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So I'm dealing with a lot of exorcists, cheap CC units with eviscerators etc., and jump troups. No immolators or pitiful engines or elite HQ choices anywhere. Some storm troupers with special weapons have given me a little trouble. I run a very balanced list but for whatever reason I still have trouble with them. Any suggestions (and do you need more info)?

Have you tried separating your force. A couple of broods of genestealers coming in on the flanks can really disrupt your opponents plans. Make sure you have extended carapace in this situation due to the amount of flamers and bolt weapons that will undoubtedly be headed your way. Also, a couple of fast assault units would work well to tie up their hard troops (I was thinking hormies and raveners). A flyrant would also cause them some grief as sisters tend to not bring many lascannons or plasma (from what I have seen). Hope this helps.

I actually am using on average, 2 squads of 10 stealers with carapace and outflank and feeder tendrils. There are virtually no lascannons so I'm not too worried about those. My followup question for you is this: Have you had success with raveners and genestealers? I've been wondering about those little expensive lead guys...

If you are rocking a few MCs, keep the exorcists glanced, and focus on the seraphim and transports with the rest of your shooting. Otherwise, keep your troops out of 24" unless you are charging in; Sisters don't do ANYTHING outside 24" unless they are packing HBs, which only HS or Elite girls can do.
Really watch those seraphim too; their flamers are deadly with their mobility and their ability to go AP1.
Once you have the exorcist's weapons removed and have softened up the girls for assault rush in full bore. Sisters are scary from 1"-12" away, but poor in melee. Stay out of that sweet spot as much as you can.

From the Sister's side.1850 point turny
Monsters, Hive tyrant's retnue will keep the exorcists busy. My first Nid game, 3 lictors were placed in combat with 2 of my battle squads. (2of3) The sister's repentia w/ Eviscerator sux. They can only run into close combat. They have a 4+ save. Shoot them until you kick their butts in Combat. They strike Int1. Rush forward, Their strength is 1"-12" (see other SoB postings). Tie them up with combat, Use the no shoot at units with models in cc.
I have a mechanised army and have never ran Seraphim squads.

I have realized that their sweet spot is in the midrange. Long range they don't have much and what they do have is pretty easily demolished and in close if you overwhelm (and by that I mean 2 to 1) they're pretty screwed too. And now that you mention it, it actually is the flamers that I want to counter. I've completely dropped hormagaunts in 5th because of fearless saves. I've charged in with leaping cc warriors (rending, scything, extra I) and I always do well but it really is the eviscerators that equal out the combat.

He has at least 15 meat shield troops that are S5 and while they do strike at I1 they still always have plenty of attacks to either equal out combat or win by one or two, thus causing anything and everything I have in CC to take additional saves.

My sweet spot with shooting is in theirs and they win, hands down, so I can't take the shooting route. And with the book and all the other upgrades they take all the negative modifiers are taken as positives so pinning doesn't work too well either... Fast attack seems to be the way to go but I'm still looking for a few more options. Any other suggestions?

raveners are fast no doubt about it. And with their potential 24" charge it could get you into combat faster than warriors with leaping (since they don't have fleet). I personally don't use them but against sisters they may be useful for tying up some of their heavies. Put a flyrant in with them so they stay in synapse range (no ID). Lictors combined with the raveners also could help (assault together then they all reroll misses). Some outflanking stealers to keep them from destroying your fast attack once they win combat and heavies at the back (fexes) to deal damage from afar and, if you get lucky, pin them with your barbed stranglers.

hmmm, i wanna make this list now!!

The problem with raveners is that they sit there and get shot at once they arrive. I give mine devourers so they can shoot but they don't last long with a 5+ save. Lictors are always great but once their jump troops get in the mix the lictors are toast... The whole 'faith points' thing really has a habit of unbalancing everything.

deepstrike is bad for raveners, give them cover saves from gaunts then assault (and if possible stay in synapse range to prevent ID from powerfists and such). I don't face sisters at all, but the way I see it is to engage them asap since your going to lose a shooting match...ie lots of lictors, raveners, leaping or flying warriors and a winged tyrant. outflanking stealers too.

