Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

CCS: Creed, 4x Meltagun, Astropath, Officer of the Fleet

CCS: 4x Meltagun, Astropath

PCS: 4x Meltagun, Al'Rahem
Chimera: Heavy Flamer

Infantry Squad: Autocannon, Grenade Launcher
Chimera: Heavy Flamer

Infantry Squad: Autocannon, Grenade Launcher
Chimera: Heavy Flamer

Veteran Squad: 3x Meltagun, Demolitions

Vendetta

Vendetta

Valkyrie

Leman Russ Squadron:
Leman Russ Executioner: Sponson Plasma Cannons
Leman Russ Demolisher: Sponson Plasma Cannons

TOTAL: 1750
MODELS: 56 (48/8)
KILLPOINTS: 13

Creed gives it to the Russ squadron. Both CCS and the Vets go into the Valks/Dettas and the entire army outflanks. It is basically alpha strike BS like the air cav lists. I was fooling with the codex and thought it ws an interesting idea, though I'm not sure if its solid or not. Really it is pretty much a mechanized army that rolls in from the flanks. I had 30 points to spare so I stuck an Officer of the Fleet into one of the CCSs but I think there is a better way to spend the pionts that I haven't looked at or thought of yet.

Comments/constructive criticism are welcomed

Man, I like this idea. The whoe army can outflank. That will mess up eldar and tau. Watch the hordes, though.

There's one problem with the infantry platoon. Al'rahem can outflank infantry, not vehicles, assuming I read this correctly. Please check that. All it would mean is putting more bodies in place of the chims.

Eh, it just says that any unit that is part of his platoon may outflank. I'm pretty sure mounting a unit with the ability to outflank allows the tank they're in to do it to (for example, outflanking Striking Scorpions in Wave Serpents).

Anti-Horde is simple with this list. The Russ squadron points itself at a unit and it pretty much dies. After that there are Heavy Flamer templates on the Chimeras and the Valk has MRPs (I forgot to put that in the list) so it can pile wounds on horde units. I can switch the PCS to have 4x flamers if there is a problem there. It will also save me 20 points to do that.

I'm also not sold on the Grenade Launchers, I think I'd rather have flamers in my infantry squads. Thoughts on that?

Caffran9 wrote:
I'm also not sold on the Grenade Launchers, I think I'd rather have flamers in my infantry squads. Thoughts on that?

Good call. Flamers are decent against hordes, and piling wounds onto units...Grenade Launchers have been show to be mediocre at just about everything...for a high price.

5 pts?

colonel584 wrote:5 pts?

higher then they are worth, when compared to the performance output of other weapons...

this isn't Tau, it's guard and life is cheap but still, i've taken out Rhinos with a Krak Grenade and (no joke) 3 Termies down with a Frag grenade. And they're asssault 1 so they're actually perfect for advancing Infantry Squads

colonel584 wrote:this isn't Tau, it's guard and life is cheap but still, i've taken out Rhinos with a Krak Grenade and (no joke) 3 Termies down with a Frag grenade. And they're asssault 1 so they're actually perfect for advancing Infantry Squads

And for every time that you have done either of those things, how many times have the been not so useful? I imagine the numbers speak for themselves, and looking at the reviews of others, and my own performance with Grenade Launchers (yes, I play IG as well), they have not been worth it compared to flamers.

Derp. Its late and I am stupid. Ignore me.

Grenade launchers are good for thier range, flamers are only useful if you can reliably get close to an enemy.

You need to improve the leman russ squadren - Perhaps this could fill your anti-horde rolls, while you leave the 3x melta squads (one of them in the readily deployable anti-infantry valkyrie) and the 2x Vendettas to anti-tank.

Two outflanking Eradicators would sort out anti-horde problems on thier own. Use the points you've saved to buy an additional infantry squad.

Al'rahem & creed give the ability to Imperial guard to field one of the strongest Close-combat elements they can. It requires a priest, commissar & atleast 30 blobbed guardsmen. Combined with Creeds 'FtHoC' or al'rahems 'LtW' depending on which is more important - you either get fleet or furious charge. Al'rahem is by no means a pushover in assaults but I guess its best he stays out of trouble.

