sword to go with your bright lance. The weakness of the two gun wraithlord is that it can be based esily and prevented from firing by a cheap tarpit unit. Flamers really help here.

I would include a D Cannon as the third choice, just the one. D Cannon are indirect fire, cheap and very nasty, hide it behind your lines as a 24" deterent to big stuff. Noone likes being on the receing end of a D Cannon. More to the point it increases your Guardian count.

The Harlies and Vypers will serve you little. For the Vypers, you'll need to get within 24", where you'll get blown like a stuffed nose, and 5 Harlies are NOT worth 224 points. You could get 10 Banshees for less than that. 10 Scorpions for goodness sake! 20 Guardians with upgrades! Warlocks! Yes, Warlocks would serve well. Warlocks in the squads, and maybe a council for the seer.

The Avatar I'm iffy on. You'll lose combats thanks to the Guardians, and the Avatar won't be able to compensate for all those wounds. The Avatar will need to take saves, and... it won't be pretty. You'll also be hard pressed to fit every Guardian unit in your 24" bubble of Fearlessness.

Warlocks will give you cover saves, a little bit of CC punch, and almost melta-like tank protection (S9 on rear armor of vehicles).

You also need more Anti-tank. Another Wraithlord would suffice.

Hi Tyerant, just a thought regarding past comments and list ammendments, I have a few ideas that you may like to try without substituting too much of your army, leaving it with the original feel, with perhaps a little more flexibility and punch.

Replace both the Harlequins and Vypers with the following:

Elite:
- 10 Striking Scorpions w/Exarch Chain Sabres (177)

Troops:
- 9 Jetbikes w/Shuri-Cannon x3 (228)

Now my thoughts behind this are that the Scorps will give your Avatar some much needed boost in CC, plus with the Seer in close prosimity throwing down Fortune on the unit, you have a VERY tough unit with lots of attacks. Remember those Sabres get to reroll to hit and wound. The Jetbikes on the other hand are a bit more survivable and still keep your punch while moving at full speed, which means they can respopnd to your flanks should the enemy get a bit cheeky, and they have the extra move after shooting to get them out of harms way. An added advantage is the turbo boost to get to objectives as they are also a scoring unit. This also comes to 1500 on the dot, so keeps with your points limit. Hope this helps without mucking your list around too much