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I'm probably making some very simple mistakes in what I'm reading here, but I just figured I would throw it out so other people can give me alternative perspectives.

I was reading over the Inspiring Presence rule and it says "Any Tau unit joined by an Ethereal Caste member becomes fearless" and it seems that the way it's written, the ethereal has the power to make a single unit fearless for the whole game each turn. So turn 1 he joins Firewarriors A, they are now fearless, turn 2 he joins Firewarriors B, they are now fearless as well as Firewarriors A who remain fearless because they were joined by an Ethereal Caste member.

Seems a bit speculative to me...

After the Etheral leaves the Firewarrior squad A, are they (squad A) still "joined by an Etheral Caste member"?

No. So no more Fearless for them.

Steelmage99 wrote:After the Etheral leaves the Firewarrior squad A, are they (squad A) still "joined by an Etheral Caste member"?

No. So no more Fearless for them.

But they have already gained fearless, so when he leaves they are just a squad that has fearless, it just seems to me that it was an oversight in leaving out a phrase such as "as long as the ethereal remains with the unit" but the only RAW I can see is that they would keep fearless.

No. Just No.

Drunkspleen wrote:

Steelmage99 wrote:After the Etheral leaves the Firewarrior squad A, are they (squad A) still "joined by an Etheral Caste member"?

No. So no more Fearless for them.

But they have already gained fearless, so when he leaves they are just a squad that has fearless, it just seems to me that it was an oversight in leaving out a phrase such as "as long as the ethereal remains with the unit" but the only RAW I can see is that they would keep fearless.

No, incorrect. it does not say "units who have been joined at some point in the game", it says "units that have been joined by". That means units who have the IC joined to them benefit from the rule.

Gwar! wrote:No, incorrect. it does not say "units who have been joined at some point in the game", it says "units that have been joined by". That means units who have the IC joined to them benefit from the rule.

But it doesn't say they lose fearless when he leaves, only that they gain it when he joins, so why, by RAW, do they lose it?

Drunkspleen wrote:

Gwar! wrote:No, incorrect. it does not say "units who have been joined at some point in the game", it says "units that have been joined by". That means units who have the IC joined to them benefit from the rule.

But it doesn't say they lose fearless when he leaves, only that they gain it when he joins, so why, by RAW, do they lose it?

Once the IC leave, is he joined to the unit? No. Also, "it doesn't say XXX" is not the way to argue rules. It has to say "They remain Fearless" for them to remain fearless, not the other way around.

If the Ethereal is in the squad, the squad is Fearless. If the Ethereal isn't in the squad, the squad is not Fearless. Therefore, when an Ethereal leaves the squad, the squad is no longer Fearless.

But it doesn't say they lose fearless when he leaves...

And where does it say that they keep it? It doesn't. They're no longer a unit that has been joined by an Ethereal so they're no longer fearless.

RAW-plausable. RAI-no way, and it just seems stupid

It comes back to the fact that 40k is an updating, seperated turn environment. Simmilar to rules who have the 'must not have moved' restriction. This does not mean they cannot have ever moved in the game, just that turn. The Etherial is the same way, the rule is conditional to the moment. Is the Etherial joined to a unit at this moment? if yes, that unit is now fearless.

I have a nice way of resolving issues like this in the games I play. I let my opponent do all the RAW rules lawyering that he wants, but each time he does it, I get to kick him in the balls....... the games tend to stay on track that way,

Drunkspleen wrote:I'm probably making some very simple mistakes in what I'm reading here, but I just figured I would throw it out so other people can give me alternative perspectives.

I was reading over the Inspiring Presence rule and it says "Any Tau unit joined by an Ethereal Caste member becomes fearless" and it seems that the way it's written, the ethereal has the power to make a single unit fearless for the whole game each turn. So turn 1 he joins Firewarriors A, they are now fearless, turn 2 he joins Firewarriors B, they are now fearless as well as Firewarriors A who remain fearless because they were joined by an Ethereal Caste member.

They're using "joined" in a present tense form, not past tense. So saying he must "be joined", not just having joined.

Angron wrote:I have a nice way of resolving issues like this in the games I play. I let my opponent do all the RAW rules lawyering that he wants, but each time he does it, I get to kick him in the balls....... the games tend to stay on track that way,

No no. That's what the hard cover rule book is for. so when someone argues RAW you beat them with the rule book untill they see it your way

VoxDei wrote:

Angron wrote:I have a nice way of resolving issues like this in the games I play. I let my opponent do all the RAW rules lawyering that he wants, but each time he does it, I get to kick him in the balls....... the games tend to stay on track that way,

No no. That's what the hard cover rule book is for. so when someone argues RAW you beat them with the rule book untill they see it your way

both very good points and I think central to the future of 40k