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Just out of curiosity what are all of you SM players out there equiping your main HQ (the HQ choice you use the most.) with? You can include a retuine.

Here is mine

Captain:100pts
Power Fist 25 pts
Storm Shield: 15 pts
Auxilliary grenade Launcher: 15 pts
Artificiator Armour: 15pts

Sub total: 170 pts

Command Squad: 115 pts

Standard Bearer: 15pts
Melta Gun: 10 pts
Champion : 15pts
2x Marines with Power Weapons: 30 pts
Apothecary
sub total: 185pts

Total: 355 pts

Post you own or any comments you have.

I equip him with Moondrakkan.

Lysander doesn't let me take other options.

Am I the only one who doesn't use special characters?

No, I'm sure you're not, but many people run "specialized forces" that are built around special characters' abilities. If you look at what the Marine Specialist HQs are equipped with, their point values are very similar to a basic HQ with the bonus addition of whatever their magic rule is. So you can have a cool and powerful army that is "special" plus a cool and powerful guy that kicks ass, or you can have a regular army with a regular guy that also probably kicks ass, although maybe not as much.

I'm a big fan of the basic Librarian, with the 5+ save power and the teleport power. Just a hoodbearer, cheap and necessary vs. Lash.

I basically run a Librarian with terminator armor and storm shield. I'd prefer another one in larger games (2000 pts) over any other SM HQ.

My Space Marine Commander comes in two flavors: Lite and Full Flavor.

Marshal Lite - 146pts

Marshal w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades, Iron Halo, Holy Orb of Antioch

Full-Flavor Marshal (with Reclusiarch & Command Squad) - 808pts

Marshal w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades, Iron Halo, Holy Orb of Antioch

Reclusiarch Chaplain w/ Bolt Pistol, Frag Grenades, Crozius, Rosarius

Command Squad (10)
Veteran Sergeant w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades
Company Champion
Apothecary
Initiates (7) w/ 2 Meltaguns
[Furious Charge x12]

Land Raider Crusader w/ Smoke

* * * * *

The Full-Flavor Marshal and Friends is a STEEP price tag. I've fielded him...once, maybe twice. Usually, I field Grimaldus or Helbrecht as soloists, but the sheer power of this command squad is disgusting.

10 Str5 Init6 and 7 Str5 Init5 Power Weapon attacks that all reroll to hit is amazing. I usually tone the squads down when actually field them (how often are those 2 Meltaguns going to fire, anyway? And how often will the Marshal need a 4+ Inv in a squad he can hide in?), but I thought I'd show the most grossly overpiced kill-squad possible.

CK

sourclams wrote:No, I'm sure you're not, but many people run "specialized forces" that are built around special characters' abilities. If you look at what the Marine Specialist HQs are equipped with, their point values are very similar to a basic HQ with the bonus addition of whatever their magic rule is. So you can have a cool and powerful army that is "special" plus a cool and powerful guy that kicks ass, or you can have a regular army with a regular guy that also probably kicks ass, although maybe not as much.

eh I see your point. I tend to not run them just because I feel a certain attachment to the commander I made. That and the fact he has a few more opptions than the special HQ.

Command Squad (10)
Veteran Sergeant w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades
Company Champion
Apothecary
Initiates (7) w/ 2 Meltaguns
[Furious Charge x12]

Land Raider Crusader w/ Smoke

Better take Assault Termies with thunderhammers. Much more effective than normal Marines.

I have been running "Shrike" since my 2 Lightning Claw Chappy is no longer legal, and infiltrating a 10man assault squad off the board edge is fun.

Otherwise it is a Librarian with Force Weapon, terminator Armor, the str 10 large blast ability, and Gate, who runs with terminators.

I have not made a new commander for the new codex yet, but I was thinking maybe a Thunderhammer/Storm Shield Chapter Master with Full retinue of Relic Blades/Thunder Hammers, or a Biker Captain/Khan. So many cool options to choose from though, the coolest of which are unfortunately special characters.

Wehrkind wrote:
Otherwise it is a Librarian with Force Weapon, terminator Armor, the str 10 large blast ability, and Gate, who runs with terminators.

I like this guy too. - Especially with storm shield (in case vortex of doom goes wrong!). Vortex of Doom is small blast marker though isn't it?
Still, its a goody. Make him an epistolary too so he can gate and then doom. Mwahahahahaa!