So with that in mind, drop the chimera & replace them with a priest, commissar & an additional infantry squad if you can spare the points.

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:this isn't Tau, it's guard and life is cheap but still, i've taken out Rhinos with a Krak Grenade and (no joke) 3 Termies down with a Frag grenade. And they're asssault 1 so they're actually perfect for advancing Infantry Squads

And for every time that you have done either of those things, how many times have the been not so useful? I imagine the numbers speak for themselves, and looking at the reviews of others, and my own performance with Grenade Launchers (yes, I play IG as well), they have not been worth it compared to flamers.

What about for a shooty army. If your opponent doesn't get close a 9" flame template will be really useful

Razerous wrote:Grenade launchers are good for thier range, flamers are only useful if you can reliably get close to an enemy.

You need to improve the leman russ squadren - Perhaps this could fill your anti-horde rolls, while you leave the 3x melta squads (one of them in the readily deployable anti-infantry valkyrie) and the 2x Vendettas to anti-tank.

Two outflanking Eradicators would sort out anti-horde problems on thier own. Use the points you've saved to buy an additional infantry squad.

Al'rahem & creed give the ability to Imperial guard to field one of the strongest Close-combat elements they can. It requires a priest, commissar & atleast 30 blobbed guardsmen. Combined with Creeds 'FtHoC' or al'rahems 'LtW' depending on which is more important - you either get fleet or furious charge. Al'rahem is by no means a pushover in assaults but I guess its best he stays out of trouble.

So with that in mind, drop the chimera & replace them with a priest, commissar & an additional infantry squad if you can spare the points.

Interesting on setting up the more assult oriented unit. I kind of like that, though if I did it I would want another mobile troops choice. I'm not sure how the points work out at that point, but I'd probably want to keep the PCS in the Chimera so they have some added mobility. I'm going to fiddle with this idea though since you are correct that Creed's order and if needed, Al'Rahem's order are pretty solid, especially with 30+ bodies benefiting from it.

Do you honestly think a Demolisher Cannon and 7 Plasma Cannons in the LR squadron is not enough anti-horde? I think it has a much broader threat range than the Eradicator's turret weapon (they can take plasma cannons too so I'm assuming that they have them lol) since it slings higher strength and lower AP to a much higher degree. I'm going to force so many cover saves onto horde units with the LR squadron the way it is that I think I'll kill more than enough of the target unit. If I had more anti-heavy infantry and such, I would be more inclined to the Eradicators. I just feel like AP2 is very important at this point, lots of it. I really think switching the PCS to flamers is much more ideal than exchanging the two most lethal tanks in the IG codex (IMO).

colonel584 wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:this isn't Tau, it's guard and life is cheap but still, i've taken out Rhinos with a Krak Grenade and (no joke) 3 Termies down with a Frag grenade. And they're asssault 1 so they're actually perfect for advancing Infantry Squads

And for every time that you have done either of those things, how many times have the been not so useful? I imagine the numbers speak for themselves, and looking at the reviews of others, and my own performance with Grenade Launchers (yes, I play IG as well), they have not been worth it compared to flamers.

What about for a shooty army. If your opponent doesn't get close a 9" flame template will be really useful

What about a shooty army??? I play IG and Tau...nuff' said.

Yes, the template does shorten range, but that ties in perfectly with assault oriented squads that another poster has mentioned...unless one really hopes to keep Outflanking units out of assault range for most of the game? (good luck.)

Caffran9 wrote:
Interesting on setting up the more assult oriented unit. I kind of like that, though if I did it I would want another mobile troops choice. I'm not sure how the points work out at that point, but I'd probably want to keep the PCS in the Chimera so they have some added mobility. I'm going to fiddle with this idea though since you are correct that Creed's order and if needed, Al'Rahem's order are pretty solid, especially with 30+ bodies benefiting from it.

