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I really like Lootas, in fact I use as many as I can in every game!

I was playing a game yesterday against a really cheesey player; he used a whole army of "Grey Knights!" He was supposed to be playing Daemonhunters, but he didn't even use anything besides overpowered space marines. They're strength 6! All of them!

Here's my proposed changes to Lootas, to make them competitive:
1. They should be cheaper. Seriously how can they cost as much as a space marine, with just a 6+ save!!!!
2. Deffguns should be Str 9 and AP 2. They're supposed to represent lascannons and stuff right? They should at least be able to kill terminators and tanks.
3. They should be Troops. It's stupid that you have to take boys or grots just to claim an objective. They should also be able to be taken as an HQ.
4. They need to be able to move as jetbikes.

But seriously, folks!

Everyone knows Lootas are just about the greatest unit ever, but why are they all so alike? Each one has a super kustomized gun that's really just an autocannon?

Here's what I would do with them:

A squad of lootas contains between 5 and 10 lootas, and uses up an elite slot. Up to two lootas may become meks for +10 points. They use the same options as the meks currently in the Lootas entry. The squad may have a nob for +5 points. He may exchange his LootaShoota for a Big Choppa for free, and may take a bosspole and/or 'eavy armor for +5 points.

For +2 points a model, the squad may be upgraded with "Looted Armor," which upgrades their save to 5+.

Lootas each cost 5 points base. They must be upgraded with one of the following weapons:

LootaShoota ..... +5 points
Deffgun..... +10 points
Lazzer Beem..... +20 points
Gattla..... +10 points
Air Missul..... +15 points
Heet Ray..... +15 points
Bomb Chucka..... +10 points

The LootaShoota is something made from bolters, shootas, pulse rifles, and other small arms.
Range: 24" Str 4 AP 6 Heavy 2 or
Range: 12" Str 4 AP 6 Assault 3

The Deffgun is something made from an autocannon, or a bunch of long range weapons that aren't particularly related.
The Deffgun's profile is in the Ork codex, obviously (it's an autocannon with D3 shots)

The Lazzer Beem is something made from a lascannon, a brightlance, a multimelta, or a similar energy weapon.
Range: 48" Str 7 + D3 AP 2 Heavy 1, Gets Hot!

The Gattla is made from heavy anti-infantry weapons, such as heavy bolters, heavy stubbers, and shuriken cannons.
Range: 36" Str 5 AP 5 Heavy D6 -1

The Air Missul is an interesting weapon, made from weapons such as mortars, missles, and plasma cannons.
Range: 18" - 60" Str D6 AP 6 Heavy 1, Indirect, Blast, Pinning

The Heet Ray is a more portable weapon, made from meltaguns, plasma guns, and fusion weaponry.
Range: 12" Str 7 AP 2 Assault 3, Melta, Gets Hot!

The Bomb Chucka is another portable weapon, made from grenade launchers, regular grenades, and the occasional bomb squig.
Range: 18" Str D6 6 Assault 1, Blast

Optional Rule:
Lootas may be taken as Troops in a deathskull army.
A squad of lootas taken in this manner may not have more than 1 Deffgun, Lazzer Beem, Gattla, or Air Missul, unless the squad numbers ten models, in which case the squad may have up 2 such weapons.
A squad of lootas taken in this manner may not have more than 1 Heet Ray, or Bomb Chucka unless the squad numbers ten models, in which case the squad may have up 2 such weapons.
Lootas taken as elites in a deathskull army remain unchanged.



Any comments? Advice? I'm aware that many of these options wouldn't be taken by anyone trying to play competitively, but I'm hoping it would add some variety to Loota squads, and allow people with their Lootas converted for the 3rd edition codex to continue using their models.

The Lazzer Beem and Heet Ray both fill kind of hole in the ork army; anti-tank and AP 2. I tried to balance this out by making the Lazzer Beem expensive, and the Heet Ray both short ranged and not Str 8 or AP 1 against tanks.

