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Greetings,

Decided just tonight to take part in a tourney this Saturday. I'm playing around with some ideas since I wanted to shake up my old list. For me the exciting and new things are the KFF (I'm a SAGer at heart) the Battle Wagon, and my first ever use of Ork special characters. I'd love to hear the reactions of a few people as to the playability of the list.

Ghazghkull - will be placed in trukk with MANz
Big Mek w. KFF - will ride in BW

5 MANz w. dedicated RPJ, Ram Trukk
15 Lootas

1 Deffkopta w. TL Rokkits
1 Deffkopta w. TL Rokkits
1 Deffkopta w. TL Rokkits

Battle Wagon w. 2 Big Shootas, RPJ, and Ram

19 Shoota Boyz w. PK, BP Nob and 1 big shoota. Will ride in BW and serve as shooting platform.
12 Choppa Boyz w. BP, PK Nob in RPJ, Ram Trukk
12 Choppa Boyz w. BP, PK Nob in RPJ, Ram Trukk
12 Choppa Boyz w. BP, PK Nob in RPJ, Ram Trukk
22 Choppa Boyz w. BP, PK Nob (they would be shootas but I just don't have the right models at the moment)


The basic strategy is that the deffkoptas serve as an early turn one distraction by using scout and their excellent mobility to start popping tanks (or at least trying to look like a credible threat to waste ammo on).

The Battle Wagon moves up as a mobile fire base, offering screening to the footsloggin mob behind it and the trukks that circle around it like eager attack dogs...attack dogs who must stay close due to a cowardly fear of being shot without their happy KFF cover bonus. Trukks break off to attack targets as needed and the boyz in the BW rumble around shooting up anything I don't wish to assault. The footsloggin' mob is hopefully a nice unwounded hammer come turn 3-4 since I expect MANz and a BW will be distracting for most artillery.

The Lootas stay in the back and do what all Lootas always do...which strangely enough isn't looting things. The Grots...well, I had the odd 50 points left over and I figure at the very least they can hold an objective on my side and go to ground if fired upon.

I happily appreciate all critiques and name calling...though I reserve the right to cry (manfully).

Regards,
Thor.

Edits: Grots were dropped, and 'Ard Boyz were made less 'Ard. That allowed me to buy 5 additional Lootas. I'm still unsure about the Lootas since they'll be standing around alone int he back as my only real stationary shooting unit. I suppose it's reasonably debateable that the BW group will be fulfilling a similar function and will absorb some of the abuse, I'm just uncertain on the Lootas survivability. Maybe I should shrink down the footsloggin' mob a bit (or toss them entirely in order to field a large pile of grots) and use that as a objective holder on my side with excess points going somewhere brilliant I am unsure of. Thoughts?

Why the odd numbers of boyz? 13 and 22 seem a bit random. Also, Trukks can only carry 12 models or six MegaNobz.

10 Lootas is not enough. You need at least 15, or 45 if you're really competitive.

'Ard Boyz aren't worth it. It's only a 4+ armour save, which a lot of guns can ignore, and it's worthless against heavy bolters in particular.

You do need to work on this a bit.

Hmmm, the 13 is due to stupidity when I typed out the list. I'll edit that.

22 has been a number I've grown fond of for footsloggin' mobs, it is large, has a reasonable cost, and doesn't get too constricted on the board. I submit it's intrinsically no stranger then choosing 20 boyz save for the English numaeric system's love of the 10.

I have found my Lootas to be of mixed success in the past, you probably have a good point about beefing up their numbers.

Generally speaking I use the 'ard boyz armor for when they get into close combat. In assault the 50% chance to shrug off damage can be quite potent. I do agree it's useless against guns, which is why I feel all 'ard boyz need to have a transport.

I am acutely aware I need to work on it a bit, thanks for the ideas.

As I wake up the next morning and look at the list again it feels that a couple problems become more clear to me.

First off is the Deffkoptas - I really see no reason not to split the three of them up into their own individual units. It will give me more mobility with them and force my opponents to sacrifice an entire unit to shoot up one deffkopta if he wants to deal with it.

My second realization is that my grots are one or two shots from losing Fearless - so whether or not they're taking a 3+ cover save they could be having some problems fairly quickly. Clearly I need to either beef up their numbers, or toss the unit and try something else.