Do you honestly think a Demolisher Cannon and 7 Plasma Cannons in the LR squadron is not enough anti-horde? I think it has a much broader threat range than the Eradicator's turret weapon (they can take plasma cannons too so I'm assuming that they have them lol) since it slings higher strength and lower AP to a much higher degree. I'm going to force so many cover saves onto horde units with the LR squadron the way it is that I think I'll kill more than enough of the target unit. If I had more anti-heavy infantry and such, I would be more inclined to the Eradicators. I just feel like AP2 is very important at this point, lots of it. I really think switching the PCS to flamers is much more ideal than exchanging the two most lethal tanks in the IG codex (IMO).

Al'rahems & creeds orders dont work on the same unit. You can only order a unit once (hence the awesomeness of Strakken creed-like bubble ability. But he cant outflank, requires a valkyrie.).

A pcs in a chimera/valkyrie/vendetta is muchos mobile & can provide good anti-horde* (*to compliment 3-tl-lascannons from a detta) and somthing like a veteran squad (to go in another valkyrie) or a self-sustaining penal legionnaires.

The 30man + troop blob is extremely fast - considering the amount of board is can cover, turning up from turn 2 on a 2+ with a re-roll to which board egde you move from. Compared to footsloggers.

As for the Demo & plasma cannon leman russes - They can kill hordes very well, provided they are not in cover. If they are in cover, hordes will laugh at the amount of points-worth of tanks shooting at hordes (can be expensive) but only making marginal kills. Anti-cover weaponary or/and high rate of fire weaponary will deal with hordes will. 2+ cover saving troops can eat demolisher shells all day long.
My point is - you have already got things that do the demo & exec's job (nearly, anyways) but not much that can do an Eradicators job.

! You dont -have- to outflank everything. Creed also, generally, needs to either outflank himself or be mechenised - to be able to reach ouflanking troops with a 30" 'For the honour of cadia'.

- Why dont you seperate your leman russ squadrens into two groups of one tank. You outflank, mission-per-mission, the best choice depending one the circumstances. You do need the AP2. You could also do very well using the str6 ap 4 anti-cover too. Get one of each (Exec & Erad)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:.... Squads

+ Stuff...

What about a shooty army??? I play IG and Tau...nuff' said.

Yes, the template does shorten range, but that ties in perfectly with assault oriented squads that another poster has mentioned...unless one really hopes to keep Outflanking units out of assault range for most of the game? (good luck.)

No, I disagree. Flamers only really work well when you can direct the placement of those flamers. Even outflanking squads assault blob squads, will only really be able to shoot those flamers once. So why not go for the GL's that can fire from the turn they outflank (and have the ability to knock out predators side armor 11, or rhinos, or etc. etc, or simply pummel infantry for numerous str3 blasts). Flamer units in mobile chimera or grav-droppable valkyries are the way to go, flamey wise.
Aha.. quote meltdown. I cannot figure it out. Mines the paragraph in bold. hehe...

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:

colonel584 wrote:this isn't Tau, it's guard and life is cheap but still, i've taken out Rhinos with a Krak Grenade and (no joke) 3 Termies down with a Frag grenade. And they're asssault 1 so they're actually perfect for advancing Infantry Squads

And for every time that you have done either of those things, how many times have the been not so useful? I imagine the numbers speak for themselves, and looking at the reviews of others, and my own performance with Grenade Launchers (yes, I play IG as well), they have not been worth it compared to flamers.

What about for a shooty army. If your opponent doesn't get close a 9" flame template will be really useful

What about a shooty army??? I play IG and Tau...nuff' said.

Yes, the template does shorten range, but that ties in perfectly with assault oriented squads that another poster has mentioned...unless one really hopes to keep Outflanking units out of assault range for most of the game? (good luck.)

Assault Oriented squads? Here I thought we were talking about shooty armies. I wasn't referring to Guard/Tau in General I mean shooty shooty armies. As in shooty armys made with a shooty list

colonel584 wrote:
Assault Oriented squads? Here I thought we were talking about shooty armies. I wasn't referring to Guard/Tau in General I mean shooty shooty armies. As in shooty armys made with a shooty list

We were, then someone brought the idea of adding assault-oriented squads to this list. Not my idea, but I add my thoughts to it.

okay then