Do you think that any of the weapons I came up with could be spammed across the board worse than deffguns? Like I said, I tried to make Lazzer Beems too expensive to fill the table with. Also, would allowing them to be troops be too much, even with the fairly heavy restrictions in play?

Any advice would be welcome.

Orkeosaurus wrote:I really like Lootas, in fact I use as many as I can in every game!

I was playing a game yesterday against a really cheesey player; he used a whole army of "Grey Knights!" He was supposed to be playing Daemonhunters, but he didn't even use anything besides overpowered space marines. They're strength 6! All of them!

Here's my proposed changes to Lootas, to make them competitive:
1. They should be cheaper. Seriously how can they cost as much as a space marine, with just a 6+ save!!!!
2. Deffguns should be Str 9 and AP 2. They're supposed to represent lascannons and stuff right? They should at least be able to kill terminators and tanks.
3. They should be Troops. It's stupid that you have to take boys or grots just to claim an objective. They should also be able to be taken as an HQ.
4. They need to be able to move as jetbikes.

ha ha. youre a funny guy

do lootas really need to be changed? they are pretty good as is. i dont like any of your changes at all. it makes things far to complicated in what is an easy and simple unit. the idea is that they just bolt everything together and fire it all at once. the statline of a deffgun can represent that while some shots are very high strength, others arent, but it all evens out.

also orks are supposed to have trouble dealing with tanks. thats thhe weakness of their army. stop trying to fix that. theyre supposed to have it. everything else is pointless. light infantry are killed by deffgunz. MEQs are killed by deffgunz. MCs are killed by deffgunz. even light vehichles are killed by deffgunz. add this to the fact that you can use any ork model with a rediculously big gun to represent a loota, there is no need for any changes.

i love the lootas as they are.
they are cheap enough
and because they are made from various weapons doesent mean they work like them

I'd play against it if someone wanted to try it (not sure on balance without playtesting, although my gut says those Heet Rays are too good).

To keep it in style with all the other specialty armed units in the ork army I would probably not allow mixed weapon types, so the whole unit would have Lazers or deffguns or whatever.

Jack

I think the stat line of the Deffgun already represents the fact that they're cobbled together from various other weapon designs. The S7 as more like an average of all the strengths of the weapons in the mob.

An option to fire the Deffguns in various "modes" would be cool though.

dakka mode: S4 AP5 Heavy d3+3
Regular mode: Current rules
Zap mode: S9 AP2 Heavy 1 gets hot!

Yeah, looking back on this, it's all way to complicated for a regular game. Everyone is used to lascannons, missle launchers, plasma guns, etc, but probably don't want to try and remember a looted varient for each one.

It might make for an interesting scenerio though. Some sort of "deathskulls got into your armory" type of thing.

Also, as a logistics question, would you make one roll and have all the guns in the unit based off of that roll, or would each weapon type roll individually, or (don't choose this one) each model individually?

It seems like a cool idea, but it would definitely not be that great to play with, due to the looking up nature of them. Another problem is that you would need to do lots of playtesting to make it balanced. Also, making it possible for all of the squad to take the same option makes it easy, and quite possible to just take the "best" option, and it would look like the same thing, just with (possibly) a different squad.

Brian P wrote:I think the stat line of the Deffgun already represents the fact that they're cobbled together from various other weapon designs. The S7 as more like an average of all the strengths of the weapons in the mob.

An option to fire the Deffguns in various "modes" would be cool though.

dakka mode: S4 AP5 Heavy d3+3
Regular mode: Current rules
Zap mode: S9 AP2 Heavy 1 gets hot!

i like this idea it allows some nice anti infantry and anti tank without being to complicated

My only issue with the "Fire modes" idea is mostly that they're already an awesome choice and hardly need more felixibility to be valuable (and that dakka mode is some rediculous anti infantry firepower )

I would prefer having the mob have a couple different weapon options they might purchase, rather then letting them adapt to nearly anything on the fly, alhough then they would likely even more completely eclispe burnas and tankhuntas...

Jack