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I use them to deep strike behind enemy tanks with ten rear armour or by a squadron like war walkers.
I usually destoy about 2 out of three in the squadron with one volley since an imobilized counts as vehicle destroyed in squadrons(This is all from experience with a five man squad and an exarch with duel death spinners). Afer there done their i send them after the enemies light infantry( especially against IG).

If I remember correctly, aren't those an AP "-" weapon?

Not the best vehicle killers.

But they are good for light infantry.

Ya but when you need to take out an enemy vehicle that will cause lot of problems like a basilisk or defiler(There the chaos things with B-cannons right?)

That's what he means. If you penetrate, you hit at -1, which is alright but that means you destroy only on a 6. If you glance, then on a defiler you'll knock off a weapon on a 6. Everything else would be ignored.

And the battle cannon is the least of your worries

I've never had them destroy anything, but with their teleportation abilities, I've used them as a surprise temporary tarpit.

I buy them, paint them, look at how pretty they are and leave them in the case.

It depends on the opponent. Against enemies who aren't wonderful in CC (tactical-heavy SM, guard, tau, some eldar builds) they are an assault unit.

Against short-ranged enemies they jump in, shoot, then jump back out of range.

Against enemies with lots of vehicles, they deepstrike in and try to hit rear armor.

Against most enemies the tons-of-str-6 shots they put out are really good, and can really help take out things like monstrous creatures.

I use a group of at least 7 or eight of them acompanied by an exarch with twin spinners and power blades. Their ability to be a hit and run shoiting unit is effective and frustrating for many opponents. I tend to run them in concert with another mobile shooting unit like Dire Avengers in a wave serpent. The cobined fire of these two units is enough to destroy most normal sized infantry units.

On occasion I'll throw an Autarch with a fusion gun and power weapon in with them. This actualy transforms them into a fairly nasty assault unit. They have enough high strength shooting ability to cripple an opponent they wish to charge before they do so.

I like my spiders, but we should all be thankful they are just pale shadows of the sick over the top killing machines they were in 2nd edition.

TR

I don't use them against MEQ armies.

EasyE wrote:I don't use them against MEQ armies.

Why not, they wound almost every marine mini on a 2, and will force armor saves on heavy/special weapons and sergeants nearly every time you shoot a unit. 4 str 3 WS5 PW attacks at Init 6 is really good, even against T4 stuff especially if you cast Doom on the target.

They can also bust rhinos and land speeders, two of marine's best units (IMO).

With JSJ ability they'll keep assault terminators from ever reaching them, while doing pretty reliable damage against SH terminators.

Honestly... I feel like my warp spiders are at their most useful when I'm playing against space marines.

they need to make new models

Hollismason wrote:they need to make new models

No they don't.

Granted, they are a tad expensive when bought new due to GW's out of this world pricing on metal figures in recent years (a problem that Ebay will fix quite nicely) but the sculpts are just fine.

TR

I fear Warp Spiders more than any other unit in the Eldar arsenal. They have the kind of versatility armies dream of. They can shred a unit of 30 slugga boyz, pop a LRBT from behind, eat a group of assault marines alive, ect.

I've been running two units of spiders with an Autarch in each unit. Autarchs have Fusion guns, mandiblasters, and power weapons.

With the Autarchs my spiders can:

- threaten any mech unit (that my FD's can't get at that turn)
- come in reliably on turn two (with the rest of the army which starts off the board)
- actually beat marines in cc
- take a wound, in shotting to perserve one of those assault 2 weapons

I've found running two units better than running one as they can support each other and the Fire Dragons.

I haven't given my Warp Spiders much time in 5th.

Not due to thinking they suck, just down to playing with painted figs more.

I actually think they benefitted more from 5th than 4th.

Extra movement - Running (even after deepstrike) makes them now move 14" - 30" per turn.

Shooting allocation now IMO makes them better at taking out PF or special/heavy weapons troopers.

They can now kill tanks more reliably, IMO, than in 4th where they could only glance vehicles.

All this on top of having a 3+ save.

Where's my paint brushes?

I have warmed over time to my unit of Spiders. I run a Wave-Serpent heavy force, but we tend to play with a lot of terrain, so they can avoid taking the entirety of an army's anti-infantry firepower.

Against assault units, I'll shoot the unit in question, and depending on the number of casualties, charge in to finish them off (Doom, again, is so awesome here) or take my warp move backwards from the target.

I see a Serpent or Bike mounted Farseer an essential tool for running Warp Spiders. Doom greatly expands the range of targets they can effectively engage.

In my experience, Withdraw gives them a huge amount of tactical flexibility also.

They make a decent compliment to an advancing foot list (one that has 2-3x Wraithlords, Avatar Guardians etc.) This dilutes the AP3 shooting, and the Spiders' speed helps with grabbing objectives, etc. Since the enemy already gets armor vs. the spinners, you're no worse off for shooting most targets in cover.