Cant you prevent fearless CC save on your hormies by winning combat? < You do that by giving +1I, +1s & +1ws

Razerous wrote:Cant you prevent fearless CC save on your hormies by winning combat? < You do that by giving +1I, +1s & +1ws

Well you do realize that by giving hormagaunts all that stuff you have a 14pt model that's T3 and has a 6+ save... I don't know how you do it but for me those guys die pretty fast, even at the hand of weak sisters. If you lose even 3 of those on the way over you've immediately lost thirty some points. And once they get there they're still basically never going to truly win because sisters are basically, in most cases, an unmodified Ld9. That's hard to break and hormagaunts are just too expensive.

And Lukus, deepstrike IS indeed terrible for raveners. I found that out the hard way during my first game having raveners. I'm actually right with you in placing them behind gaunts and keeping them linked up with a leaping warrior squad. Haven't tried it yet, but I was going the same place with that.

Well you do realize that by giving hormagaunts all that stuff you have a 14pt model that's T3 and has a 6+ save... I don't know how you do it but for me those guys die pretty fast, even at the hand of weak sisters. If you lose even 3 of those on the way over you've immediately lost thirty some points. And once they get there they're still basically never going to truly win because sisters are basically, in most cases, an unmodified Ld9. That's hard to break and hormagaunts are just too expensive.

And Lukus, deepstrike IS indeed terrible for raveners. I found that out the hard way during my first game having raveners. I'm actually right with you in placing them behind gaunts and keeping them linked up with a leaping warrior squad. Haven't tried it yet, but I was going the same place with that.

I face Sisters pretty much on a regular basis with 'nids. I run a shooty 'Nidzilla army with 2 HT, 3 dakkdaflex, and 2-3 sniperflex (will use biovores sometimes for 1 heavy just for a chance at killing some tanks). Best thing so far against them has been 4+ units of Genestealers outflanking and Heavy Carniflex with Bonded Exoskeleton (+1 Toughness). Bonded Exoskeleton really shines since highest str weapon they have is str8 (need 3+ to wound you) and once in CC, none of their sisters can hit the 'flex except those units with Eviscerators. My biggest problem with sisters has been dealing with the Tanks until either 'stealers can get in to them or the MC.

Excellent advice there. I actually have a LOT of success with my 3 biovores. People forget about them but they are the only 48" gun we have. On average they kill one tank and about 4 sisters from fortunate scattering. On your stealer broods how many in each squad and what biomorphs are you putting on them? Typically I'm running 3 broods of about 10. Is that anything like what you're doing?

My biggest problem is their dedicated CC squads and jump troops. If I leave my CC fex alone they eventually kill it with the eviscerator. If I help them out with other units like leaping warriors they survive but there's just so many of them it's hard to corner any unit. My friend Chris is also a very smart player so I can never catch him off guard...

I modified my 2k list recently to the following:

2x Hive Tyrants w/VC and TL devourer and (2) guards
3x Dakka flexes
4x8 Stealers (no mods)
1x10 spinegautns WON
2x Sniperflex
1x3 Biovores w/bio-acid

Are you sure that venom cannons and devourers are a good idea on the tyrants? I had devourers and a strangler and found that I either had 2 choices:

1. Run to get him in devourer range and waste the 36" range

2. Fire with the 36" gun (VC or BS) and waste the devourers until about turn 3 or 4.

I've been running 2 sets of devourers and running the tyrant, thus putting a lot of extra pressure on and it's worked very well. It gets them into assault range quickly and doesn't waste any of their gear. Have you tried that with any success?

Also, have you used boomfex's with any success? I've been running 2 in my list and they've done very well against most everything. I'm just curious to see if you've had any success or if you prefer dakka's.

Otherwise I like the list. I hate not having upgrades on stealers because they're so expensive as is but I guess saving 5pts. per model gets me an extra 2 in a small brood.

Good ideas and I'm definitely going to use the dakkafexs

Against sisters the dakkafex should be superior to the boomfex, as would a flyrant with the twin linked devourers. Give it a go mixing in with some lethal cc choices. Hope it wins!!!

