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Can a standard terminator with a powerfist and a stormbolter elect NOT TO ATTACK with the powerfist and attack at I4 just using his stormbolter (etc.) as a club.

You could in 4th edition. In 5th a model must use special close combat weapons if it is carrying them. Hence models with wargear combinations of Power Fists and Power Weapons (Marneus Calgar, Huron Blackheart) may choose the weapon they will use, while models with only a single special close combat weapon like Terminators may not choose; they have no other option.

Nurglitch wrote:You could in 4th edition. In 5th a model must use special close combat weapons if it is carrying them. Hence models with wargear combinations of Power Fists and Power Weapons (Marneus Calgar, Huron Blackheart) may choose the weapon they will use, while models with only a single special close combat weapon like Terminators may not choose; they have no other option.

I'm not 100% sure that's true does it state it anywhere in the rulebook? Second sine when does Marneus Calgar have a PF and PW? Last I remember he has 2 PF's. Third some models like gun krew grots and other models don't even have a weapon and can fight in CC.







-Orkishly

The thing im having trouble with is that a stormbolter is a CC weapon in CC, but under the Rulebook, it never says that you HAVE to attack with the powerfist. It does specify for 2 special weapons, that you can only use one and don't get the bonus for 2 CCW's. Having a stormbolter and a powerfist also makes you not be able to be granted the +1 for having 2 CCW, so why arn't you allowed to ignore your powerfist and you don't even get the attack from it, and just attack with the stormbolter.

And im saying that the stormbolter is an option in CC, its a club! A model with true grit with a bolter or stormbolter and a PW counts as having 2 CCW, so it does count as a CCW.

orkishlyorkish wrote:Second sine when does Marneus Calgar have a PF and PW? Last I remember he has 2 PF's.

Try looking at his army list entry on page 129 of Codex Space Marines. It states quite explicitly what he's armed with.

orkishlyorkish wrote:Third some models like gun krew grots and other models don't even have a weapon and can fight in CC.

And what does that have to do with the question at hand? The rules clearly state if you have a special attacik that you must use it.

EzeKK wrote:The thing im having trouble with is that a stormbolter is a CC weapon in CC...

And what exactly gives you the idea that a storm bolter is a close combat weapon?

EzeKK wrote:... but under the Rulebook, it never says that you HAVE to attack with the powerfist.

Really? Please reread page 35 of the Warhammer 40,000 5th edition rulebook, third paragraph under the heading 'Who Can Fight?' and tell us what it says.

EzeKK wrote:And im saying that the stormbolter is an option in CC, its a club!

And where do the rules say that it's an option in close combat?

Oops sorry I was completely wrong and also ezekk even if a SB was a CC weapon it wouldn't matter. The rules on page 35 state you MUST use any SPECIAL close combat weapons you have. Sorry again to you both.





-Orkishly

Ghaz wrote:

EzeKK wrote:The thing im having trouble with is that a stormbolter is a CC weapon in CC...

And what exactly gives you the idea that a storm bolter is a close combat weapon?

I was thinking of something like a SM Captain with a Powerweapon and a Stormbolter getting his +1 attack for having 2 weapons (do models with true grit get that extra +1 cc attack, like grey hunters for instance, except with a bolter in their case?)

EzeKK wrote:... but under the Rulebook, it never says that you HAVE to attack with the powerfist.

Really? Please reread page 35 of the Warhammer 40,000 5th edition rulebook, third paragraph under the heading 'Who Can Fight?' and tell us what it says.

Thanks for clarifying this actually. I never saw that line, I kept rereading pg. 42 concerning the weapon you have in close combat

EzeKK wrote:And im saying that the stormbolter is an option in CC, its a club!

And where do the rules say that it's an option in close combat?

Idk actually, i was assuming it acted like a pistol in CC and could be used in CC like a pistol, aka, another CC weapon. Do models with true grit get their extra CC attack in CC for having something like a Bolter and CC Knife, and if not, if they also have a pistol to use (spacemarine captain) could it be considered that they drew the pistol and the knife or powersword etc. and get their extra CC atack?

EzeKK wrote:Idk actually, i was assuming it acted like a pistol in CC and could be used in CC like a pistol, aka, another CC weapon.

And what would lead you to believe it acts like a pistol in close combat?

EzeKK wrote:Do models with true grit get their extra CC attack in CC for having something like a Bolter and CC Knife

Depending on the exact wording of the True Grit then yes they would. However Grey Knight Terminators do not have True Grit and Space Wolves can't use a Storm Bolter with their version of True Grit.

Ok then.

