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Is there any hardcore legit reasons to take a minimal squad size? Yeah, obviously not so great for hordes, but what about Fearless CSMs? What about 3 Min sized squads in a wedge formation, so the first squad takes any hits, and the rear squads counter assault, or just for getting a large number of special weapons?

The reason I ask is because I always prefer smaller numbers, so mixing that with vehicles, or even just having the ability to have plague marines, noise marines, berzerkers, and raptors all at once for variety (and to keep painting modding interesting), as oppossed to boring old 30 Plague Marines... or 20 Plagues and 10 noise...

Let me know your thoughts and opinions!

If you are going for hardcore Power gaming, it is always better to take the min amount of models in a squad. The reasons are many but the biggest is that you can spread out your fire so that you never waste shots. Also under the current rules, there is no consolidation into combat so smaller units die in one turn leaving the assaulter out in the open.

Ahh... ok... well my main goal was to actually just build small squads for pleasure\converting\painting, but I always like to look out for potential as an army.
Anyways, wouldn't it be beneficial to have high numbers though if you want your Sgt. to use his Power Fist, or to break through an enemy squad? Plus, its easier (I'm speculating) to pull off a charge with a big unit vs 2 smaller units combining a charge.

Small units == easier Kill Points for your opponents.

Small units == more units for objective claiming/contesting.

Much depends on the army in question, but one of the risks of small units is that they don't bring enough *punch* to the party; this is especially true for CC units, as small units can be rendered impotent with just a few casualties.

If you're looking for general rules, shooty units may get away with fewer bodies/unit, while assault units will often benefit from more bulk.

Is it like a KP per squad? or based off points or what?
Cuz if a 10 man squad takes 2 turns to kill, and 2 separate 5 man squads take a turn to kill each, then the time you bought is equal. Just gotta know how the KP differs

Clthomps wrote:If you are going for hardcore Power gaming, it is always better to take the min amount of models in a squad. The reasons are many but the biggest is that you can spread out your fire so that you never waste shots. Also under the current rules, there is no consolidation into combat so smaller units die in one turn leaving the assaulter out in the open.

this would be true if it were not for a few things.

Firstly, wound allocation. You dont get to just take off whichever models you like now. If i can do enough wounds to a small squad, i can force you to take armour saves on models with special weapons or champions. Its really quite easy to do. Having more special weapons doesnt mean anything if the guys with them are dead.

Secondly, Kill Points. If you take large numbers of small squads you will rack up your kill points hugely. It then follows that you will do significantly worse in those games. Having that much of a disadvantage needlessly is something that you really have to think about. (This is one of the reasons KP has been included in 5th, otherwise small squads of fearless (or near fearless) infantry would dominate the game)

Finally, small squads dont cut it in assault. Numbers really matter when you get into combat (otherwise hordes wouldnt be so scary) and small squads are likely to get wiped out when charged or be unable to cause enough of an impact.

You have to get the balance right. there isnt much point taking a single squad of 5 Berzerkers and then expecting them to perform well, they wont, they need to be in big squads, but it would be fine to take a minimum sized squad of noise marines for a cheap blastmaster (even though its not my favoured setup).

I think an army composed entirely of 5-6 man squads went the way of the dodo when 5th came out. You can do it, but you will suffer for it.

Looking at this from a guard standpoint, small squads are limited to vets piled with special weapons, dropped behind the enemy to kill something big, and then die horribly.

The kill points are just a band-aid over a festering wound. It looks like its been taken care of, but its only getting worse.
My little 600pt IG army has 8 KPs, where the AoBR SM, 585pts: 4 KPs.

kill points are not the answer, to fix the mini squads, a major ruleset overhaul is nessicary.

Large squads are more capable of assaulting multiple units, obviously I think that rule replaces the fact they can't consolidate into combat.