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ok, here's the list i'm planning on. I'm a relatively new player so, please, any help will be greatly appreciated.

HQ 1: 351pts

Shas'o w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT SI Positional Relay and Shield Drone
BG 1 w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA BK and Shield Drone
BG 2 w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA and Shield Drone

HQ 2: 326pts

Shas'o w/ MP PR HWDC MT and Shield Drone
BG 1 w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA BK and Shield Drone
BG 2 w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA and Shield Drone

Fast 1: 216pts

Pathfinders x7 plus Shas'ui w/ BK
Devilfish w/ DP FD MT and Gun Drones

Fast 2: 216pts

Pathfinders x7 plus Shas'ui w/ BK
Devilfish w/ DP FD MT and Gun Drones

Fast 3: 425pts

Piranha x5 w/ FBx5 DPx5 FDx5 TAx5

Heavy 1: 180pts

Broadside Team Ldr w/ TLRG SMS ASS HWDC and 1 Shield Drone
Broadside w/ TLRG SMS and ASS

Heavy 2: 260pts

Broadside Team Ldr w/ TLRG SMS ASS HWDC and 1 Shield Drone
Broadside x2 w/ TLRG SMS and ASS

Heavy 3: 175pts

Hammerhead w/ RG BC DP FD MT

Troop 1: 135pts

Fire Warriors x11 plus Shas'ui with BK

Troop 2: 135pts

Fire Warriors x11 plus Shas'ui with BK

Troop 3: 77pts

Kroot x11

GAk where do i start?

1. Your spending WAY too many points on shield drones, since the Wound allocation rules changed they are nowhere close to worth their points. save yourself the points.

2. HQ #2 doesn't need to be a shas'o save yourself 10 points and get a shas'el with a target array.

3. Replace the GD on your devilfish with SMS as gundrones on fish give up an extra kill point.

4. 5 Pir in 1 unit is excessive as they cannot split their fire from one another, cut it down to a team of 3.

5. I'd drop the second of those broadside teams in favor of another Railhead because large blast templates are infact your friends. and any more than 2 Broadsides in a squad is usually overkill

6. Get a squad of deathrain suits. and give them target locks with a team leader with marker drones. (only if Target locks still fly in your circle) A deathrain suit is a suit with a twin linked misslepod for transport hunting.

7. I recommend using the pathfinder's devilfish close to your firewarriors. So it will function as a transport for them.

8. If you can spare the points get a Stealth team. I love mine.

I don't play Tau but looking over your list you seem to have a lot of points spent in HQ! I would cut out some points there and use the points to put your fire warriors in a transport, otherwise they will never ever make it to an objective.

I do agree that you are spending to much on your HQ and need more Elite suits, but the overall way you built your army was smart. By that I mean you didn't waste a lot on firewarriors, it might be better to just take one squad and drop the pathfinders for Kroot. Kroot are great just for infiltrating and denying deep strike and outflanks.

Piranhas are great for blocking movement so keep them cheap because they might be used for suicide. FB's on them is great though. They should probably be split up into 2 groups of 2 if you drop your pathfinders. Braodsides with ASS are also a great choice, the TL needs a targetting array (the thing that allows him to shoot a different unit than the other broadside)

Red_Lives wrote:GAk where do i start?

1. Your spending WAY too many points on shield drones, since the Wound allocation rules changed they are nowhere close to worth their points. save yourself the points.

2. HQ #2 doesn't need to be a shas'o save yourself 10 points and get a shas'el with a target array.

3. Replace the GD on your devilfish with SMS as gundrones on fish give up an extra kill point.

4. 5 Pir in 1 unit is excessive as they cannot split their fire from one another, cut it down to a team of 3.

5. I'd drop the second of those broadside teams in favor of another Railhead because large blast templates are infact your friends. and any more than 2 Broadsides in a squad is usually overkill

6. Get a squad of deathrain suits. and give them target locks with a team leader with marker drones. (only if Target locks still fly in your circle) A deathrain suit is a suit with a twin linked misslepod for transport hunting.

7. I recommend using the pathfinder's devilfish close to your firewarriors. So it will function as a transport for them.

8. If you can spare the points get a Stealth team. I love mine.

1. I disagree, having 1 or 2 in command team is worthwhile as they can eat that melta/missile shot. Though I confess to just taking one as I don't like to spend the points I could use on another squad of FW or Kroot on drones. That being said I understand the drones and the different armaments since your going for the option to run ninja tau in KP games i'm assuming.