EzeKK wrote:ffs you don't like giving good answers do you. If something I say is wrong, then correct it, don't ask "why do you think this" because I don't take you as someone dumb enough to not know what assume means and that you possess common sense. I assumed (because I am unsure of the rules, thats why i'm asking for help for clarification) that the stormbolter acted as a close combat weapon akin to the pistol (i'm not saying it is a pistol)in close combat, and your character gained an extra close combat attack for having it.

Pg 42 Warhammer Rulebook

Normal Close Combat Weapons

"Weapons like chainswords, RIFLE BUTTS.... "

pg37 Under Number of Attacks, the Bullet point

"- +1 Two Weapons: Engaged models with two single-handed weapons..." - this also applies to models assaulting and adds to their bonus. Ex. Orks - 2 attacks normally. +1 for charging and +1 for having 2 weapons (pistol and choppa)

Since the Spacemarine Captain is Wielding the Stormbolter in one hand, does is thus count as a single handed weapon (even though it is normally not) and confer him an extra attack in close combat.

No it doesnt count. That bit about rifle butts is what's called Fluff. Also, a Storm Bolter is as Closely related to a Rifle as a Cream Cake is to a Thermonuclear Reactor. Rifles Shoot Bullets, Storm Bolters fire Mini Rockets.

EzeKK wrote:ffs you don't like giving good answers do you.

And you obviously don't like explaining yours, do you.

EzeKK wrote:If something I say is wrong, then correct it, don't ask "why do you think this" because I don't take you as someone dumb enough to not know what assume means and that you possess common sense.

And it's kind of hard to 'correct' somebody when they don't bother to explain why they think it's played a certain way.

EzeKK wrote:I assumed (because I am unsure of the rules, thats why i'm asking for help for clarification) that the stormbolter acted as a close combat weapon akin to the pistol (i'm not saying it is a pistol)in close combat, and your character gained an extra close combat attack for having it.

And I asked why you thought it was that way so I could make sure I knew what points you were incorrect on, yet all you did was try and start a flame war. With an attitude like yours, you soon won't have any replies on this forum as it consists almost entirely of posters asking each other to clarify their positions. Are you going to flame them as well?

EzeKK wrote:Pg 42 Warhammer Rulebook

Normal Close Combat Weapons

"Weapons like chainswords, RIFLE BUTTS.... "

pg37 Under Number of Attacks, the Bullet point

"- +1 Two Weapons: Engaged models with two single-handed weapons..." - this also applies to models assaulting and adds to their bonus. Ex. Orks - 2 attacks normally. +1 for charging and +1 for having 2 weapons (pistol and choppa)

Since the Spacemarine Captain is Wielding the Stormbolter in one hand, does is thus count as a single handed weapon (even though it is normally not) and confer him an extra attack in close combat.

And where do the rules say that a weapon is single-handed just because it's modeled that way? It doesn't. How a weapon is modeled is inconsequential. All that matters is how do the rules define it? In every codex that has ever defined how many hands it takes to use a storm bolter it has been as a two-handed weapon. Just because it's modeled in one hand does not change that.

Secondly, where does it say that a rifle butt is a single-handed weapon? A 'normal' close combat weapon is not auomatically single-handed.

At any rate, you don't have to worry about answering any of my questions again. I'm through with your trolling.

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:No it doesnt count. That bit about rifle butts is what's called Fluff. Also, a Storm Bolter is as Closely related to a Rifle as a Cream Cake is to a Thermonuclear Reactor. Rifles Shoot Bullets, Storm Bolters fire Mini Rockets.

Thank you!

EzeKK wrote:And I don't think you know what trolling is. If I was trolling then I would be either rick rolling you or doing something like (inc. dumb lolkatz speeks) "Oks guys that there termies needs to be buffered. 1+ SAVE! They needs be l33terz! Fasterz! They dont need to die to no stikin alieens! TERMIES DONT DIE!" <-- That is trolling. And you can't start a flame war over a fact, its either true or false. And sorry, but its get frustrating after asking a question: Does a stormbolter confer an extra attack in CC? And not just getting "yes or no" or "it works when

I don't think you know what trolling is.

And sorry, but it gets frustrating answering questions that can easily be answered by reading the rulebook, and then having to deal with a childish attitude on top of it.

whitedragon wrote:
I don't think you know what trolling is.

And sorry, but it gets frustrating answering questions that can easily be answered by reading the rulebook, and then having to deal with a childish attitude on top of it.

Alright, my bad =(. Sorry had a long day. On a strict diet atm and training every morning for an upcoming tryout so my waking up early grumpiness is coming out a bit to much .

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