Until recently I did run 2 TL devourers on both of my HT but the problem was half my army (all cept the 2-3 sniperflex) couldnt shoot anything on turn 1. I needed more rhino busting power at range so changed out to 1 TL and VC. I haven't had much luck with boomflex, the scatter dice hate me and I find dakkaflex with 8 str6 shots much more appealing. Even if the dakkaflex cant shoot til turn 2 or 3, I use them mostly (depending on scenario) for dealing with "Saint Celest of I'll be back and flame you again" and other DS units.

The sisters I mostly play against are a "pure" sister list so he usually had about 13+ faith points to spend.

That's a lot of faith points... The sisters I play against usually only have around 7 points to use. For whatever reason the scatter dice usually love me so the boomfex does quite well. Lets face it, there's nothing in our list that will take out even guard carapace armour let alone power armour. I don't like the idea of not shooting the first turn either but I don't like only using only one of my two weapons just as much.

In the end its the exorcists that will give you most trouble isolate your army away from em and try to take em out 1 by 1 Refused flank mabye?

Razerous wrote:Cant you prevent fearless CC save on your hormies by winning combat? < You do that by giving +1I, +1s & +1ws

Nope, thats almost immpossible.

I tried it too, hormaguants=worthless

Lukus83 wrote:Against sisters the dakkafex should be superior to the boomfex, as would a flyrant with the twin linked devourers. Give it a go mixing in with some lethal cc choices. Hope it wins!!!

MMm, not really, I find the devourers can't kill the sisters rhinos! These are what always beat me when they contest all my objectives late in the game. Other higher St blast weapons are better.

Hormogaunts do not need the +1 WS against sisters. If you know you are going to play sisters, give them +1 sv, +1 Str, and flesh hooks. On average, they will decimate a Sister squad on the charge.

16 hormes= 48 attacks; 32 hits; ~21 wounds; 7 dead. (You might get lucky and take out the sister superior with that many wounds).

Warriors with deathspitters should also help. Eviscerators should not be a problem as them should usually only do one wound a turn.

Sisters are one of the few armies that biovores are good against.

A Flying Tyrant should be decimating the sisters in HtH. With Toxic Miasma, they would be hitting you on 5s.

Also note that if a major change in 5th is that a IC is within 2" of a squad, they MUST join the squad, but fight in HtH separate. If the canoness is attached to the squad, she will usually not be able to get that invulnerable save off, but she can be targeted individually. With 5th, a retinue looks necessary to keep her from getting killed.

Thanks to everyone for their input... I have a few things to address to hopefully keep the conversation going.

Firstly: AdeptSister, flyrant is THE best against sisters. I absolutely agree, I just don't have one converted yet.

Augustus: I've never had much luck with dakkafexes against any vehicles as devourers are max S6. That means I need 6's to penetrate when I'm probably only going to be hitting 60% of the time. I have had much better luck with stranglers as they're s8 and for me at least, almost ALWAYS scatter on to something juicier like stormtroopers.

To the paratrooper, exorcists are the main problem and outflanking stealers have been my #1 heavy hitter against them. It works every time... That is, when the come in on the right side of the board in the turn they are supposed to.

The faith points really are handy. I wish I had something like that to use and manipulate during the game. It's what eventually whittles down my cc fexes' because that on eviscerator hits and wounds even though I'm killing 3-4 every turn.

Oh, and as sidenote, I ALWAYS take biovores. S3 AP3 works wonders against sisters as it only takes 4's to wound and negate power armour instead of 5's. They absolutely kill tanks when they don't scatter horribly, which is only about 15% of the time for me.

Grunt_For_Christ wrote:Oh, and as sidenote, I ALWAYS take biovores. S3 AP3 works wonders against sisters as it only takes 4's to wound and negate power armour instead of 5's. They absolutely kill tanks when they don't scatter horribly, which is only about 15% of the time for me.

They work pretty well against normal Marines as well. I love my Biovores, it is the only ranged thing we Nid players have that can kill a Marine efficiently.

That's absolutely true. It's just that when they do hit I can hardly ever roll 5's. But it's good psychological warfare... They tend to take a lot of autocannon shots and barrages, which is fine by me. It that happens early in the game they'll still have synapse coverage so they won't run and that just means my fexes won't be taking those hits...