2. Agreed but i'd say make both shas'el's and save 20 points

3. Not worth the points. 20 more points to eliminate a kill point is excessive. Most tau armies are gonna run high on kill points and those units don't have to start on the table anyway because of his Positional Relay. That's the game where nothing is on the table for pretty much 4 turns.

4. If he didn't give them target locks to shoot at different targets i agree. However if he can spare the 25 points (which we've shown he can) i vote for keeping them. It keeps the KP's down and makes for a very nasty fast unit.

5. I agree but for a different reason. Mobility! Broadsides can be caught and smashed in the face pretty easily, not so much a Hammerhead. I would use the extra points towards possibly running a stealthsuit team.

6. If he keeps the broadsides he doesn't need this. If he doesn't I could see this working. Bear in mind OP that for the cost of the second HQ unit you can almost get 2 squads of normal crisis suits. One Deathrain (as mentioned above though I like to add flamers to mine, flamer/TL MP, so they have something to use against hordes) and one Fireknife/Plasma Fusion Gun squad. In fact I think your only about 25 points short of being able to make that switch. It does increase your kill points but it drastically increases the effectiveness of your list I think.

7. Pretty sure he was gonna do this anyway though it's a good thing to mention as the OP stated he was new to tau and might not have thought about it.

8. Totally agree. Stealthsuits are the greatest harassment unit in the game. Just use them wisely!

@Hancock.tom

As was mentioned he probably plans to put the Firewarriors into the Pathfinders devilfish.

@Ezekk

I think he's needs at least the two squads since then he has the mobility to grab objectives.

I would be careful though of only having 3 troop units. This probably isn't going to be enough in most games to score that massacre that you need to place in Ard Boyz. Last year I placed higher than someone w/3 wins even though I lost a game cause I scored a high scoring loss and 2 massacres and they only got minor wins. Just something to keep in mind. But overall your list is a good start. There are a few tweaks you could do but I'd say try to get some practice games in and you'll see why some of us are saying the things we are

Massive thanks to you all around. You all are great.

Yes, i do plan on using my devilfish to protect and cart my FW around. i'd hoped that 3 troop units would be enough to take or at least put some objectives in dispute.

Could anyone point me to info about kill points? I really have no idea how games are scored. me My friend and I usually just play missions or anihalation without scoring anything.

And with some tweeks to my list from all your suggestions i have an extra 107pts. Should i gor for a 2 man crisis squad or maybe another Kroot squad?

Odd I count your point total at 2111 with changes. (dropping shield drones and adding SMS)

Did you add a stealth team?

A deathrain team?

W/ stealth team - 2311

W/ Death rains (3x w/ flamers) 2252

Both -2447 (I think)

My newly tentative army goes like this.

HQ: 326pts
Shas'el w/ MP PR BK HWDC HWMT Positional Relay Stimulant Injector and 2x Shield Drones
Bodyguard w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA and 1 shield Drone
Bodyguard w/ MP PR HWMT TA

HQ: 296pts
Shas'el w/ MP PR BK HWDC HWMT TA and 1 Shield Drone
Bodyguard w/ MP PR HWDC HWMT TA and 1 Shield Drone
Bodyguard w/ MP PR HWMT TA

Fast: 216pts
Pathfinder x7 plus a Shas'ui w/ BK
Devilfish w/ BC GD DP FD MT

Fast: 216pts
Pathfinder x7 plus a Shas'ui w/ BK
Devilfish w/ BC GD DP FD MT

Fast: 450pts
Piranha x5 w/ FB DP FD TL TA on all of them

Heavy: 185pts
BroadsideTL w/ SMS TLRG ASS HWDC HWTL and 1 Shield Drone
Braodside w/ SMS TLRG ASS

Heavy: 185pts
BroadsideTL w/ SMS TLRG ASS HWDC HWTL and 1 Shield Drone
Braodside w/ SMS TLRG ASS

Heavy: 175pts
Hammerhead w/ RG BC DP FD MT TA

Elite: 104pts
Crisis SuitTL w/ F TWMP BK
Crisis Suit w/ F TWMP

Troop: 135pts
Fire Warriors x11 plus Sha'sui w/ BK

Troop: 135pts
Fire Warriors x11 plus Sha'sui w/ BK

Troop: 77pts
Kroot x11

Total: 2500pts

More suggestions and thoughts?