Sadly, although they can keep up with mech lists, they are simply not up to snuff when compared with more bikes or Serpent-mounted troops, IMO. They work best in slower lists where their high speed (and deepstrike ability) come in handy.

I always run 8+ to take advantage of Torrent (or whatever they call it now) hits. Choosing whether to include an Exarch or not depends upon your foe. In an all-comers list, I prefer to take the Exarch to add more flexibility, but YMMV.

The big thing with Spiders is that they have a steep learning curve. Figuring out how to eyeball 11.5", learning when to bite the bullet and charge targets that will catch you, etc. etc. takes time. I guess it's the same with most JSJ troops, but Spiders are particularly delicate and need a lot of shepherding. but they are also more elusive than bikes 50% of the time (being able to jump further away with luck) and have actuall CC capacity in a pinch. If your're drawn to them, try 'em, stick it out for 10 games, THEN decide if they're for you.

Savnock wrote:the Spiders' speed helps with grabbing objectives, etc.

excellent point, here

Savnock wrote:Since the enemy already gets armor vs. the spinners, you're no worse off for shooting most targets in cover.

another great point. With the abundant cover saves a lower AP is not as great as it was. The high number of Str 6 shots does do a lot more to hurt marines, IMHO. With so many shots (12 hits on 18 shots. 10 wounds average). A full sized squad of marines takes a wound on each so a decent chance of getting the sarge or special weapons guy. On a combat squad everyone is taking two hits so excellent chances of getting the "hidden fist". As Savock says, you should run more rather than less. Too easy to wipeout enough in a 5-6 man unit to neuter it.

Savnock wrote:The big thing with Spiders is that they have a steep learning curve. Figuring out how to eyeball 11.5", learning when to bite the bullet and charge targets that will catch you, etc. etc. takes time. I guess it's the same with most JSJ troops, but Spiders are particularly delicate and need a lot of shepherding. but they are also more elusive than bikes 50% of the time (being able to jump further away with luck) and have actuall CC capacity in a pinch. If your're drawn to them, try 'em, stick it out for 10 games, THEN decide if they're for you.

couldn't agree more!

Trench-Raider wrote:

Hollismason wrote:they need to make new models

No they don't.

Granted, they are a tad expensive when bought new due to GW's out of this world pricing on metal figures in recent years (a problem that Ebay will fix quite nicely) but the sculpts are just fine.

TR

Yes they do, they do. They have like what, 3 poses? And all 3 are almost the same... Need some more movement/variety. Other than that I would agree that they are fine.

The exarch does look awesome though.

Retired mine after 2ed where they were abolutely sick.
Exarch could drop 4 heavy flamer templates by himself...then charge.

Havn't hit the table since.

Rangerrob wrote:Retired mine after 2ed where they were abolutely sick.
Exarch could drop 4 heavy flamer templates by himself...then charge.

Havn't hit the table since.

So I guess you only play Guardians since they're the only Eldar model to retain their "power" from 2nd ed? Of course the fact that shuriken catapults are significantly crappier now...

I abused people with them in 2nd, shelved them in 3rd, brought them back out in 4th (even moreso with the new dex where they went from elite to fast), and put them back in the case in 5th.

It's not that I don't like them in 5th; it's just that I run mostly mech now, so they have little place in my army. If I pull out a footsloggers list, howerver, they will be right back in. That many mobile, fast, S6 shots is too good to pass up in a footsloggers list.

willydstyle wrote:

Rangerrob wrote:Retired mine after 2ed where they were abolutely sick.
Exarch could drop 4 heavy flamer templates by himself...then charge.

Havn't hit the table since.

So I guess you only play Guardians since they're the only Eldar model to retain their "power" from 2nd ed? Of course the fact that shuriken catapults are significantly crappier now...

Nah...my force is all over the place. Leaving out Reapers, Spiders, Hawks, Vipers, Spears, and Prisms, everything else has hit the table in the last year. Didn't mean it sound like "they were nerfed why would I play these guys"...The flamer template spiders held a special place for me, and were the core of my 2nd ed force. Just thought they deserved a break.

Rangerrob wrote:

willydstyle wrote:

Rangerrob wrote:Retired mine after 2ed where they were abolutely sick.
Exarch could drop 4 heavy flamer templates by himself...then charge.

Havn't hit the table since.

So I guess you only play Guardians since they're the only Eldar model to retain their "power" from 2nd ed? Of course the fact that shuriken catapults are significantly crappier now...

Nah...my force is all over the place. Leaving out Reapers, Spiders, Hawks, Vipers, Spears, and Prisms, everything else has hit the table in the last year. Didn't mean it sound like "they were nerfed why would I play these guys"...The flamer template spiders held a special place for me, and were the core of my 2nd ed force. Just thought they deserved a break.

I was mostly being a smartass

Honestly I like them a lot, not just for JSJ factor, but for the fact that a lot of the time you don't need to deepstrike them to get them where they need to go, because move+run+warp jump=fastest unit in the game.