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HQ
Farseer- Ward runes, stones, doom, guide
X10 Warlocks
7 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
490
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
170

Farseer- Ward runes, stones, doom, guide
Warlocks x10
7 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
490
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
170

TROOPS
Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, shimmershield, bladestorm, defend.
177
Wave serpent- ELMs, stones.
155

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, shimmershield, bladestorm, defend.
177
Wave serpent- ELMs, stones.
155

1984

Farseers say: “You are doomed, I am guided. Here comes 7 template and 44 Witchblade attacks. You may sh*t yourself now…”

Very simple concept, get in your face and mince your meat.

Another way to do it would be to drop a farseer and retinue. Replace with 2 fully decked out banshee squads, and another serpent. Opponent now has to stare down 5 cuisine-arts… I mean, wave serpents.

Guide doesn't work on assault attacks, only shooting ones. Witchblades wound on 2+. Seer councils need Fortune, not Guide/Doom. Fortune also helps keep your Serpents alive.

Why 7 destructors? If you annihilate the squad you're assaulting with heavy flamers, you'll just die to shooting while you stand out in the open during your opponent's turn.

Dire Avengers are shooters, they should only get into close combat as a speedbump for incoming assault specialists, which you can't really do when everyone's in a wave serpent.

I'd drop a Seer Council, all but maybe two Destructors in it, and pick up another squad of Bladestorm Avengers.

Interesting list.

First off, with any farseer+warlocks squad, you want to give them fortune. 4+ I saves are nice, but they are just 4+ saves against anything that's ap 5 or 6 or -....so like every basic gun in the game. These squds are going to get ripped to shreds if you don't give them some additional protection. Fortunatly, it's easy to get in the form of fortune.

Next thing is 7 destructors. That's a hellacious amount of fire power in one unit. Chances are that anything you get to unload that on will be toast with a capital T. After that, there really isn't any point in assaulting because there won't be anything left to assault. In either case, at S5 with auto hitting, doom and guide are both of limited use to the squad and even several of the destructors are over kill. I would suggest dropping doom, guid, the spirit stones, and maybe 2 destructors from each squad. Cuts back on points spent towards things that may not really help you that much. Remember, if you fire the destructors, you can't run that turn.

With the seer councils running around and sucking up all the assault action, you shouldn't have to worry too much about your dire avengers ending up in hand to hand. To this end, I would drop the defend and shimmershield off of them. Those upgrades only slow down how fast you die in hand to hand. They don't actually make you any more dangerous.

Next up is the fact that you have a very very low model count in this army. Casualties are going to really hurt you a lot. You may want to take some of the points you shave off the other squads and invest in another squad of troops for holding back field objectives. Pathfinders work great for this role and guardians are not bad either (for the price).

Hope this helps out.

Wow. I fully expected this to be randed a cheese list. Was not ready for constructive criticism.

My thoughts with the butt-ton of destructors is redundancy. Using them to super-fry anything that has cover on the mind and when I lose a few, their firepower has not deminished, and no headway has been made on the real buffs of the squad. The guide/doom was more to aid the DAs in shooting, and shimmershields are to, like you guys said, make them a smidge harder to get rid of. The longer you deal with the DAs, the more time the warlocks get to do their work.

Trimming down like you say, I might be able to squeeze a half decent scorpion unit in the mix, helping out with the bodycount on my end.

Frankly, a Seer Council is a good anvil unit, but not a hammer unit. For competitive play, take one Seer Council and add Eldrad and Yriel. Very unfluffy, but this IS the uber council. Build the remaining force around it.

Yea, I do like uber, but still hate lame-drad.

