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190 - Vulkan He'Stan (attached to Tactical Squad)
91 - Canoness, Eviscerator, Bolt Pistol, Cloak of St. Aspira (attached to Tactical Squad)
210 - Tactical Squad, Meltabombs, Flamer, Multi-Melta, Drop Pod
100 - Scout Squad, Heavy Bolter, 4x Bolters, 5x Camo Cloaks
195 - Battle Sister Squad, Vet, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Rhino, Smoke
195 - Battle Sister Squad, Vet, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Rhino, Smoke
219 - Dominion Squad, Meltagun, 3x Flamers, Rhino, Smoke
150 - Dreadnought, Heavy Flamer CCW, Drop Pod
150 - Dreadnought, Heavy Flamer CCW, Drop Pod

Why should Salamanders use WH allies. I'm sure that the allies don't benefit from Vulkan's combat tactics.

RAW they do. Vulkan removes Combat Tactics from all units that have it. Instead the army gains the specified bonuses. The way it is written, it doesn't matter if the unit had Combat Tactics or not. For example, Dreadnoughts do not have Combat Tactics, but it is the intent of his rule to give them Twin Linked weaponry.

If you compare to other unique Characters, many make the exchange as it specifies the word "exchange" in the description. But this word is left out of Vulkan's rule. and makes the change army wide.

Nuh-uh.

Cheesy would be sumthin like:

190 - Vulkan
100 - OH Inq Lord w/ combi-flamer + 3 Warriors w/ Flamers
85 - 5 Celestian, 2 melta
75 - OM Inq w/ combi-flamer + 3 Warriors w/ Flamers
170 - Tactical Squad MM/Flamer
170 - Tactical Squad MM/Flamer
60 - OH Inq Stormtroopers. 2 flamer
60 - OH Inq Stormtroopers. 2 flamer
60 - OM Inq Stormtroopers. 2 flamer
60 - OM Inq Stormtroopers. 2 flamer
150 - 3 MM Attack Bikes
150 - 3 MM Attack Bikes
150 - 3 MM Attack Bikes

Of course... it won't live through any kind of shooting... but it IS amusing

I don't think that list is even legal

If you are using Witch Hunters as the Parent, you can't take Vulkan, the Witch Hunters are an exclusive club for members and he isn't on the list.
If you are using Space Marines as the Parent, you have way too many Witch Hunter allies.

I'm sure that only units in the SM codex can benefit from the presence of Vulkan, but no allies. Toogs, don't refer to RAW. Long time experience tells me that GW will clarify this in an FAQ, soon.

List is legal. SM as base army - from which 1 HQ, 2 Troop, and 3 FA come from
1 HQ and 2 Troop from WitchHunters
1 Elite and 2 Troop from DaemonHunters

If you have to ask if something is too cheesy.....It probably is.

Orkimedes


I'm not sayin....I'm just sayin....

wuestenfux wrote:I'm sure that only units in the SM codex can benefit from the presence of Vulkan, but no allies. Toogs, don't refer to RAW. Long time experience tells me that GW will clarify this in an FAQ, soon.

It's definitely legal due to the wording of Vulkan's Chapter Tactics rule:

If you include He'stan than all units in your army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Instead, all thunder hammers in your army will count as master-crafted, and all flamers, heavy flamer, meltaguns and multimeltas count as twin-linked.


Your experience with GW might be different than mine--I still recall issues present from the beginning of 4th edition that were never clarified via FAQ. Judging by the quality of the last round of documents released, all bets are off as to what they'll bother addressing.

Here's another question: do combi-melta and combi-flamer shots count as twin-linked?

I don't have my 'dex on me, but as I recall his special rule states 'counts any melta or flamer weapon as twin-linked'.

Is a combi-melta/flamer a melta/flamer weapon? Yes.

I think this is pure cheese
vulkan - 190
master of the forge w power weapon - 115
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod w/becon- 160
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
10 man marine squad in pod MM/flamer- 205
10 man marine squad in podMM.flamer - 205
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150

2000 points on the nose.

Fist turn 6 twin linked MM and heavy flamers land on you, then the scoring units drop in later to take objectives etc.

