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Is it possible to Assault with Infiltrators if they have both the Scout special and the Infiltrate special Rule.

The Main Argument I see for this is that you deploy the models 18" away from the target Unit... Scout 6", Move 6", and finally assault for the last 6"...

I am wondering because I thought about making a Space Marine Army that encapsulates the fact that they are Special forces and the Elite troops of the Imperium...

I don't think this is possible. You have to start out more than 18" away (exact wording, I believe) which means that even a 6" move and a 6" charge would leave you fractions of an inch short.

huh... perhaps it would be possible if they had: Infiltrate,Scout, and Fleet...

I guess this puts a chink in the plan of Rapid-Fire my bolter instead...

Throw in Furious Charge and Counter attack and you have the makings of something ridiculous...

All that is left is deploying them out of line of sight... how would this happen within 12"-18"? Would there be Impassable Terrain in the way, or do both players agree that this terrain blocks LOS...

So... With the First turn Assault gone, anything else I can do with a Scout squad armed with out giving it the order of shoot Sniper rifles and sit on objectives...

If you're going first, scouts in a Land Speeder Storm can get a first turn charge really easily.

The 1st turn assualt with infiltrate and scouting does work out. You infiltrate 18" away (or 12" out of sight) then move 6 inch with scouting. Then on your turn you move 6 inches up then charge the other 6.

While that tactic will work out for a game or two. Its relative easy to counter and if it somehow doesn't work out for you then you got a dead squad next turn.

This also only works out well if you get 1st turn, even more harmful when your opponent steals initiative.

SirRouga wrote:The 1st turn assualt with infiltrate and scouting does work out. You infiltrate 18" away (or 12" out of sight) then move 6 inch with scouting. Then on your turn you move 6 inches up then charge the other 6.

While that tactic will work out for a game or two. Its relative easy to counter and if it somehow doesn't work out for you then you got a dead squad next turn.

This also only works out well if you get 1st turn, even more harmful when your opponent steals initiative.

Except the rules say you have to be "more than" 18" away, so unless you are gaining extra movement from moving incorrectly, the rules of the game say you cannot do it.

Get shrike as an hq and you can have fleet add in some jump pack guys have shrike join them they can inf too. All kinds of 1st turn assaults

willydstyle wrote:

SirRouga wrote:The 1st turn assualt with infiltrate and scouting does work out. You infiltrate 18" away (or 12" out of sight) then move 6 inch with scouting. Then on your turn you move 6 inches up then charge the other 6.

While that tactic will work out for a game or two. Its relative easy to counter and if it somehow doesn't work out for you then you got a dead squad next turn.

This also only works out well if you get 1st turn, even more harmful when your opponent steals initiative.

Except the rules say you have to be "more than" 18" away, so unless you are gaining extra movement from moving incorrectly, the rules of the game say you cannot do it.

Its 18 or more inches away if you are in the LOS, if not in LOS then you can infiltrate 12 inches away. My SM used to rely heavily on this, though mostly for rapid firing bolters and two plasma guns a squad. I miss chapter traits.

You don't "agree" that it blocks LOS, you just determine that it is by seeing if it actually DOES block LOS! For example - impassable terrain could be a lava flow, or a vortex pit: doesnt block LOS but you wouldnt want to walk in it....

Over 18" means you will always end up short, even with scout move. You need to be able to infiltrate out of LOS (12") then you would be able to charge, assuming you can get around / through the terrain blocvking you without losing too much distance.

In addition: unless you can murder something important it isnt a great move, as after you do this you will either get a) shot to death after wiping the first unit out or b) will get counter charged and murdered.

BrotherStynier wrote:
Its 18 or more inches away if you are in the LOS, if not in LOS then you can infiltrate 12 inches away. My SM used to rely heavily on this, though mostly for rapid firing bolters and two plasma guns a squad. I miss chapter traits.

Exact phrasing, page 75:

Infiltrators may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 12" from any enemy unit, as long as no deployed enemy unit can draw a line of sight to them. This includes inside a building (see page 83), as long as the building is more than 12" from any enemy unit. Alternatively, they may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 18"from any enemy unit, even in plain sight.

So, as has been correctly pointed out already a couple of times already (and incorrectly disputed), you must start MORE than 18" away if in LOS and MORE than 12" if no LOS.

don_mondo wrote:

BrotherStynier wrote:
Its 18 or more inches away if you are in the LOS, if not in LOS then you can infiltrate 12 inches away. My SM used to rely heavily on this, though mostly for rapid firing bolters and two plasma guns a squad. I miss chapter traits.