Corpsman_of_Krieg wrote:My Space Marine Commander comes in two flavors: Lite and Full Flavor.

Marshal Lite - 146pts

Marshal w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades, Iron Halo, Holy Orb of Antioch

Full-Flavor Marshal (with Reclusiarch & Command Squad) - 808pts

Marshal w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades, Iron Halo, Holy Orb of Antioch

Reclusiarch Chaplain w/ Bolt Pistol, Frag Grenades, Crozius, Rosarius

Command Squad (10)
Veteran Sergeant w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades
Company Champion
Apothecary
Initiates (7) w/ 2 Meltaguns
[Furious Charge x12]

Land Raider Crusader w/ Smoke

* * * * *

The Full-Flavor Marshal and Friends is a STEEP price tag. I've fielded him...once, maybe twice. Usually, I field Grimaldus or Helbrecht as soloists, but the sheer power of this command squad is disgusting.

10 Str5 Init6 and 7 Str5 Init5 Power Weapon attacks that all reroll to hit is amazing. I usually tone the squads down when actually field them (how often are those 2 Meltaguns going to fire, anyway? And how often will the Marshal need a 4+ Inv in a squad he can hide in?), but I thought I'd show the most grossly overpiced kill-squad possible.

CK

Chaplain, "The Chaplain"
Master of Sanctity
Crozius Arcanum, Thunder Hammer, Crusader Seals, Rosarius
Adamantine Mantle
Artificer Armour
Holy Orb
Jump Pack
Terminator Honours

Chaplain, "The Chaplain when he used to ride a bike."
Reclusiarch
Crozius Arcanum, Crusader Seals, Rosarius
Artificer Armour
Space Marine Bike
Terminator Honours

For a Marshal I like Helbrecht. You can combo Meltaguns in there but it is such a strong unit for close combat maybe the points are better someplace else.

As for the regular codex, if all you want is a Beat Stick, may as well take Lysander. The Khan gives you the Furious Charge bonus for a walking Captain. If you want a Chapter Master with mobility you are looking at Lightning Claws and Thunder Hammers. I would say this is a pretty good one if you want all the bells and whistles.

Chapter Master
Space Marine Bike
Artificer Armour
Thunder Hammer
Auxilliary Grenade Launcher
Digital Weapons
Hellfire Rounds

// 240 points

They should have kept the option of Terminator Honours for Chapter Masters at least. *shrug*.

wuestenfux wrote:

Command Squad (10)
Veteran Sergeant w/ Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades
Company Champion
Apothecary
Initiates (7) w/ 2 Meltaguns
[Furious Charge x12]

Land Raider Crusader w/ Smoke

Better take Assault Termies with thunderhammers. Much more effective than normal Marines.

Actually, you'd be surprised -- I know I was.

Here's the following configurations I compared:

Marshal -- 135pts
Terminator Armor, Lightning Claw Pair

Terminator Command Squad (7) -- 354pts
Veteran Sergeant -- Combi-Melta
Terminators (6) -- Assault Cannon (2)
[Tank Hunters x8]

vs.

Marshal -- 136pts
Iron Halo, Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades

Reclusiarch Chaplain -- 97pts
Bolt Pistol, Frag Grenades

Power Armored Command Squad -- 277
Veteran Sergeant -- Lightning Claw Pair, Frag Grenades
Company Champion
Apothecary
Initiates (7)
[Furious Charge x12]

* * * * *

My results led to an interesting conclusion. The math showed that in a protracted fight, the Terminators are clearly superior, with their 2+ Armor Save and Power Fists carrying the day in a fight of attrition. However, the disparity was equal and opposite when considering each squad contacting an enemy MEQ unit via a charge.

Assuming each unit is riding in a Land Raider Crusader (which is the premise off which this argument is built -- if slogging, Terminators are clearly the winner), it is more than likely that the Command unit will initiating the Assault. This means that a Power Armored Command Squad with Furious Charge actually does better than a Terminator Command Squad. Though this disparity is only by a small margin (1.1 MEQ), keep in mind that the Power Armored Marines are swinging at Initiatives 5 and 6, whereas the Terminators only have the Marshal and Veteran Sergeant making their attacks before Initiative 1. This leaves the Terminators susceptible to high-initiative power weapon attacks, much like the 4 that the Power Armored Command Squad can field.