Danny Internets wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:I'm sure that only units in the SM codex can benefit from the presence of Vulkan, but no allies. Toogs, don't refer to RAW. Long time experience tells me that GW will clarify this in an FAQ, soon.

It's definitely legal due to the wording of Vulkan's Chapter Tactics rule:

If you include He'stan than all units in your army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Instead, all thunder hammers in your army will count as master-crafted, and all flamers, heavy flamer, meltaguns and multimeltas count as twin-linked.


Your experience with GW might be different than mine--I still recall issues present from the beginning of 4th edition that were never clarified via FAQ. Judging by the quality of the last round of documents released, all bets are off as to what they'll bother addressing.

It says that all units lose Combat Tactics. But Storm Troopers don't even have Combat Tactics. I'm pretty sure that its not legal.

Heh. I like the min tactical squads to get your Drop Pod Assault number up.

That army bleeds kill points out of the wazoo though.

wuestenfux wrote:
It says that all units lose Combat Tactics. But Storm Troopers don't even have Combat Tactics. I'm pretty sure that its not legal.

It doesn't say anything about having to lose Combat Tactics in order for your weapons to become twin-linked. If this were the case then vehicles wouldn't benefit from it either. It simply says the army's flamer/melta/etc weapons are affected, there really isn't much ambiguity RAW.

Sushicaddy wrote:I think this is pure cheese
vulkan - 190
master of the forge w power weapon - 115
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod w/becon- 160
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
10 man marine squad in pod MM/flamer- 205
10 man marine squad in podMM.flamer - 205
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
5 man marine squad in pod - 125
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150
dread mm/heavy flamer in pod - 150

2000 points on the nose.

Fist turn 6 twin linked MM and heavy flamers land on you, then the scoring units drop in later to take objectives etc.

SM Tac Squads can only take Drop Pods if they number 10 models.

stjohn70 wrote:SM Tac Squads can only take Drop Pods if they number 10 models.

If memory serves couldn't he take minimum size assault squads? They can exchange their jump packs for a pod for no points, and a minimum size squad would only be 100, so that would actually give that list 75 more points to play with.

stjohn70 wrote:List is legal. SM as base army - from which 1 HQ, 2 Troop, and 3 FA come from
1 HQ and 2 Troop from WitchHunters
1 Elite and 2 Troop from DaemonHunters

Clever.

I like.

needs more double heavy-flamer chimeras and double heavy-flamer ironclad dreadnoughts, imo.

wuestenfux wrote:

Danny Internets wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:I'm sure that only units in the SM codex can benefit from the presence of Vulkan, but no allies. Toogs, don't refer to RAW. Long time experience tells me that GW will clarify this in an FAQ, soon.

It's definitely legal due to the wording of Vulkan's Chapter Tactics rule:

If you include He'stan than all units in your army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Instead, all thunder hammers in your army will count as master-crafted, and all flamers, heavy flamer, meltaguns and multimeltas count as twin-linked.


Your experience with GW might be different than mine--I still recall issues present from the beginning of 4th edition that were never clarified via FAQ. Judging by the quality of the last round of documents released, all bets are off as to what they'll bother addressing.

It says that all units lose Combat Tactics. But Storm Troopers don't even have Combat Tactics. I'm pretty sure that its not legal.

wuestenfux,

You're fighting a losing battle here. Anyone who isn't a complete douche understands the intentions behind the rule, they are for marines of that chapter only, hence why you'd lose combat tactics and gain CHAPTER Tactics, but until GW clarrifies it in a proper FAQ you're gonna get people being dicks about the Rules As Inteneded and the RAW. Let em stick to what they want, if they go out and buy the force and find out that over half their force now can't benefit from the rules that are intended for the space marine chapter as a whole cause the chapter has it's own code of combat and style of leading war, then guess who loses out. Not us, them. RAW is not Rules As Intended and Rules As Per Background Fluff. My solution, take out anything with a MM, and stay in high armour vehicles that the rest of his army can't actually penetrate and clomp on objectives and laugh.

Auretious Taak.