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OK this is nothing i would personally try but i want to know if there's some where i can look for a counter argument.

from codex Eldar page 40
Eldar Jebikes: These are fitted with twin-linked shuriken catapults, increase the riders Toughness by 1 point and in addition confer a 3+ armour save to the rider.

from BGB page 53

Bikes-Additional Protection:...Bike riders benefit from the protection offered by their bike, which increase their Toughness characteristic by 1....

So am i right T3(4) or is it T3(5) or even T4(5) (since the Eldar rule doesn't mention ID) ?... many thanks.

Well in the eldar codex, in the guardian jetbike entry on page 64, and then again in the eldar reference sheet on page, 68 the toughness of eldar bikes is listed at T3(4).

If you can read, you can see the answer.

"This isn't right"

No its not. Its T3(4) because Codex>Rulebook.

This is because Eldar Jetbikes follow their own rules for the Toughness Boost and not those from the BRB

Regwon wrote:Well in the eldar codex, in the guardian jetbike entry on page 64, and then again in the eldar reference sheet on page, 68 the toughness of eldar bikes is listed at T3(4).

If you can read, you can see the answer.

Okay, so they have a base 3(4), and have a special rule which ups their toughness by one making them 4(5), and also are on bikes so they are 4(6)...sweet!

Ludovic wrote:

Regwon wrote:Well in the eldar codex, in the guardian jetbike entry on page 64, and then again in the eldar reference sheet on page, 68 the toughness of eldar bikes is listed at T3(4).

If you can read, you can see the answer.

Okay, so they have a base 3(4), and have a special rule which ups their toughness by one making them 4(5), and also are on bikes so they are 4(6)...sweet!

Um, no. How about you read? What Special Rule is upping their Toughness by one?

Actually reading through the Codex now, you find the rules for Eldar Bikes in the Guardian Jetbike Entry. The reason its listed as 3(4) is because the +1 Toughness is already Incorporated into the profile and modifications to toughness do not apply for instant death.
The rules for addition toughness for bikes that are found in the rulebook are not being used, only those for movement (as per the codex). You cannot Claim to gain an additional point of toughness because of the rules in the rulebook, because that particular section of the rules is superseded by the codex. Capeshe?

Edit: Emperors Bowels! The Spelling Errors!

I hear Eldar have lots of skimmers, too, that make sort of a whooshing sound

Ludovic wrote:I hear Eldar have lots of skimmers, too, that make sort of a whooshing sound

Yes. Your point?

Gwar! wrote:No its not. Its T3(4) because Codex>Rulebook.

This is because Eldar Jetbikes follow their own rules for the Toughness Boost and not those from the BRB

Not unless the codex specifically/expl!icitely tells you to ignore the bonus of the BRB.

nostromo wrote:

Gwar! wrote:No its not. Its T3(4) because Codex>Rulebook.

This is because Eldar Jetbikes follow their own rules for the Toughness Boost and not those from the BRB

Not unless the codex specifically/expl!icitely tells you to ignore the bonus of the BRB.

Hmm yes, you make an amazing valid point.

Its a shame that the Codex doesn't say "Are mounted on Jetbikes as per the Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook."
It says they are Mounted on "Eldar Jetbikes" which I presume follow the rules as laid out in their codex. The only Rules regarding "Eldar Jetbikes" that I can find in the Rulebook are the ones pertaining to their free 6" Assault Move.

It's actually quite specific in that they only follow the Movement rules for Jetbikes, and nothing else.

To Quote exactly (down to punctuation):

Codex Eldar, Page 40 wrote:Eldar Jetbike: These are fitted with twin-linked shuriken catapults, increase the rider's Toughness by 1 point, and in addition confer a 3+ armour save to the rider. See the Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook for details of the movement of Eldar jetbikes.

As you can see, the codex tells you specifically what it does, and what to look in the rulebook for. In this case you look to the rulebook only for the rules for movement.

Edit: Turns out the Ruinous Powers have laid claim to The Most Holy Keyed Input Device. Said Device has been cleansed and ritually destroyed in the name of the Omnissiah. Those responsible for allowing the corruption to happen have been shot (tl;dr Spelling Errors Corrected)

Gwar! wrote:"See the Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook for details of the movement of Eldar jetbikes."

Case closed then, the codex references the rulebook, but the reference is explicitely restricted to the movement rules of jetbikes.

nostromo wrote:

Gwar! wrote:"See the Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook for details of the movement of Eldar jetbikes."

Case closed then, the codex references the rulebook, but the reference is explicitely restricted to the movement rules of jetbikes.

So... are you agreeing with me or claiming they are like toughness 9001?

Gwar! wrote:

nostromo wrote:

Gwar! wrote:"See the Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook for details of the movement of Eldar jetbikes."

Case closed then, the codex references the rulebook, but the reference is explicitely restricted to the movement rules of jetbikes.

So... are you agreeing with me or claiming they are like toughness 9001?

Gwar! wrote:No its not. Its T3(4) because Codex>Rulebook.
This is because Eldar Jetbikes follow their own rules for the Toughness Boost and not those from the BRB

Short answer: Yes.
Long answer: Early on in the thread you had made a claim to codex overriding BRB in the case of jetbikes, but you didn't prove it in due form back then. Also i don't have access to codex or brb at this time & place i couldn't check myself, so i restricted myself to explaining what it takes for a codex override to happen, and you dug up the necessary references and finished what i couldn't finish due to lack of data.

and the eldar shoot red lasers that go pew pew...

Not to piss on most everyone who's replied (except GWAR)... if you are posting in this forum, please at least attempt to stay on topic, and if possible as it certainly was, answer concisely.

The base toughness of Eldar is 3. A jetbike increases that toughness by +1. That is why the entry for guardian jetbikes states 3(4) in the profile.

nostromo wrote:Short answer: Yes.
Long answer: Early on in the thread you had made a claim to codex overriding BRB in the case of jetbikes, but you didn't prove it in due form back then. Also i don't have access to codex or brb at this time & place i couldn't check myself, so i restricted myself to explaining what it takes for a codex override to happen, and you dug up the necessary references and finished what i couldn't finish due to lack of data.

Ah I see. Well thats fan-dabby-babulous! My Appologies for not quoting my references earlier

... piss on ... GWAR...

Good Lord! -Monocal Pops out-

not 100% sure but i'm sure but i think Ludovic was taking the piss ...

Its always the way, that you play by the rule and then some one ask a slow question ... You know that it's wrong but but can't rember why ... any way i have some nice simple explenations now, so thank you.

Sazzlefrats wrote:Not to piss on most everyone who's replied (except GWAR)... if you are posting in this forum, please at least attempt to stay on topic, and if possible as it certainly was, answer concisely.

The base toughness of Eldar is 3. A jetbike increases that toughness by +1. That is why the entry for guardian jetbikes states 3(4) in the profile.

eldar jetbikes are T3(4) period...

and the eldar shoot red lasers that go pew pew...

Tri wrote:not 100% sure but i'm sure but i think Ludovic was taking the piss ...

Its always the way, that you play by the rule and then some one ask a slow question ... You know that it's wrong but but can't rember why ... any way i have some nice simple explenations now, so thank you.

Glad to help mate. The probelm is you cant tell when people are serious or not, because half the time people are