In short, the Terminators win in a battle of attrition, and against T7+ critters. The Marines win in a decisive first-strike Assault using Init5 and power weapon saturation.

CK

My favoured build:

Master of the Chapter

Power Sword
Combi-Plasma

125 pts

I think of this as Azrael Lite, given the similarity of the weapon loadout.

Other common builds:

Master of the Chapter
Storm Bolter
Power Fist

130 pts

Tactically inefficient, looks awesome, nice little flavour nod as he wields the standard Terminator loadout.

Librarian

Space Marine Bike

120 pts

He doesn't need anything else - mainly because his role is adding a bit of punch to the rapid response Ravenwing section of my army.

space marine commander:
artificer armour, 2 lightning claws, melta bomb, jump pack

squad:
10 assault marines, 1 plasma pistol, 1 flamer, power fist

and if I have the points:
added chaplain with jump pack

Its the only CC heavy unit in my army the other squads are tacticals and scouts supported by drop pods and rhinos

My personal favorite is quite simple:

Space Marine Captain 165
-Bike
-Relic Blade

Quick, easy and cheap. Plus i'm a bike nut so now i have more troops

This is what I usually run:

Captain Torrus(138)
-Storm Bolter(3)
-Power Sword(15)
-Artificer Armor(15)
-Melta Bombs(5)

Command Squad(160)
-Company Champion(15)
-Company Standard(15)
-3x Flamers(15)
(I sometimes add a power fist)

In short, the Terminators win in a battle of attrition, and against T7+ critters. The Marines win in a decisive first-strike Assault using Init5 and power weapon saturation.

CK

Good analysis. That's quite true. But did you take into account the costs of the units?

Captain Torrus(138)
-Storm Bolter(3)
-Power Sword(15)
-Artificer Armor(15)
-Melta Bombs(5)

Command Squad(160)
-Company Champion(15)
-Company Standard(15)
-3x Flamers(15)
(I sometimes add a power fist)

Small squads don't cut it. Did you give it a transport?

wuestenfux wrote:

In short, the Terminators win in a battle of attrition, and against T7+ critters. The Marines win in a decisive first-strike Assault using Init5 and power weapon saturation.

CK

Good analysis. That's quite true. But did you take into account the costs of the units?

Well, seeing as how both squads are going to ride in a Land Raider Crusader, I felt it unnecessary to incorporate the 268 points it would take to give em Smoke Launchers and throw them on the field.

The Power Armored Squad is only slightly more expensive (20 points), and is therefore the better buy in my opinion. However, if you plan on slogging, the Terminators are going to be more survivable and therefore better worth the points investment.

CK

wuestenfux wrote:

Captain Torrus(138)
-Storm Bolter(3)
-Power Sword(15)
-Artificer Armor(15)
-Melta Bombs(5)

Command Squad(160)
-Company Champion(15)
-Company Standard(15)
-3x Flamers(15)
(I sometimes add a power fist)

Small squads don't cut it. Did you give it a transport?

I might put them in a drop pod or razorback.

My HQ is tooled up as follows:

Captain - 155
- Combi-Melta
- Relic Blade
- Artificer Armour

Command Squad - 185
- Company Champion
- Razorback /w Extra Armour

Comes to 340. I'm curious as to why so very few people choose to make use of the Relic Blade?

I use the chpater master (orbital bombardment works VERY well for me) and a chpalin. Here what I got.

HQ: 320
1. Spacemarine Chapter Master: 125
.Combi-melta: 10
.power fist :25
.artifact armor: 15
Hellfire rounds:10
Digital wepons:10

Chaplin: 100
Plasma pistol: 15
Digital wpons:10

My favourite weapon loadout for a captain is relic blade + storm shield and artificer armour. This gives him some serious staying and hitting power.

However, it also means that he costs 160 points. For 30 points more you can get vulkan, who twin-links all of your meltaguns, flamers, and mastercrafts your THs...so why not take him instead? That's fully worth the 30 points.

My second favourite is the good old fashioned naked librarian with gate and avenger. You can also give him termi armour and a storm shield for 40 points, and make him substantially more survivable, then deepstrike him in with some assault terminators