The elemental made of cheese did convince me I should probably have more Lootas or toss them entirely. I think I need the dakka support, but I'm well aware Orks operate better when they offer the opponent target saturation. As it stands I'll have one unit standing in the back shooting - pretty much begging him to infiltrate some scouts or deepstrike something onto them.

I'll edit my initial post to showcase some of my "now I've had sleep" brilliance.

Thor665 wrote:
First off is the Deffkoptas - I really see no reason not to split the three of them up into their own individual units. It will give me more mobility with them and force my opponents to sacrifice an entire unit to shoot up one deffkopta if he wants to deal with it.

um killpoints. specifically you just turned 1 potential killpoint into 3.

Thor665 wrote:

My second realization is that my grots are one or two shots from losing Fearless - so whether or not they're taking a 3+ cover save they could be having some problems fairly quickly. Clearly I need to either beef up their numbers, or toss the unit and try something else..

I am caffeine deprived but I don't think grots have mob rule.

olympia wrote:
I am caffeine deprived but I don't think grots have mob rule.

Just the lack of coffee talking. Grots have Mob rule, and thank Mork (or perhaps Gork) for that, as it makes them pretty good at holding objectives whilst under heavy fire.

Edit: Great googly moogly! I totally cheated someone last tourney I played at. Your doubts made me doubt my own doubts and when I searched out the FAQ you were correct. Grots do not get Mob Rule. Mea Culpa indeed.

gardeth wrote:

Thor665 wrote:
First off is the Deffkoptas - I really see no reason not to split the three of them up into their own individual units. It will give me more mobility with them and force my opponents to sacrifice an entire unit to shoot up one deffkopta if he wants to deal with it.

um killpoints. specifically you just turned 1 potential killpoint into 3.

That is a good point, but Orks tend to offer up a lot of killpoints in any case - especially with all the trukk boyz I'm going to be bringing in. But do you think the difference between 14 KPs and 16 KPs is major? I suppose the deffkoptas are somewhat fragile, but at least with the three mini squads I don't have to take a leadership test after losing one. I'll take this into consideration.

You can mitigate the killpoint problem by how you choose to deploy the Deffkopters. They will be a liability in any KP mission if they are on the board serving as the fire magnets you'd use them for in objective games. Instead, try having them infiltrate and outflank. It will keep them from going down early, and they'll still most likely come out in range of something worthy of their attention. If nothing else, they can support a squad of boyz on the charge.

The worst case scenario here would be that they come in on the wrong board edge, out of range of any targets and have to spend a round turbo-boosting.

Greetings,

I have returned from the tourney where i ended up fielding the following 1850 list;

Warboss - PK, BP, Squig, Eavy Armor, Cybork (joins footsloggers)
Big Mek - Burna, KFF (rides in BW)

13 Lootas
12 Lootas

5 Warbikers w. Bp, PK Nob
3 Deffkoptas - TL Rokkits

Battlewagon - RPJ, Deffrolla, 2 Big Shootas

3 Mobs of Trukk Boyz, RPJ, Ram all with BP PK Nob
19 Shoota Boyz w. BP Pk Nob and Rokkit (rides in BW)
20 Shoota Boyz w. 2 Rokkits and BP PK Nob

I ended up fighting a IG tank based army for a win, a Tau Crisis SUit army for a win and a Green Tide style Ork army for a narrow loss. All in all I placed 4th in a field of 16 or so, so I feel fairly decent about that. I do have to offer thanks to the suggestion I opt for more Lootas, as that did work out fairly well (though the other Ork player's combo of two maxed sets of Lootas plus two SAG Meks in Grot Mobs did have me doubting my own dakka output.

I have heard some claims on the boards about the relative strength of a BW as a dakka platform, and I have to say I never felt it. Even sawing though mobs of boys I was only removing small handfuls, and certainly my Warbikers were performing almost as well shooting and my Lootas were doing better. In retrospect I might have preferred charging with the shootas in the BW save for the use of it as a KFF transport...though I suppose I could have always separated him from the unit and left him embarked. The Warboss and his mob worked pretty well as objective grabbers and holders while the trukks, bikes, and deffkoptas flitted about and rained havoc on my assorted foes.

Overall I did like the BW itself, and I may very well convert over to a true believer on the KFF Mek vs. the SAG Mek, that cover save was pretty sweet all around. I think for me the biggest failing of the list was a) its inability to deal with multiple 30 boyz mobs and b) the overall lackluster showing of the dakka BW. Maybe my Mek will just go in a trukk next time.

Regards and thanks for the suggestions,
Thor.