Hmm i would drop a few piranhas for more Elite crisis suits.
Crisis suits, to my mind, are THE best thing the tau army has got.

If you want a chance at winning your still gonna need more troops. The problem is that generally KP's are one for each unit or vehicle destroyed. Your army doesn't have a ton of them so that part is good. The problem is that in at least one mission to get a massacre your going to probably need to hold at least 3 objectives to 0 to get a massacre. With only 3 troop choices and one of them not mounted that's not going to happen.

The list i'm considering for instance has 5 troop choices. 3x12 Firewarriors in Devilfish and 2x6 Firewarriors that ride in the Pathfinders Devilfish.

Agree with Hulksmash here, 4 is the minimum number of troops you should be fielding in any tournament. There is debate over the value of more than 4, but most everyone agrees that 3=loss.

Hulksmash wrote:If you want a chance at winning your still gonna need more troops. The problem is that generally KP's are one for each unit or vehicle destroyed. Your army doesn't have a ton of them so that part is good. The problem is that in at least one mission to get a massacre your going to probably need to hold at least 3 objectives to 0 to get a massacre. With only 3 troop choices and one of them not mounted that's not going to happen.

The list i'm considering for instance has 5 troop choices. 3x12 Firewarriors in Devilfish and 2x6 Firewarriors that ride in the Pathfinders Devilfish.

I never, in a million years, would have thought to put 2 different units in ONE transport.

Now I haven't been playing long, but how'd I miss that thinking?

Mecha73 wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:The list i'm considering for instance has 5 troop choices. 3x12 Firewarriors in Devilfish and 2x6 Firewarriors that ride in the Pathfinders Devilfish.

I never, in a million years, would have thought to put 2 different units in ONE transport.

Now I haven't been playing long, but how'd I miss that thinking?

You can't put two units in a transport at the same time. Pathfinders are required to purchase a Devilfish. They're not required to ride in it. Thanks to Fifth Edition, anyone can ride in their Devilfish (but can't start the game in it). The Pathfinders aren't in their Devilfish. The Firewarriors climb aboard on Turn 1.

dietrich wrote:

Mecha73 wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:The list i'm considering for instance has 5 troop choices. 3x12 Firewarriors in Devilfish and 2x6 Firewarriors that ride in the Pathfinders Devilfish.

I never, in a million years, would have thought to put 2 different units in ONE transport.

Now I haven't been playing long, but how'd I miss that thinking?

You can't put two units in a transport at the same time. Pathfinders are required to purchase a Devilfish. They're not required to ride in it. Thanks to Fifth Edition, anyone can ride in their Devilfish (but can't start the game in it). The Pathfinders aren't in their Devilfish. The Firewarriors climb aboard on Turn 1.

Oops again???


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hulksmash wrote:If you want a chance at winning your still gonna need more troops. The problem is that generally KP's are one for each unit or vehicle destroyed. Your army doesn't have a ton of them so that part is good. The problem is that in at least one mission to get a massacre your going to probably need to hold at least 3 objectives to 0 to get a massacre. With only 3 troop choices and one of them not mounted that's not going to happen.

The list i'm considering for instance has 5 troop choices. 3x12 Firewarriors in Devilfish and 2x6 Firewarriors that ride in the Pathfinders Devilfish.

So, my 2nd list above would commonly be 14 KP?

Do Piranhas give 1 KP for the unit or 1 KP each?

And i thought someone on these boards mention disembarked Gun Drones become another KP?

Pirahna squadrons are 2 KP. 1 KP for all the Piranhas and 1 KP for the Gun Drone squadron that forms when they disembark (either on purpose or when one of the vehicles is destroyed). If you have 1 Piranha in the squadron or 5, it's still 2 KP's.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And your second list, if I counted right is 19 KPs.

Commander
Bodyguards
Commander
Bodyguards
Pathfinders
Devilfish
Gun Drones
Pathfinders
Devilfish
Gun Drones
Piranhas
Gun Drones
Broadside Team
Broadside Team
Hammerhead
Crisis Team
Firewarriors
Firewarriors
Kroot

Wow, Ok. Thank you for the info