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It's been about a week now since people really started putting out lists for 'ard boys. It's pretty interesting to see that almost everyone is completely mech. It doesn't matter what army it is it is still riding around in a vehicle. Let's see what lists I have seen.

Land Raider Spam (Chaos and SM)
IG Chimera Spam
Raider Spam (That's my list)

Maybe that doesn't seem like that many but I am sure there are many more to come.

Just wondering how everyone else is planning on taking down mech lists and if you're planning to run the same.

melta weapons > mech. LR spam is going to get spanked bad by anyone with a decent amount of melta's. The only scary mech armies are IG valk/vendetta spam and possibly mech eldar.

I would refine that to say Mech + Melta > Mech w/o Melta.

Without the mechanize delivery system melta guns dont help you until its too late anyway.

Mech Chaos ( not raider spam) will be very solid, as will Mech Ork and Valk/Detta spam is the least of your worries in a 2500 pt environment due to infiltrator blocking taking away the alpha strike option.

Mech works best in 40k for the same reason it works best IRL. Becuase its increases the mobility and survivability of your army. The only times it has not worked have been when GW introduces severe penalties for meching up either through very expensive transports or entanglement and the like.

5th ed rules inherently give Mech the advantage over non Mech.

bigtmac68 wrote:I would refine that to say Mech + Melta > Mech w/o Melta.

Without the mechanize delivery system melta guns dont help you until its too late anyway.

Mech Chaos ( not raider spam) will be very solid, as will Mech Ork and Valk/Detta spam is the least of your worries in a 2500 pt environment due to infiltrator blocking taking away the alpha strike option.

Mech works best in 40k for the same reason it works best IRL. Becuase its increases the mobility and survivability of your army. The only times it has not worked have been when GW introduces severe penalties for meching up either through very expensive transports or entanglement and the like.

5th ed rules inherently give Mech the advantage over non Mech.

well yes, but any serious mech army is packing their meltaguns these days. Raider spam isnt going to work due to that. Mech Chaos and mech vulkan both work well as they have melta's in spades. Mech orks I'm not as scared of as their lack of melta and general tank busting guns means they have to assault in order to destroy a vehicle, leaving them exposed to fire and counter assaults.

Khornatedemon wrote:well yes, but any serious mech army is packing their meltaguns these days. Raider spam isnt going to work due to that. Mech Chaos and mech vulkan both work well as they have melta's in spades. Mech orks I'm not as scared of as their lack of melta and general tank busting guns means they have to assault in order to destroy a vehicle, leaving them exposed to fire and counter assaults.

Raiders are fast open topped skimmers that best use their speed to get wyches and other nasties into combat, rather than as firing platforms. It doesnt matter if you have meltas if the stuff inside the transports has an effective charge range of 24"+.

Any mek ork general worth his choppa will have a couple of squads of lootas in battlewagons ready to pop any transports at the earliest oppertunity. That meny S7 hits can really do some damage to a medium range mek army. Where as a lot of others have to get into melta range to be able to kill all those transports, orks can do it from 48", and then follow it up with a fantastic charge.

I think Deamon ment landraider spam, rather then DE raiders.

Yea, DE raider spam can also include a whole lotta blasters, which aren't quite melta but they are the best the DE get. Plus, their transports get a nice gun on them in the form of a dark lance.

Mech Eldar might be all the rage because they can take a huge seer council or two, on bikes or not, and still afford everything else. Sprinkle in an Eldrad, Yriel or autarch and you can dictate the flow of the battle very well.

The only problem is that other mech armies (IG/Marines/Chaos/DE) actually have troops that can do something once their ride gets blown up, while Mech Eldar dances a much more "Denial" type game.

DE raider spam at 2500 points is very powerful, I saw a player get 70 points in the first round last year by running nothing but raiders & ravengers.

One tactic I saw him do was deploy all the squads outside of the raiders. That way you had to choose which unit to attack and even if yu brought down a raider the squad would still get off a dark lance shot.

Yes I was referring to LAND raider spam.

