Hydra sucks vs ork nob bikers.

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**onlainari**

The still get a 4+ cover save.

**Regwon**

Congratulations! You know how the game works!

Has there ever been any suggestion that hydras are good against nob bikers, or are you just making an observation?

Guard deals with nob bikers by dropping S8 AP3 pie plates on them, hydras dont really come into it.

**Kasrkinlegion**

Colossus
Valkyrkie Helfury Missiles
Eradicator Nova Cannon
Hellhound

All of these units take away cover saves.

**Black Blow Fly**

They will still get an invulnerable save plus FNP if strength is not double toughness.

G

**whitedragon**

Hopefully this thread isn't in response to sourclams thread where he said he had Hydras in his 900 pt core. In that list, he suggested shooting the vendettas at the Nobz, not the hydra.

**Raxmei**

Funny thing is, there's only one thing in the Guard list that will take away both the 4+ cover save and the 4+ feel no pain, and it isn't terribly reliable. In this situation instant death is better than than cover save denial since you get the same probability of causing a wound but the wounds count double. The Hydra doesn't do either, but I haven't seen anyone seriously propose them as a counter to nob bikers. It's more of a trukk boyz counter.

**Razerous**

Green Blow Fly wrote:They will still get an invulnerable save plus FNP if strength is not double toughness.

G

Hence why im liking Medusas more & more. I can deal with a cover save if it denies both wounds & the FNP. If I simply deny the cover save & the armor save then they will only have a slighly worse invunerable @ 5+ plus all the other trappings (2w's & fnp).

& you can shoot at tanks too.

Hydras dont suck against orks.. they will probably do thier points worth of damage (but thats not that amazing) but they will chip in with the 'rest of the army' to help out.

**PanamaG**

onlainari wrote:The still get a 4+ cover save.

WOW I just realized this after rereading the entry. I doubt we see many Hydras now. How many times does an Eldar skimmer get a flat out save in a competitive environment?

Not enough to take Hydras over. Same for bikes getting turbo cover but nothing else the Hydra would eat through :(

**PanamaG**

whitedragon wrote:Hopefully this thread isn't in response to sourclams thread where he said he had Hydras in his 900 pt core. In that list, he suggested shooting the vendettas at the Nobz, not the hydra.

I dunno was that thread really that pompous, synergistic and toolish?

**SlaveToDorkness**

Vindicare Assasin- shoot the Painboy!

My Nob Biker solution!

**PanamaG**

Yes there are so many its silly. Its making a list that beats them AND everyone else that is hard. I have yet to see someone make a well rounded list that does both.

**sourclams**

3 Vendettas
1 Psychic Choir
1 direct hit with a Demolisher/Medusa/Manticore/Basilisk

1300 points to do whatever else you want with your list.

IG: Nob Bikerz made EZ.

**Black Blow Fly**

PanamaG wrote:
whitedragon wrote:Hopefully this thread isn't in response to sourclams thread where he said he had Hydras in his 900 pt core. In that list, he suggested shooting the vendettas at the Nobz, not the hydra.

I dunno was that thread really that pompous, synergistic and toolish?

LOL ! Good one there. I am looking forward to more batreps.

G

**Reecius**

The psyker battle squad makes Nob bikers obsolete.

**der Wiskinator**

Do elaborate... I don't have the IG codex yet.

**sourclams**

Check out the [New IG Codex] 900 Point Core thread that I posted in the Tactics section. It covers all of this.

**BoxANT**

Dirty math, cause I feel like it!

LC HWS w/ FomT!
w/ 4+ cover:
3 x 1/2 x 5/6 x 3/4 = 45/48
w/ 3+ cover:
3 x 1/2 x 5/6 x 2/3 = 30/36

Vendetta
w/ 4+ cover:
3 x 3/4 x 5/6 x 1/2 = 45/48
w/ 3+ cover:
3 x 3/4 x 5/6 x 1/3 = 45/72

It's interesting to see, against 4+ cover, LC HWS and Vend are equal, but Vend doesn't need to pass Ld7 order.

Against 3+ cover, Vend falls behind LC HWS, but again, not having to pass Ld7 Order is a big factor.

Again, LC HWS, imo, are inferior to Vendettas. However, perhaps LC in line squads (Las/Plas?) will still be important to take? I'm still on the fence about the AC/GL, AC/PG, LC/PG infantry squads, and if we still need LC/PG.

**sourclams**

To go a little more in-depth with the math:

Vendettax3: 9*.75*5/6/2 and /3 = 2.8125 versus 4+ cover and 1.875 versus 3+ cover

3xLCHWS: (1/36*0+20/36*3/2*5/6*(1/4 or 2/3)+15/36*3/2*5/6(/2 or /3)) = Avg of 2.34 wounds versus 4+ cover and 1.9 wounds versus 3+ cover while receiving orders from an officer.

Interesting. I would have thought that they'd do better than that against 4+ cover. Of course, the average assumes that 16/36 times you fail the leadership test.