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I'm a huge IP law hippie. I support shorter copyright terms, greatly expanded fair use protections, a reworking of the patent system, and weaker trademark laws. But I nevertheless hate the typical internet justifications for piracy that are popping up in this thread. Unless you beleive copyright terms should be shorter than they have ever been in the last two centuries, it's impossible to defend selling (or giving away) recasts of GW miniatures.

Perhaps I'm being overly simplistic (and if so, call me on it!) but I think that everyone who has thought about IP policy supports the existence of copyright protections lasting for at least a quarter century, meaning that virtually everything Games Workshop has ever made is entitled to protection. They've spent a lot of time and money devising models, paints, fluff, rules, etc, and it's unlikely that they would have been able to create such a rich game system if they had no legal protections.

Overly harsh or restrictive laws can be bad for society, but that doesn't mean the solution is to abolish law.

And, coming at the other side:

Centurian99 wrote:Yep, its a harsh word. Yep, I chose it deliberately. And I also consider unauthorized dubbing of videos, unauthorized downloading of MP3s etc., to be theft.

I'm talking about a qualitative difference, not a quantitative one. Theft is theft. If I came over to your house and took a paperback book from you without your permission, that's theft. If I take your computer or your entire 40K collection, that's also theft.

I strongly disagree with the use of the word "theft." We're talking about non-rivalrous goods here; you're not taking my paperback, but photocopying it and leaving me with the original. This is the heart of the difference between intellectual property and real property, and the language we use should reflect that distinction. I'll readily concede that commercial recasting is both illegal and immoral, but "theft" brings in a lot of real property analogies that I don't believe should be brought into the discussion. (Actually, I think the very term "intellectual property" creates a lot of bad analogies, but the term is common enough that it's a lot easier to accept it and move on.)

Centurian99 wrote:Let's not beat around the bush here...if you recast models, you're stealing from GW. May not seem like much, but the principle remains the same. I guess you can try to argue that certain kinds of theft are okay, when other kinds aren't, but to be honest, unless you're stealing to keep your family fed because you have absolutely no other options, I can't think of a whole lot of ethically defensible theft.

Well, to follow your metaphor, if you use cardboard counters to represent units (which is totally doable in Fantasy, and is not impossible in a 40k setting) you're also "stealing" revenue from GW. This illustrates the problem with that metaphor. It's not about giving GW a certain amount of money, it's about respecting their IP. I would love to play against a 40k army made entirely out of green stuff, but I would not be happy playing against a 40k army made out of suspiciously light Tyranids.

Centurian99 wrote:And let's continue not beat around the bush here...if you're stealing from GW, then you're stealing from all the individuals whose labor went into producing the game, sculpting the models, promoting the models, manufacturing the models, etc.

"Stealing" metaphor aside, I completely agree with you here. The "GW hobby" is a sort of community you form with Games Workshop and your fellow players. GW is actually a very liberal company with regards to their intelectual property; they not only allow you to mess with their IP but they actually encourage it, showcasing conversions, homemade rules and fluff, etc. I'm not going to go around condemning miniatures people cast to play with in their basements, but if they want to take that stuff out and bring it to a pick-up game at my store, I'm going to be upset.

If you want to get all Kantian, you can only support a practice if it could safely be engaged in by everyone. If everyone cast their own miniatures, GW would collpase, and I would never have a new IG Codex. That's why we need to respect IP law. :-)