Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm about to enter into a campaign tournament with a player who I am pretty sure is cheating. I've been through the Templar codex and I just want to ask a few questions of the more experienced marine players (I play orks), to see if what he is doing is allowed anywhere that I haven't looked. I want to be absolutely sure before I accuse someone of cheating, as it would get him thrown out of the campaign or possibly worse.

1. Are codex chapters allowed to take land raider variants that are not in their specific codexes? The player in question uses the redeemer version, with the flamestorm (hellstorm?) cannons.

2. What is the deal with the Vows that the Templar's can take. Can more that one vow be taken? What do the vows really do anyway?

3. Is there anything that allows THE ENTIRE ARMY to reroll hits? He claims that its "just something that the templars get", and I haven't been able to find anything about it anywhere, and it really doesn't seem possible.

4. What weapons can Templar dreadnoughts take? Plasma cannons, autocannons, I'm just not sure.

Also, what are the general downsides to the Templars? How I've seen them played, they seem to have no weaknesses.

So Dakkaites, tell me the truth. What's going on and just how many rules is he making up.

I don't play Black Templars myself nor do I know anyone that does but I do have their codex on hand...

1. Are codex chapters allowed to take land raider variants that are not in their specific codexes? The player in question uses the redeemer version, with the flamestorm (hellstorm?) cannons.

Honestly I'm not sure on this as the only unique chapter in my play group is Space Wolves and he don't use Land Raiders much, if at all. Sorry for no help here :(

2. What is the deal with the Vows that the Templar's can take. Can more that one vow be taken? What do the vows really do anyway?

Vows are army wide bonuses that the Black Templars get. Each Vow costs extra points (varies per vow) and you can only choose one of the 4 vows for the game. One such vow gives a bonus to strength but comes with a penalty to initiative. An other Vow is the question to the next question...

3. Is there anything that allows THE ENTIRE ARMY to reroll hits? He claims that its "just something that the templars get", and I haven't been able to find anything about it anywhere, and it really doesn't seem possible.

There is a Vow that provides this special rule to all Black Templars. However it only applies in close combat. This Vow also costs the most amount of points but its only real downside is you must always charge into close combat if possible.

4. What weapons can Templar dreadnoughts take? Plasma cannons, autocannons, I'm just not sure.

Standard Dreadnought stuff here. Storm Bolter, Assault Cannon, LasCannon, Flamer, MultiMelta, etc
Not sure if you are looking for a specific thing here...

Also, what are the general downsides to the Templars? How I've seen them played, they seem to have no weaknesses.

Black Templars give up a lot of the Space Marine ranged combat abilities to become more close combat focused. Plus they also become a bit uncontrollable at times as well. Black Templars have to test for morale whenever anyone dies, but they get a extra uncontrollable run for passing morale tests so thats a mixed bag. Black Templar infantry also have to test to see if they can fire at anything else other than the closest enemy which can really weaken their shooting ability even more if the opponent deploys right.

However I will say that there is not a Black Templar player in my local area so my only "experience" with them is via youtube battle reports so take my opinion as a grain of salt.

Lokiami wrote:I'm about to enter into a campaign tournament with a player who I am pretty sure is cheating. I've been through the Templar codex and I just want to ask a few questions of the more experienced marine players (I play orks), to see if what he is doing is allowed anywhere that I haven't looked. I want to be absolutely sure before I accuse someone of cheating, as it would get him thrown out of the campaign or possibly worse.

1. Are codex chapters allowed to take land raider variants that are not in their specific codexes? The player in question uses the redeemer version, with the flamestorm (hellstorm?) cannons.

No. Each codex is an army unto itself unless the codex says they can pull units from another codex (like the Space Wolves, Witch Hunters and Daemonhunters codexes, for example). The Templar codex has no exceptions allowing a player to take a LR Redeemer from the SM codex.

2. What is the deal with the Vows that the Templar's can take. Can more that one vow be taken? What do the vows really do anyway?

The Emperor's Champion is allowed to buy vows which affect the entire army. You're going to need to read the codex to get a full picture of their rules.

3. Is there anything that allows THE ENTIRE ARMY to reroll hits? He claims that its "just something that the templars get", and I haven't been able to find anything about it anywhere, and it really doesn't seem possible.

Yes, one of the vows does give Templars preferred enemy which allows them to re-roll their hits in CC.

4. What weapons can Templar dreadnoughts take? Plasma cannons, autocannons, I'm just not sure.

Again, you should pick up a copy of the Templar codex (or just browse it in the store) and check out what weapon options are listed there.

Also, what are the general downsides to the Templars? How I've seen them played, they seem to have no weaknesses.

So Dakkaites, tell me the truth. What's going on and just how many rules is he making up.

Templars are a pretty good army in 5th edition because although they don't get some of the cool new toys of the SM codex (like 3+ save storm shields) their old school style codex means they have a lot of little tricks that can still be utilized that no other SM army (besides the Space Wolves) can pull off. Also the change of 'preferred enemy' from a straight 3+ to hit in combat to a re-roll in combat is a HUGE boost to the army, as a re-roll is by far more useful against a much wider array of enemies.

As for their weaknesses, they have all the weaknesses that basic marines have: namely high points cost basic model that is still vulnerable to low AP or massed firepower.

Templars also don't have several units available to them like the Whirlwind or Scout squads. They also don't have sergeants in their units which means that even though they can still take a Powerfist guy in the unit, in the new rules this model is stuck with 1 attack or 2 on the charge. . .which is not so hot for a CC oriented army.

Their special morale rules can also be used against them by forcing units holding objectives to run off them. In addition, Templars are the only army that still has to pass a Ld test (at a -1 even) in order to fire at any unit but the closest one.