Exact phrasing, page 75:

Infiltrators may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 12" from any enemy unit, as long as no deployed enemy unit can draw a line of sight to them. This includes inside a building (see page 83), as long as the building is more than 12" from any enemy unit. Alternatively, they may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 18"from any enemy unit, even in plain sight.

So, as has been correctly pointed out already a couple of times already (and incorrectly disputed), you must start MORE than 18" away if in LOS and MORE than 12" if no LOS.

Thank you for that.

Side note, by more than do they mean 12 and 1/2 or 13 inches away? or Just 12 or more?

Also, scout moves can't bring you closer than 12" anyways, so it doesn't really matter if you can deploy in or out of LoS, because regular infantry cannot gain a first turn charge from infiltrate.

Zombie78 mentioned Shrike, however, and if he is in your army then the fleet rule makes 1st turn charges more viable.

Where does it say that Scouting cant get closer that 12 inches from the enemy, I don't recall that bit.

BrotherStynier wrote:

don_mondo wrote:

BrotherStynier wrote:
Its 18 or more inches away if you are in the LOS, if not in LOS then you can infiltrate 12 inches away. My SM used to rely heavily on this, though mostly for rapid firing bolters and two plasma guns a squad. I miss chapter traits.

Exact phrasing, page 75:

Infiltrators may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 12" from any enemy unit, as long as no deployed enemy unit can draw a line of sight to them. This includes inside a building (see page 83), as long as the building is more than 12" from any enemy unit. Alternatively, they may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 18"from any enemy unit, even in plain sight.

So, as has been correctly pointed out already a couple of times already (and incorrectly disputed), you must start MORE than 18" away if in LOS and MORE than 12" if no LOS.

Thank you for that.

Side note, by more than do they mean 12 and 1/2 or 13 inches away? or Just 12 or more?

They mean exactly what they say, more than, not 12" exactly, but over 12" away.

BrotherStynier wrote:Where does it say that Scouting cant get closer that 12 inches from the enemy, I don't recall that bit.

Page 76, Scout USR:

This is done exactly as in their
Movement phase, except that during this move, scouts
must remain more than 12" away from any enemy.

The "more than" issue is why such a tactic only really works with Shirke. You need his fleet rule to truly make the tactic work. Plus, by using Shike you also get your Assault "Fleeting" Termies popping out of a LRC (with a just under 27.5" assault range) also joining in on the first turn assault.

BrotherStynier wrote:Where does it say that Scouting cant get closer that 12 inches from the enemy, I don't recall that bit.

Maybe you should actually know the rules before you try to correct every post I make.

don_mondo wrote:

They mean exactly what they say, more than, not 12" exactly, but over 12" away.

Thank you for clarification.

BrotherStynier wrote:Where does it say that Scouting cant get closer that 12 inches from the enemy, I don't recall that bit.

Page 76, Scout USR:

This is done exactly as in their
Movement phase, except that during this move, scouts
must remain more than 12" away from any enemy.

Thank you once again. I should take another gander at the big book.

The thing is, you can infiltrate to 18.0001" away, move 6" forwards, then move, run and assault (if you have fleet).

So yes, if you have Scout, Infiltrate and Fleet, you can get a 1st turn charge.

Also the LS Storm move does work, because of the way open topped works, you move to 12.000001" from the enemy in the scout move, then in the movement phase, you can move 6", disembark 1", then charge.

Gwar! wrote:
Also the LS Storm move does work, because of the way open topped works, you move to 12.000001" from the enemy in the scout move, then in the movement phase, you can move 6", disembark 1", then charge.

Would that do it?

QuietOrkmi wrote:

Gwar! wrote:
Also the LS Storm move does work, because of the way open topped works, you move to 12.000001" from the enemy in the scout move, then in the movement phase, you can move 6", disembark 1", then charge.

Would that do it?

Well, sure. You Would move 24" in the scout move, so you can easily get to 12" of SOMETHING (Provided its not DoW, in which case you are better off Outflanking)

QuietOrkmi wrote:

Gwar! wrote:
Also the LS Storm move does work, because of the way open topped works, you move to 12.000001" from the enemy in the scout move, then in the movement phase, you can move 6", disembark 1", then charge.

Would that do it?

Considering you can actually get close to 3" closer to the enemy by disembarking (2" plus .98 or so inches from the width of the base), it does it handily.