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Hey all!
I have a Word Bearers army in the works, mostly figured I was just painting for fun, and wouldnt ever get around to using them (at least til a new codex came out) But here I am, plotting out army lists and such, and I had an idea.

I have to go from 1000pts to 1500pts, So far I have:
Terminator Sorcerer w/ warptime
4 Terminators (chainfist, powerfist, lit claw, hvy flamer, combi flamer)
5 marines w/flamer, IoCG
10 Marines w/ Hvy Bolter, plasmagun, IoCG, Rhino
8 berzerkers in Rhino
Predator w/ Twin Las/Hvy Bolters
Comes to 998pts.

Daemons (though not as good as they used to be) were my next thought and great for the background of the Word Bearers, and for 230pts I could get a Greater Daemon and 10 Lessers to cause havoc, maybe add in some bikers with 2x meltas, Champion w/ Powerfist and maybe an Icon of Khorne to hurt things more, but Ive been torn lately.

Ive had this idea to pack 10 Plague Marines w/ 2x Plasmaguns, Champ w/Powerfist, and an Icon, into a Land Raider. I can already hear some of you, "why not put the berzerkers in there, it would be much more beneficial for the charge". Well, I can definitely see the merit of that, but what about 16 bolter shots, 4 plasma shots, 3 heavy bolter shots and 2 lascannon? Whatever's left of the squad they hit, if much as all, shouldnt be able to cause that much trouble if they charge a full squad of T5, 3+, 4+ FNP, fearless troopers right?
I want to stay away from the daemon princes/oblit cookie cutter build that everyone's using too, I know it works, but I want to try other things.

Anyone have any luck with this build? Please bring comments or suggestions for this army!

Well, I see PM more as a defensive unit due to their lower initiative.
On the other hand, Berzerkers are good in assault (at least vs MEQ).
I don't see any benefit from your build.

If all you want is for your plague marines to rapid fire their bolters, use a rhino, if you want to assault, use a landraider. I would put the berzerkers in the landraider. While plague marines are good in assault, they are better at receiving a charge than berzerkers are, and berzerkers are better at charging than plague marines. Hope this helps.

I'd expand that 5 man chaos marine unit before you do anything else. 5 guys with a flamer and no rhino are going to be sitting in the backfield picking their butts. Either give them a plasma gun for the better range, or better yet, expand them to 10 guys, give 'em another flamer and a fist champ (maybe even with a combi flamer!) put them in a rhino and let 'er rip.

I find that the transport capabilities of a Land Raider are wasted if non-Termies are transported.
Besides, Berzerkers could be one exception to this rule.

Perturabo's Chosen wrote:If all you want is for your plague marines to rapid fire their bolters, use a rhino, if you want to assault, use a landraider. I would put the berzerkers in the landraider. While plague marines are good in assault, they are better at receiving a charge than berzerkers are, and berzerkers are better at charging than plague marines. Hope this helps.

I completely agree. PM are supposed to be attacked ;-)
Shooting can be done from a much cheaper Rhino.
Assaulting is what makes a LR great. That's not the forte of PM.

wuestenfux wrote:I find that the transport capabilities of a Land Raider are wasted if non-Termies are transported.
Besides, Berzerkers could be one exception to this rule.

I'm not sure whether I agree completely. Unless the opponent has AP3 or S8 weapons, PM are sturdier than normal terminators (Sv3 + FNP equals Sv2 in that case, yet they have T5 instead of T4). So you can fit twice as many PM in a LR. That's better if the purpose is speed bumping/tar pitting.
In case of an assault, I'd very much prefer berzerkers to terminators, also because you can fit twice as many.

wuestenfux wrote:Well, I see PM more as a defensive unit due to their lower initiative.

It's not bad if you're planning on shooting only. But that's a job for Rhinos.

i wouldnt waste points on a decent transport for the plagues, they can take a fair beating, so a rhino will do.

save the raiders for zerkers or termies (to get them there faster)

I guess what it really comes down to, is that I have this Death Guard army which, under the old codex, I converted the crap out of, but under the new rules, a lot of units converted dont apply like they used to. I was thinking this might be the best way to get use out of the land raider. I have puttied all kinds of details and nasty guts and crazy stuff on it, so to use it for berzerkers doesnt seem fitting.....y'know? That's kind of why I was thinking about this.

