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In my last Apoc game my opponent used Scaby, and we ran into a disagreement about his Blade of Decay.

The rule in IA say:

Blade of Decay: Forged in the Blighted Pit using Nurgle's most potent diseases, every wound caused by the Blade of Decay is double, so if the Great Unclean One causes 1 wound then it becomes 2, if he caused 2 wounds this becomes 4, etc. Note, this only affects creatures with wounds.

the chaos player charged scaby into a space wolf unit containing 7 wolf guard bodyguard in terminator armor led by Logan Grimnar, and a few other independent characters, he directed his attacks at the Wolf Guard Bodyguard and got 4 hits, 4 wounds, which the space wolf player failed all 4 of his 3+ invul saves (stormshields) the chaos player then mentioned the blade of decay and that all the body guard and Logan were killed (8 models, wounds divided evenly, with instant death on Logan.) An argument ensued because the space wolf player thought the rule was 2 wounds to each model individually instead of to each unit, which would explain the pluralization "wounds" at the end of the statement. The chaos player figured it was just after saves are taken you remove twice the number of models in single wound model units.

what do you think?

It doubles only after you cause the wound. The way I see it working is Thus:
Roll to hit and wound as normal.
Allocate your wounds to whatever models you want.
Each of those models now takes 2 wounds and attempts 2 saves (if available) either all together if a SImple unit or one at a time if a Complex Unit.

Well if he quoted it exactly, then it has to wound before it can double.

Since you cannot have a wound without failing a save then it would deal two wounds to a single model, the same way Implant Attacks work.

BTW Demogerg, its been FOREVER since I saw the movie your avatar is from, do you happen to remember what its called?

Actually ragewind, you suffer a wound as soon as you sucessfully roll to wound. What you suffer when you fail an armour save is an UNSAVED wound. Those are the buggers wot kill da kernal!

Thats the way I saw it, but it ended with scaby going through 4000 points worth of space wolves in 3 turns because the other team refused to compromise.


Next game I'm fielding a Reaver Titan and 2 Thunderhawk Gunships to kill this absolutely broken unit on turn 1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The movie is
Robot Jox

Demogerg wrote:Thats the way I saw it, but it ended with scaby going through 4000 points worth of space wolves in 3 turns because the other team refused to compromise.


Next game I'm fielding a Reaver Titan and 2 Thunderhawk Gunships to kill this absolutely broken unit on turn 1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The movie is
Robot Jox

Throw in a Warlord or you fail at Apoc

Well, Gwar, I think I will disagree with you there.
"Caused" wounds would be after saves, where as "dealt" wounds would be before saves IMO.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Gwar! wrote:

Demogerg wrote:Thats the way I saw it, but it ended with scaby going through 4000 points worth of space wolves in 3 turns because the other team refused to compromise.


Next game I'm fielding a Reaver Titan and 2 Thunderhawk Gunships to kill this absolutely broken unit on turn 1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The movie is
Robot Jox

Throw in a Warlord or you fail at Apoc

I would, but I dont have enough room at my desk at work to scratchbuild a Warlord.

The terms from the BRB are wounds and unsaved wounds. You lose 1 Wound for every UNSAVED wound you suffer, not just every wound you suffer. (otherwise Terminators making their save against wounds inflicted by Krak Missiles would be saaaaaaad Pandas)

Demogerg wrote:
Next game I'm fielding a Reaver Titan and 2 Thunderhawk Gunships to kill this absolutely broken unit on turn 1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The movie is
Robot Jox

Mind War?

Ragewind wrote:

Demogerg wrote:
Next game I'm fielding a Reaver Titan and 2 Thunderhawk Gunships to kill this absolutely broken unit on turn 1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The movie is
Robot Jox

Mind War?

Gargantuan creatures are immune =(

The only other 2 similar examples are unfortunately much more clearly worded, the Tyranid Implant Attack Biomorph says "A model that does not pass a saving throw when wounded by a creature with an implant attack suffers two wounds instead of one" clearly this works close to the way that the OP thought the Blade of Decay would of course the Blade of decay would grant 2 saves for 2 seperate wounds since it clearly doubles before saves are made. The other example is the Dark Eldar Character Drazhar who'se Disemboweller Blades state "... that can cause 2 wounds for each hit inflicted (this means that 2 wound rolls are made for each successful hit)".

While it's a bit vague I think the Blade of Decay goes the way of Drazhar. At the completion of rolling the dice to wound the great unclean one has either succesfully caused a wound, or failed to, because it was the roll "to wound" meaning if it succeeds wounding is the event that has occured.

Like Gwar I think the rules make a distinction between Wounds and Unsaved Wounds, where I differ is in thinking that the doubling occurs before wound allocation rather than after, this is obviously a vague point though and there's no firm reason in my opinion to say whether the doubling should go before or after wound allocation.

Looks like you simply double the number of wounds that the unit takes.

So if he swung into the Wolfguard Terms and dealt 4(8) wounds, then assuming the Terms had identical equipment they would all have died, however Grimnar would be untouched because he was not attacked.

It does more against similarly equipped units, and less against one-wound unique units because allocation can throw the double wounds onto a single wound model.