Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So combat squadding happens when a unit is deployed normally, and they can deploy seperately as per the codex, but it says "The one exception to this is a unit that arrives by Drop Pod. The player can choose to split such a unit into combat squads when it disembarks from the drop pod"

So, If I had a unit of 10 space marines with a drop pod transport, would I be able to deploy 5 of them with the drop pod and 5 of them seperately. Avoiding the argument of whether you can deploy half and hold half in reserve I will for simplicities sake say half come in deep striking in the pod and half come in from reserves on my board edge.

The question is, can a unit in a drop pod use the normal combat squad rules, and the exception for drop pod squads is just an extra allowance "the player CAN choose to split such a unit..." (as opposed to "MUST choose whether or not to")

Or does the fact that it's an exception mean the earlier rules no longer apply in this given situation.

This is written in perfectly understandable english how can this remotely confuse you, how do you actually begin to formulate this idea?

In short no, it is pretty clearly written when it disembarks

People have pretty much run the whole intention of combat squads into the ground and I think the whole thing will probably be rewritten, as i stands , no as it states when the unit disembarks i.e. in the process of leaving the drop pod as a unit as a whole they may split into two seperate but equal in the eyes of god units.

Despite Hollismason's emphatic appeal.....

I disagree. It says you split them during deployment, if you drop pod you *can* split them after disembarking. I see no language there that says it is the *only* time you can split them if they come in via DP.

Or more precisely, I see no language there that disallows the previous ruling about splitting them during deployment.

Hollis is right. When the unit disembarks it can be split into two 5 men squads.

coredump wrote: I see no language there that says it is the *only* time you can split them if they come in via DP. Or more precisely, I see no language there that disallows the previous ruling about splitting them during deployment.

How else would you do it then? Because their deployment is happening as they disembark from the pod.

insaniak wrote:

coredump wrote: I see no language there that says it is the *only* time you can split them if they come in via DP. Or more precisely, I see no language there that disallows the previous ruling about splitting them during deployment.

How else would you do it then? Because their deployment is happening as they disembark from the pod.

But the earlier rules given allow for deploying simultaneously from two locations, such as deep striking half and bringing half on from your board edge, I doubt anyone would argue that an assault squad could do such a thing, the only difference is how the drop pod exception which is allowing for 2 5man squads to jump out of a pod affects it.

Its no different than Deep Striking Terminators, and deploying their dedicated Land Raider either during deployment, or driving on. If you combat squad them during deployment without putting them on the board which is legal, they then become two seperate units who then have to declare their reserves/deployment decision seperately.

Are the same rules used for the Dark Angles and the regular Space Marine drop pods/combat squads?

If so, the Dark Angels FAQ has the direct answer to this question: "No, because squads which are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads."

Does that settle the issue?

Drunkspleen wrote:But the earlier rules given allow for deploying simultaneously from two locations, such as deep striking half and bringing half on from your board edge,

Except that the Reserves rules require that if you have a unit in a vehicle, you declare it as such when they are placed in Reserves... which happens before they are deployed, and so before they can be split.

So you can't have a single Combat Squad in a pod in Reserves, because at the point where you need to declare that they're in there, that specific unit simply doesn't exist.

solkan wrote:Are the same rules used for the Dark Angles and the regular Space Marine drop pods/combat squads?

No. C: DA contains a restriction that units in Reserve can't be split (hence the FAQ answer). C: SM contains no such restriction.

insaniak wrote:

No. C: DA contains a restriction that units in Reserve can't be split (hence the FAQ answer). C: SM contains no such restriction.

Actually, the funny thing is this latest FAQ got rid of that reference but then left that answer in the FAQ.


However if you just play the rule at face value (that units can only be split when deployed) then it doesn't allow for units to be split and part of them put into reserve.

You have to put the whole unit in reserve and then when it arrives it can be split. That also means if you've got a unit with a transport and you declare it is going to arrive from reserves in the vehicle you're not going to be able split the squad when it deploys (except for Drop Pods as they are an exception).

This is one of my pet peeves about rules 'discussions.'

Drunk, you are arguing two distinct parts of one rules block - combat squads - but only provide the quote for one part, and insist the unquoted and barely paraphrased other component of your argument allows you to do whatever it is you are doing. For completeness's sake, provide all the quotes from all relevant rules so that the construction of your argument can be seen by all. 'Cause right now it looks like you're pulling things out of your ass.

That being said, you provided the answer yourself. There are two key words in the following two sentences: "The one EXCEPTION to this is when a unit arrives by Drop Pod. The player can choose to split such a unit into combat squads when it DISEMBARKS from the Drop Pod."

The use of the word 'exception' makes null and void all previous referrences to when you make the choice to split squads. The second sentence then defines for you when you are allowed to make that choice within this exception-qualifying instant.

stop trying to bend the rules and play them as written.

the unit enters play in the drop pod, they can split into combat squads there and only then. not later not sooner.

So then, in a Dawn of War mission, at best two space marine units may combat squad? (Barring a Drop Pod)?

And since you can begin the game in a razorback, but can't combat squad until you deploy, then the 10 man Tac Squad that combat squads to get into said razorback may never start the game in it?

Breton wrote:So then, in a Dawn of War mission, at best two space marine units may combat squad? (Barring a Drop Pod)?

No, units in Reserve can be split when they arrive.

And since you can begin the game in a razorback, but can't combat squad until you deploy, then the 10 man Tac Squad that combat squads to get into said razorback may never start the game in it?

Only if they're in Reserves. If they're deploying onto the table, there is nothing stopping a single Combat Squad from starting in their transport.

And I strongly suspect that most people will allow a single Combat Squad in the transport in Reserves anyway, regardless of what the rules say.