Anything else?
T-

If you're definitely not going to use 'Zerkers, put termies in the LR. There's nothing unfluffy about termies and they'll still bring the heat. I think putting PMs in a rhino is the better bet, still.

Trogdor the Burninator wrote:Hey all!
I have a Word Bearers army in the works, mostly figured I was just painting for fun, and wouldnt ever get around to using them (at least til a new codex came out) But here I am, plotting out army lists and such, and I had an idea.

I have to go from 1000pts to 1500pts, So far I have:
Terminator Sorcerer w/ warptime
4 Terminators (chainfist, powerfist, lit claw, hvy flamer, combi flamer)
5 marines w/flamer, IoCG
10 Marines w/ Hvy Bolter, plasmagun, IoCG, Rhino
8 berzerkers in Rhino
Predator w/ Twin Las/Hvy Bolters
Comes to 998pts.

Daemons (though not as good as they used to be) were my next thought and great for the background of the Word Bearers, and for 230pts I could get a Greater Daemon and 10 Lessers to cause havoc, maybe add in some bikers with 2x meltas, Champion w/ Powerfist and maybe an Icon of Khorne to hurt things more, but Ive been torn lately.

Ive had this idea to pack 10 Plague Marines w/ 2x Plasmaguns, Champ w/Powerfist, and an Icon, into a Land Raider. I can already hear some of you, "why not put the berzerkers in there, it would be much more beneficial for the charge". Well, I can definitely see the merit of that, but what about 16 bolter shots, 4 plasma shots, 3 heavy bolter shots and 2 lascannon? Whatever's left of the squad they hit, if much as all, shouldnt be able to cause that much trouble if they charge a full squad of T5, 3+, 4+ FNP, fearless troopers right?
I want to stay away from the daemon princes/oblit cookie cutter build that everyone's using too, I know it works, but I want to try other things.

Anyone have any luck with this build? Please bring comments or suggestions for this army!

I really don't think demons are worth bringing anymore.

They're just not as good as all the other uses for those same points. They're unreliable and not particularly good for anything. They have no guns, no special guns, no powerfists, no power weapons, etc. Only a 5+ invulnerable save means that they'll die twice as quickly to anti-horde fire as regular marines.

Greater Daemons are a bit less useless, but they also have some major drawbacks. They can only foot-slog, they must kill one of your champions or characters to come into play, and it's random when they Must appear.

I don't think it would break someone's army to field a Greater Daemon, it just looks a bit sub-optimal.

If I bother buying a champion for a squad then it's important to make the squad stronger, and probably carrying a powerfist or a doom siren or something.

If your Greater Demon kills a doom siren champ to come into play, his cost is at least 165 points. (100 + 65 points of a doomsiren/PW Noise marine champ.)

For 155 points you can get a winged demon prince of slaanesh with a Lash psychic power, with more speed and no randomness.
Or to do the same thing as the G. Demon, a Nurgle Daemon Prince w/ whatever close-combat stuff you need.

If I did wanted a model to specifically sacrifice for it, it'd be a naked CSM champ in the back-field holding an objective or whatever, while my elite squads like berserkers are getting stuck-in. This wouldn't put the demon in a good spot to kill the enemy though. I wouldn't kill off my specialized squad leaders for it, it'd take away half of their versatility.

Obliterators will outperform a greater daemon pretty easy. They're flexible on weapons and can even deep strike behind the enemy if you want, or in your zone and start shooting on turn 1 (unlike a G. Demon)

Greater Daemons are useful when you want to over-whelm your opponent with Monstrous Creature targets.

That being said, the fact that the GD can't move on the turn it's summoned really limits its usefulness as anything but a target.

willydstyle wrote:Greater Daemons are useful when you want to over-whelm your opponent with Monstrous Creature targets.

That being said, the fact that the GD can't move on the turn it's summoned really limits its usefulness as anything but a target.

Yeah, it's first move will likely be on turn 3 or turn 4 or turn 5.

It's first assault will quite often only be near the very end of the game (if at all.)

I'd much rather have a 105-point 3 combi-melta terminator unit.

The opponent wouldn't know where my termies will appear, they could appear behind a landraider and blow it to pieces on the same turn. A LR won't be killed by a greater demon unless your opponent falls asleep.