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Hello all - I'm new to the forums, so if this question has been answered elsewhere, please direct me to the right place:

During an assault where there are multiple units AND multiple initiatives, who gets to attack? Is it based on who was able to attack just before any dice are rolled, or is it based on who is still within attack range after the faster initiatives are resolved?

For example, let's say I have a unit of 6 Assault Terminators, all wielding Thunder Hammers. Now let's say I have a second unit of 6 Assault Terminators, all wielding Lightning Claws. Now lets say that BOTH terminator units are simultaneoulsly attacking a big fat unit of 20 basic Orks. The initiative order will be first the Lightning Claw termies, then the Orks, then the Thunder Hammer termies.

Let's say the Lightning Claw termies kill 12 Orks. The Ork general decides to remove all the Orks that were in base contact with the Thunder Hammer termies. When he's finished removing casualties, the Thunder Hammer termies are more than 5 inches away from the remaining Orks.

Do the Thunder Hammer termies still get to attack because they had been in base to base at the outset of the fight? Or do they NOT get to attack because they are now too far away from the surviving Orks?

They cant attack because when it comes to their initiative order there are no models in base contact for them to attack. Likewise if something is killed before its initiative order it will not be able to attack.

See page 41, "Multiple Combats". Who gets to attack, and which units can be attacked, is determined before anyone gets killed that round. Also see page 35, "Working out which models are engaged in combat is done at the start of the fight, and will not change unti its end..."

A model doesn't get to attack on the two conditions:
1. It's dead.
2. ALL of the units (not the models, but the units) it was engaged with are wiped out. Technically, the model could still attack, but since there's no one left to kill, you'd just be rolling dice to roll dice.

The thunder hammer termies in your example still get their attacks since there are still 8 surviving orks to attack.

Eliminating the ork models in contact with the terminators is the worst thing that the ork player can do because:
1. A greater than 12" seperation is required for pile-in! to fail at the end of the round.
2. Sweeping advances no longer require being in base to base at the end of the round, but rather only require engagement at the beginning of the round.
3. The ork player is eliminating the models which would have been able to attack.
There are more reasons, but it's just simply an aweful idea which does not work in any way under 5th edition.

Wow the two of you just told me completely opposite things. I'm inclined to agree with Solkan, but there is a person in my gaming group who is saying the same thing that Regwon contends. Is it possible that Regwon and my friend are simply remembering something from an earlier edition of 40K? The rules on page 41 seem quite clear to me, indicating that all models that were able to attack before dice were rolled will still get to attack regardless of casualties.

p. 35 wrote:
Who can fight?
...
*Models in base contact with any enemy models.
*Models within 2" of at least one model in their unit that is in base contact with any enemy models.

All engaged models will fight in this turn's Assault phase with their full number of Attacks. . . .

Solkan has the right of it. There is no more "you don't get your attacks because I removed the model(s) in btb w/you." That was 4e.

Regwon wrote:They cant attack because when it comes to their initiative order there are no models in base contact for them to attack. Likewise if something is killed before its initiative order it will not be able to attack.

The first half of this would only be correct if we were still in 4th edition.
The second half, however, still holds true in 5e.

Eric

Yep, Regwon gave you the 4th ed answer. solkan gave you the 5th ed answer...........

Also remember you can remove models from anyplace in the squad, not just the ones that are engaged up front.