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Yes yes, I know that Plague Marines are best for this type of list, blah blah. But, I am limited to the models I own and about another 50 bucks worth of stuff that I can buy. Apart from this, I have a few more terminators, a Terminator Lord who could be used as a sorc, about 15-20 more berzerkers, and one more Land Raider and Rhino. This is the basic list I have in mind, but I have two other variants I want to try.

I could drop two Oblits, since the NM will be making good use of Lash with their Doom Sirens, and with those points, I could get more Berzerkers to fill out the squads to ten, and with a little bit more points juggling, get a GD as well. Alternatively, by dropping the two Oblits, I could get four bikers with an Icon of Nurgle, or three with a PW or PF champ.

HQ

Lash Prince 155
Lash Prince 155

Elites

3x Terminators 105
- 3 Combi-meltas
- Dedicated Land Raider, DP 240

3x Terminators 105
- 3 Combi-plasmas
- Dedicated Land Raider, DP 240

Troops

8x Berzerkers 208
- AC/PF

8x Berzerkers 208
- AC/PF

6x Noise Marines 205
- AC/DS/PW
- Rhino, combi-flamer

6x Noise Marines 205
- AC/DS/PW
- Rhino, combi-flamer

Heavy Support

3x Oblits 225

3x Oblits 225

3x Oblits 225


TOTAL: 2501


The strategy here is pretty basic. The Berzerkers ride in the Termies Land Raiders, assaulting enemy units off of objectives or camping out on important ones in their Raiders. The NM units are quick, effective anti-troops units, with AP3 heavy flamers and an I5 Power Weapon in each one, they can do some pretty good damage, especially combined with lash and the mobility of the rhinos. Lash Princes and Oblits are pretty straightforward, and the termies are just suicide Deep Strike units I bought for their transports.

With the alternate lists above, I will have harder Zerk units and a nice Daemon bomb to drop, as I have found that GDs can really mes the opponent up. Alternatively, I have a T6 biker unit that can really ruin an opponents day by, for example, tarpitting a blobbed Guard unit, with little or no fear of getting hit back.

This is similar to what I plan to run except that I'm using plague marines instead of noise marines

What worries me about the list is the low number of vehicles. With only 4, a list with strong anti-vehicle could leave you footslogging pretty easily. The vehicle based heavy support and elites in the chaos codex don't excite me though, so it is hard to go full mech.

What concerns me are two Melta vet squads in Valk's who get to go first. A scout move followed by the regular move and the Valk's drop off 2 Melts vet squads to destroy the LR's. Now it's a long range firefight the CSM will struggle with. That's the only reason I'm afraid to bring Chaos to the Ard Boyz

Drop an oblit squad for another land raider.
3 is kinda the golden number in my experience.
Turn 1 NM squad into a berzerker squad, and put it in that land raider.
OR turn 1 nm squad into a vanilla squad with a heavy weapon for camping objectives.

You could drop the DP on all your vehicles.

LRs or not, you need more bodies. I'm sure you knew that was coming from me anyway, but this list does not have enough models to affect anything significantly. The last thing you need is a gimmicky bike squad (that's still just 4 really expensive models that get IDed as though they were T4). This list sorta hands out KP.

There isnt any point getting a GD because all of your champions are very expensive and quite good. Bikes are hideously overprices, especially small squads with icons.

Both squads of terminators should have combi-meltas if they are DSing. You have enough S7 AP2 fire from plasma cannon, but nothing kills a tank like a melta gun in 5th.

Lack of plague marines not withstanding, I think the list is good. You could drop an oblit (I wouldnt drop more at 2500pts) for a couple of rhinos, berzerkers or to give your NM squads sonic blasters. I also think that you should drop the combi-flamers to give the berzerkers a couple of personal icons. The extra template is nice, but you shouldnt have too much trouble with infantry because of the oblits, so its much more important to be able to put your terminators where you need them to be to cause the most damage.

Against Valks start your LRs in reserve and shoot them down the turn you come in.

G

Well, Cannerus, at least you are consistent.

These are all good ideas, and I'm glad to see that the opinion is generally against the bikers - they were mostly just an afterthought idea.

I don't think there is much I can do to lose KP. Putting more bodies on the table won't really reduce my KP, and the need for transports means that I'll probably even have more KP. I could get another 8 models (4 more zerks and 4 more NM) instead of any other options if I drop two Obliterators. That would give all my trops alot more staying power.

I originally started to draw up this list with the intent to include all the LAnd Raiders I own (3), but I didn't like the look of the army when I was done. There simply weren't enough models on the table. One option I have, however, is to drop a full 3 Oblits instead of just two, and drop one termicide unit as well, to move one Land Raider into an HS slot. This gives me over 300 points to play with, which could round out existing troops units and add in a third, or any number of other useful changes. The problem there is that with only 6 oblits, at this point level, they will go down relatively easily. Also, though it costs 20 points, I have found DP to be invaluable to keep my Raiders moving and shooting. On an armor 14 vehicle, the majority of hits will cause a shaken or stunned result, basically meaning my Raiders can ignore alot of fire. Barring that, they need to keep moving, and extra armor is all but required if I don't have DP, and only 5 points less.

As things are now, I am liking the list as-is best, or with 2 less Oblits for extra Zerks and NM. Any other suggestions for how I can improve the list?

You know you don't have staying power and a ridiculously low model count when my pure GK Ard Boyz list would outnumber your by almost 10 models. That's w/3 Landraiders and 12 Termies .

I'd say do whatever you can to get more bodies. Anyone running Mechdar w/dragons, vets in valks, and tau are gonna eat this army alive due to the fact that they can wipe out major components of your army with only small part of theirs.

Hulksmash wrote:You know you don't have staying power and a ridiculously low model count when my pure GK Ard Boyz list would outnumber your by almost 10 models. That's w/3 Landraiders and 12 Termies .

I'd say do whatever you can to get more bodies. Anyone running Mechdar w/dragons, vets in valks, and tau are gonna eat this army alive due to the fact that they can wipe out major components of your army with only small part of theirs.

That is ultimately the problem, and is why I am thinking of dropping the land raiders and going for more troops in rhinos instead... I was planning a similar list to the one used by the OP. Thing is, everyone is going to be ready to face 3+ land raider lists from Grey Knights and space marine players. Take a look at the Ard Boyz lists on this site- eldar running 25-30 fire dragons, IG with 4 meltas in nearly every squad plus lascannon valks, plus Vulcan lists and other melta-heavy lists. Land Raiders go down to concentrated melta fire and then your small model count kills you.

Dropping the raiders for more troops in rhinos is going to be better considering the anti-mech metagame that we are going to see in this year's ard boyz.... the only question is whether or not your local store is going to mirror the pattern we are seeing online.