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After buying, building, and painting far too many 40k models, I have decided to try and get into WHFB. I have decided to look into high elves, mostly because their dude on a dragon looks so freakin ballin'

Any advice for a newbie? What armies are most competitive (come on now, your ruleset was designed by GW, your game can't be that balanced), what units are popular, what other armies should I look into, and how similar is the game to 40k?

Welcome to WHFB!

Firstly, I would read the rulebook over and over. This game is certainly more complicated than 40k, there are more subtleties and what-not.

Secondly, the most competitive armies are as follows

HE,WoC,VC,DE,DoC

Though I would advise against DoC (Daemons of Cheese) as if you played them correctly, you will for sure lose all of your gaming friends.

High Elves are a good starter army. They require a bit of finese, like all elves, but when the army works together there's very little your opponent can do about it.

Unit-wise, I'd pick up some spearmen and some archers. These units are necessary and do their jobs pretty decently. About 15 Spears and 10 or so Archers (The box comes with 16, so feel free to make 16)

IMHO, the High Elf army depends on it's special and Rare choices (Much like your Elites and Heavy Support choices) to win it's games. Their Cores unfortunately just don't cut it.

There are 3 "Fighty" Special units, being White Lions, Swordmasters, and Pheonix Guard.

Swordmasters are at one end of the spectrum, highly offensive with a very poor save.

White Lions are in the middle, with a decent save and combat ability.

Pheonix Guard are the most defensive of these 3 units, as they have the best armor.

I'd go with White Lions, as they are more offensive than Pheonix Guard, but have more durability than Swordmasters.

Other great armies include the Empire, Warriors of Chaos, and Lizardmen.

The game of Fantasy Battles is much different than 40k. Units move about in blocks, rather than in a loose formation. This puts more of an emphasis on movement.

In Order of Competetiveness:

1) Cheese Demons: Immune to Psych, Fear Causers with massively underpriced characters, amongst other things.

2) Vampire Counts: Like Cheese Demons, but with the weakness of "Crumbling", meaning if you kill the General theArmy will disintigrate.

3) Dark Elves. Eternal Hatred is Nasty. They do, however, obey normal Psychology, and since they have to pursue can easily be lured out of position. Generally seen as the most powerful army that won't scare people away.

4a) High elves. These guys always strike first in Close combat. They can take lots of Special and Rare choices, and the dreaded Star Dragon. Word of advice for if you decide to play them: Dragon Princes are better than Silver Helms Not Drastically more expensive, but Drastically better.

4b) Lizardmen. These Guys are great. A very balanced army, with very little that screams "Don't take me!", and a wide variety of elite troops, includeing a powerful Core Section.

4c) Warriors of Chaos. Good Troops and Cheap Troops, with Powerful Cavalry and Characters. Have a Distinct Weakness in Shooting (Hellcannon Excluded)

The Last 3 are fairly balanced against each other, High elves being maybe a little stronger. They are readily competetive with Dark Elves, and can, with Difficulty, compete against Demons and Vampires. So if your a WAAC kind of gamer, the first two would be your best choices. If you just want competetive, but not insta-win, the last four would fit the bill.

I would put WoC and Lizards before HE, IMHO.

But that's just me.

P.S. Stay away from Silver Helms. These are a waste of points. (Buy the models though, and see if you can convert some to Dragon Princes)

What's wrong with silver helms? Why are dragon princes better?

I don't play elves, but fight them frequently, and I think it is something like: +9pt, +1WS, +1I, +1Ld and Immunity to fire. Both also take special slots.

As to the HE, Lizards and WoC, like I said, thhey are quite balanced vs each other. It's really hard to tell.

Dragon Princes are just a better choice overall, and they take up a special slot (Silver Helms also take up a special, but are not as good.)

i faced a brutal DP unit with the BSB with the +d6 CR once in a tourney, it was a very scary unit.

I like Dragon Princes, but stay away from the Silver Helm models. I don't care how cheap they are, they need a redo.

Agree with the above. Silver Helms should have stayed in Core Troops, not really strong enough to be a special.

My personal favourite is MSUs of Swordmasters (you can have up to six in a 2000pt force). Despite their small size, your opponent will have to endure 10 S5 attacks from WS6 before he can lay a finger on you. Normally enough to blunt most attacks.

The MSU aspect means that at least some should reach your opponent's battle lines, but still focus your magic and missiles on the opposing shooters in the early turns.

DPs have +1WS, +1I, +1A, +1Ld and immunity to fire compared to Silver Helms at only 7 points more (once you get Silver Helms shields). Well worth the extra points per model, especially when competing for the same force organization slots.

Kind of agreed with Steel Rabbit on the models, though they're passable.


If you're keen on starting up High Elves, I recommend the High Elf Army Box. It's a pretty decent deal (I think you actually save ~30% off MSRP) and doesn't really have anything you won't be using (looking at it, it's 2 Heroes, 2 Mages, 1 Chariot, 8 Silver Helms, 2 units of Archers, 2 small unit of Spears (or one large one) and 2 RBTs).

The only reason I would rank HE's below LM and WoC is because of their relatively low armor saves and T3 all around. This is somewhat mitigated by the ASF rule, which definitely makes attacking even a regular block of Spears a non-trivial risk However, they're still incredibly fragile if they fail to cause enough damage.

Play what you like Rory, enjoy the modeling, and the fluff and the game will come.

WFB is far less forgiving than any 40k game in the world, ever. Case in point: In 40k if I manage to drop a venerable dreadnaught behind your main firebase, you can just turn and shoot the crap out of it. Firepower is the ultimate equalizer. In WFB if I manage to get a giant behind your battle line, I guarantee you're losing one unit, and quite possibly another in spectacular fashion. Luckily, getting a Giant behind your battle line is nearly impossible until turns 5 and 6, when the giant won't have time to do anything anyway.

The HE are a decent army with a few extremely powerful rules, but just like all elves, they are t3 bow carriers, in a t4 gunpowder world.

Ragnar4 wrote:
The HE are a decent army with a few extremely powerful rules, but just like all elves, they are t3 bow carriers, in a t4 gunpowder world.

They are 30" range longbow carriers in a 24" range gunpowder world. You'd be amazed what you can do to those gunpowder missile troops in the first turn, particularly with the help of Curse of Arrow Attraction (which can be a guaranteed selection with Seerwood Staff)

On t'other hand, High Elves can do other stuff too. No need to concentrate on missile power when there's dragons to be had

Flashman wrote:

Ragnar4 wrote:
The HE are a decent army with a few extremely powerful rules, but just like all elves, they are t3 bow carriers, in a t4 gunpowder world.

They are 30" range longbow carriers in a 24" range gunpowder world. You'd be amazed what you can do to those gunpowder missile troops in the first turn, particularly with the help of Curse of Arrow Attraction (which can be a guaranteed selection with Seerwood Staff)

On t'other hand, High Elves can do other stuff too. No need to concentrate on missile power when there's dragons to be had

Oh, I know. I wasn't trying to disparage the High Elves Flashman.

Rory and I have kicked eachother around the 40k board a few times before, so I'm just letting her know what I think one of her gripes is going to be. It's no reason not to play the high elves, but if I know our girl, I know she's going to be pretty ticked about how overpriced the HE bow and arrow seems to be, especially after a few games of getting, what seems like next to nothing from them. Even *with* curse of arrow attraction, you just look at the cost of a unit of 10 archers and wonder "isnt there somewhere I can better spend those points?"

Fair enough

I kind of prefer the up close and personal approach of Swordmasters anyway