HQ
Farseer- Ward runes, fortune
X9 Warlocks
3 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
425
Wave serpent- EMLs, stones.
155

Farseer- Ward runes, stones, doom, guide
X 9 Warlocks
3 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
425
Wave serpent- EMLs, stones.
155

TROOPS
Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, 2 catapults, bladestorm.
152
Wave serpent- EMLs, stones.
155

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, 2 catapults, bladestorm, defend.
152
Wave serpent- EMLs, stones.
155

Striking scorpions x10
Exarch- claw, stalker
192
Wave serpent EMLs, stones
155

Vyper x1
stones, shuri-cannon, scatterlaser

1996

More CC and some fast shooty.

Maybe I will dump the scorpions and get 2 stonger vypers, to soften up the foe before dropping the warlocks.

I'd drop the Scorpions as they are out of place. Replace them by a squad of Storm Guardians with dual flamers mounted in a Serpent.

Can you cast psychic powers from inside vehicles??

Edited last post, forgot the serpent for the scorpions

Yes, yes you can use psyhic powers inside tanks. It is encoulsged among eldar since most of their powers do not need line of sight, or directly benefit the tank itself

GeneralX wrote:Can you cast psychic powers from inside vehicles??

Yes, you can. A Serpent has no fire hatches and so the Farseer can only cast powers that do not require LoS.

You should drop the scorpion wave serpent, put the scorpions on foot with infiltrate/outflanking for 20pts then get either a 6 man unit of path finders that you can camp on an objective on your side of the board, or something like 10 guardians with a scatter laser that can camp in cover on an objective.

wuestenfux wrote:Frankly, a Seer Council is a good anvil unit, but not a hammer unit. For competitive play, take one Seer Council and add Eldrad and Yriel. Very unfluffy, but this IS the uber council. Build the remaining force around it.

This is legal?

Just a note, but points cost for the serpents are too expensive for the gear you have listed. Most seem over-priced by about 25 points unless I'm reading it wrong. In the latest codex, you only pay the cost 1 time for twin-linked weapons, and its a special cost for Wave Serpents that don't correlate elsewhere in the codex.

So there is about 100 free points for you, enjoy

Yes, Eldrad + Yriel + 1 pack of 3 to 10 locks is perfectly legal.

I would just cut the locks down to 5 or 6 and stick them in a Falcon instead of a Serpent. More bang for your points. If you run a second seer, you can do 2 little Jedi Knight councils like this.

Yes, they are both HQ; Lame-drad can have his own group of lemming warlocks and Yriel can join most any unit you want to put him in.
It does not make sense seeing as one is dead, and they are part of different craftworlds anyway, but yes this is legal.

I may have misread it when I made my spreadsheet, but as I understand it TL weapons cost 1.5 times the cost of the base weapon. This includes weapons for the serpent, besides I used the price in the codex for them.


Please list the error, I would love the extra points

DeathGryffin wrote:Wave serpent EMLs, stones - 155

Wave Serpent - 90
Stones - 10
Twin-linked EML - 30

x 4 Serpents on your list...100 points saved, enjoy.

Schweet. I had them priced at 115 for serpent, 10 for stones, and 30 fot TL EMS's.
Thanks Polecat!

I'll check my codex again and have a revised list up soon.

Full power to the destructors, Mr. Warf!

Looks like fun to play with and against. However, it is currently set up to be less fun in games against MEQ because you have little to deal with heavily armored infantry. Games versus MEQ will devolve into a grind rather than the swift, slicing strike that assault Eldar do best at.

before addressing cracking armor, I echo the call for Fortune on both Councils. Either Fortune them or be prepared to see them die quickly, do little, and take up lots of points in the meantime. The threats for this are not just CC: crashes, rapid fire and blast templates will all shred T3 models with a single 4+ save very quickly. Fortune on each unit, or not worth the points. Trust me, I've made the mistake before (used to play Ulthwe regularly) and paid for it enough to know there is no alternative. Also, you really don't need Guide on anything in this list. If you change nothing else, switch Guide for Fortune and you will have a much more durable unit. Doom is still useful, but moreso with Banshees (see below).