If orks have loota's in their battlewagons then they dont have assault troops in them. Thats a plus for me. Trukks dont cut it. Last game against trukk heavy orks I had them all popped on turn 1 with long range MM shots. AV10 + open topped + AP1 = bye bye transport. The issue with mech orks at this point level is running out of FoC slots. If your taking lootas you dont have nobz. So then I only have regular boyz to deal with and since the loota's are in your battlewagons you only have trukks left. I think the better mech ork lists are going to be wagons full of assault troops with deffkopta's to pop tanks with twin rokkits and buzzsaws.

DE raider spam can be gross with all those guns. The guns scare me way more than the assault troops. I'd rather deal with wyches than ravagers. Wyches at least drop dead to a flamer way easy.

So mech lists will rule supreme this summer. I'm sure they've already started but now they will come out in force. Will that drop Lash out of top tier lists then?

Oh and I'm sure ork players aren't worried about you blowing they're trukks up. As long as they get to move once or explode forward. Regular boyz can get the job done anyways you don't have to have nobz

OK, so the next round of the great rock/paper/scissors game that is 40K will be 'kill the transport'

After all, mech vets with 3x meltas is scary. vets trying to footslog up the board because their transport got popped on turn 1 less so.

So what's the most efficient way of killing transports? Will the humble Lascannon see a renewed surge inpopularity? After all, its got all the killing power you need to stop transports and can hang back at long range to do its job, unlike all the meltas that currently flood the metagame.

Thoughts??

Meltaguns aren't as scary if you push them out of the 6-inch range.

Chimera_Calvin wrote:OK, so the next round of the great rock/paper/scissors game that is 40K will be 'kill the transport'

After all, mech vets with 3x meltas is scary. vets trying to footslog up the board because their transport got popped on turn 1 less so.

So what's the most efficient way of killing transports? Will the humble Lascannon see a renewed surge inpopularity? After all, its got all the killing power you need to stop transports and can hang back at long range to do its job, unlike all the meltas that currently flood the metagame.

Thoughts??

I think you will see things like the "combi Pred" AC/LC sponsons. @ 120pts its second only to the Vendetta for long range transport killing points efficiency and is more survivable. I think you will see Standard Raiders pushing Crusaders and Reedemers out a little bit more as well for Marines.

The aforementioned Vendetta makes an awesome transport hunter for the guard and Massed Autocannons have always been one of the best methods of smashing enemy transports at range dating back to the days of the 3rd Ed Rhino Rush.

Ork Lootas of course in wagon or out.

Eldar should be just fine with all the Bright Lances and Fire Prisms.

We might finally see the hated dual lash start to fade. I have found it to be one of my favorite matchups with Mech Vet so far and my Mech Sallies eats it alive pretty well too.

Demons may see a massive surge in TZ (screw trying o spell that GD word!!!)

Overall Im really interested to see what unexpected things come out of this environment.

Kairos crusher may be last year's style, but other than the new IG there isn't much that can throw it off its stride, and I have yet to have it proven to my satisfaction that the IG can do so.

I'm actually back to my crons this year, going to see how my melee toasters do.

I plan to play a gunline IG list with Las/Plas spam at the Tasmanian state championships, since collecting a mech army is horribly expensive (over $80 for 10 guardsmen and a chimera), and it does quite well. I can fry MEQs like there's no tomorrow and pop most transports before they get in range.

I expect Las/Plas Gunline IG with Armor Support to be a possible spoiler army that will mess with some people's matchups ( IT can mess with most pure Mech Builds) but it matches up very poorly with fast or TZ demons, JetCouncil Eldar ( those guys scare me the most!!!) Battlewagon/KFF Orks and depending on how you protect your PBS Nob Bikers

I was worrying about that for a while. I was considering taking some meltas/flamers on my platoon command squads to repel close range attackers, or maybe a hellhound squadron with a devil dog mixed in.

I think with the shift to melta heavy lists DE raider and Ravager spam w/ Night Shields on everything stands a good chance.

The night shield plays off the weakness of melta, its limited range, and turns it into a 6' ranged gun, much more challenging to get into melta range.

Of course as mentioned, anything that goes against the current grain, like long ranged gun line would have a field day dropping DE raider tansports in the first 2 turns.

I've always ran mech so I'm glad I don't have to run out and buy 10 vehicles to be competitive. I don't see Lascannons coming back though they are too expensive for one shot. I think Str 6 Weapons with a good volume of shots for example Multilasers is where the power is going to be.

Good luck popping Land Raiders and Ironclads with your multilasers.