As for using named Special Characters: With recent editions, characters have been genericized in general, and specials characters represent archetypes more than individuals, with a few exceptions. This becomes even clearer with the new Marines, but the Eldar codex could be pointed out as where the pattern really began. Try fielding Eldrad with a different model: the rules are awesome, and so long as you're bringing the uber it's silly to hobble yourself. Models can compensate for aesthetic revulsion, and people will respect your choice much more if you have a cool custom conversion rather than the same old Eldrad model.

Aside from that, I would contend that you need more hammer to go with your anvils. Councils hold well, but fail to kill enough of anything with better than a 4+ save to make a big difference. To give you more hitting power, you should either:

Option one: Switch the Scorps to Banshees (you already have plenty of high-strength hits: you need armor penetration) or;

Option two: Ditch one Council, add PW/SS to both Avenger units (giving you three anvils) and add a unit of Banshees to the list, giving you both Scorps and Banshees. Scrap the spare Farseer for Yriel. Better yet, upgrade to Yriel and Eldrad. The character changes are optional for this set of upgrades, but consolidating your Councils and putting in more power weapons is crucial.

The first option will leave your list closest to what you already have. It will also be a bit of a grind and lack the cajones to make the investment in seers worth much against MEQ armies in general. The second will kick way more butt, and you will really enjoy playing it.

Yeah I have wave serpent with spirit stone and bright lance at 155 and with missile at 130

I thought witchblades were a fair sight better than PW because of the 2+ wound. If this is not the case I may go back to the base idea of 3 squads of banshees in serpents. never used banshees, nut i understand they are extremely fragile, even by eldar standards. With the council I tought more swings, better weapons, and more/better powers is good even at twice the cost. I have seen games where a council has wrecked half an army in 2 turns. Banshees usually get squashed within a turn of comming out of transport.

If Eldrad were "genericized" then every farseer out there would be able to do what he does.
The thing with Eldrad is that he is THE best psyker out there. As explained by GWs own fluff, the best psykers are the Elder, the best of those are the Uthwe, and the top dog among them is Eldrad, he simply outclasses the rest of the galaxy. Also, he is dead.

For some perspective:
I would love Michael Jordan to play for my team, but that does not change the fact that he is retired and does not live in my state. Do I deny that he is the greatest athelete on recorded history? No, I bow to his complete awsome-ness. I will however, have to get someone else to win me the game

Whew, sorry about that. We all have our "nerd-out" buttons, that is one of mine.


With this input, and some thought, I am stuck between these two lists


HQ
Farseer- Ward runes, fortune.
x9 Warlocks
4 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
400
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones. (90,45,10)
145


Farseer- Ward runes, fortune
X9 Warlocks
3 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
390
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

TROOPS
Dire Avengers x10
Exarch- 2 cats, bladestorm.
177
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, 2 cats, bladestorm.
177
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

FAST ATTACK
X1 Vyper- stones, shuri-cannon, EML (plasma)
85

X1 Vyper- stones, shuri-cannon, EML (plasma)
85

HEAVY SUPPORT
Fire prism- shuri-cannon, stones
135

1989


OR


HQ
Farseer- Ward runes, stones, spear, fortune, mind war.
X5 Warlocks
3 destructor, 2 enhance.
328
All crammed in the falcon

Farseer- Ward runes, fortune
x9 Warlocks
4 destructor, 2 enhance, 1 embolden.
420
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

TROOPS
Dire Avengers x10
Exarch- 2 cats, bladestorm.
177
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

Dire Avengers x10
Exarch, 2 cats, bladestorm.
177
Wave serpent- brightlances, stones.
145

ELITES
x10 Howling banshees
Exarch- mirrorswords, acrobatic, war shout
192

HEAVY SUPPORT
Falcon, shuri-cannon, starcannon, stones
175

1999

I was also thinking about 2 big jetbike squads, or shining spears for more of the hammer aspect while keeping with the mobile mech list. whadya think?