Author |
Message |
 |
|
 |
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/23 21:10:43
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Fixture of Dakka
|
Currently amusing myself painting a Tyranid Warrior made from a box set I found at the back of my Warhammer cupboard. This may become my next army project (or it may not).
Anyway, whilst painting Bleached Bone over Leviathan Purple, I find myself wondering exactly how long a brood of Tyranid Warriors will last in a typical game. Their 5+ save doesn't inspire much confidence!
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/07/23 21:11:29
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/23 21:12:00
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Foolproof Falcon Pilot
Somewhere in the unknown universe.
|
If they have a squad of 9 and extended carapace, they should last a little longer. Abuse wound allocation with synapse creatures.
|
Manchu wrote:Agamemnon2 wrote:
Congratulations, that was the stupidest remark the entire wargaming community has managed to produce in a long, long time.
Congratulations, your dismissive and conclusory commentary has provided nothing to this discussion or the wider community on whose behalf you arrogantly presume to speak nor does it engage in any meaningful way the remark it lamely targets. But you did manage to gain experience points toward your next level of internet tough guy. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/23 21:24:47
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
Give them some Termagants to hide behind. It's cheaper than giving them Extended Carapace (slight more expensive points wise-but you get more models and more models is good). Also, but something scarier than them beside them, like a Carnifex or somesuch. Finally, take as many as possible in as many units as possible. Sometimes it's worth taking a brood of nine instead of a Hive Tyrant. Better firepower with a greater Synapse footprint and more wounds.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/23 21:32:29
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Huge Bone Giant
|
The save can be uppped to 4+, they claim cover easily enough, have two wounds (that are immune to ID), can easily have 9 models that are all unique.
Generally they survive as long as I attempt to let them.
They also can deal some real damage at range (I love deathspitters), and still have the capacity to survive (or often enough even win) assaults.
However, if you do not field a(t least one) Hive Tyrant with them they will get annihilated in short order, as most opponents will target synapse units - and even in cover, t4,4+ save will fall pretty quickly without support.
They are 18 wounds, but the Hive Tyrant w/guard have 10w at t6 with 2or3+ save, Also immune to ID, and can claim cover saves with ease.
Edited to add: I like the armor as it lets them save vs bolters (etc.) and they will have a better CC save. But I only put it on half of them.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/07/23 21:33:55
"It is not the bullet with your name on it that should worry you, it's the one labeled "To whom it may concern. . ."
DQ:70S++G+++MB+I+Pwhfb06+D++A+++/aWD-R++++T(D)DM+ |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/23 21:51:30
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Nasty Nob
|
Seconding Deathspitters for all. I've just be upgrading the Strength and giving them EC. The EC is more for insurance if anything. I usually hide them in the back and let them do their thing and I've been real happy with them.
|
"Just pull it out and play with it" -Big Nasty B @ Life After the Cover Save
40k: Orks
Fantasy: Empire, Beastmen, Warriors of Chaos, and Ogre Kingdoms |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 13:24:05
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Fixture of Dakka
|
Accquiring a 4+ save by sitting behind Termagants seems to be the way to go.
Also seems to be some kind of consensus about abusing wound allocation by using unique models. How does this work?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 13:39:14
Subject: Re:Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan
UK
|
Between a ranged warrior brood and a Close-combat warrior brood, you can have 8 or 9 warriors equipped uniquely (respectively).
This means you do-not have to remove whole models when allocating wounds to the warrior squad as each unqiue model forms its own wound group.
This means a squad of 5 models can absorb 5 wounds at still remaing at 100% effectiveness. With a 4+ armor save, gaunts to provide a 4+ cover save and being immune to instant death, these warriors should (at 35ppm to 30ppm between shooty and fighty warriors) be quite resilient.
|
H.B.M.C. wrote:Friend of mine just sent me this:
"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ." Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!
Heh. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 13:42:14
Subject: Re:Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Fixture of Dakka
|
Ah, dead cunning. That never occurred to me, I am clearly not sneaky enough
No doubt the next Codex will nerf it, along with the wonderfully underpriced feeder tendrils.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 13:58:30
Subject: Re:Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan
UK
|
Perhaps.
But I cant wait to see what these Units of Monsterous Creatures will look like.
|
H.B.M.C. wrote:Friend of mine just sent me this:
"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ." Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!
Heh. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 14:41:34
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Rampaging Carnifex
|
What? Warriors aren't monstrous creatures.
Protect your warriors from shooting and combined assaults. Having 1 guy in base to base with a warrior from a Berserker units that just happens to slaugher 15+ gaunts on a charge will make you take those wonderful, wonderful fealress saves on the Warriors too.
To protect from shooting, make sure you have plenty of synapse coverage( People are more scared of Tyrants than Warriors) and use larger than minimum units.
I've been underwhelmed by their (upgraded) close combat ability, but their shooting ( with either Death spitters or devourers) can be a nice addition to your thin shooting phase. I used to run a unit that had 4 units of warriors with 2 sets of devourers, toxin sacs and Enhanced senses. 16 twin linked, living ammo(reroll wounds) strength 4 shots a turn at BS3 gives so some nice infantry killing power. Deathspitters are great these days as well. When upgraded properly a unit of warriors can pump out several S6 ap5 blasts a turn from a 24 inch range assault weapon. It's nice.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/07/24 14:42:12
Dakka. You need more of it. No exceptions.
You ask me for an evil hamburger. I hand you a raccoon.-Captain Gordino
What are you talking about? They're Space Marines, which are heroic. They need to be able to do all the heroic stuff. They fight aliens and don't afraid of anything. -Orkeosarus
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 15:47:25
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Blackclad Wayfarer
From England. Living in Shanghai
|
kirsanth wrote:
Edited to add: I like the armor as it lets them save vs bolters (etc.) and they will have a better CC save. But I only put it on half of them.
I do believe that biomorphs have to be identical on all models, but gun options can be different.
But anyway, warriors do have some survivability problems. You can get around this by fielding multiple units, abusing wound allocation and increasing unit size. In my current nid list i have 24 warriors and a tyrant with 3 guard. Having this much synpase on the board also helps keep the little guys in line a lot longer too. In fact it's nigh impossible to obliterate ALL the synapse on the board in 5 or 6 turns, especially when there are other threats putting on all kinds of hurt.
|
Looking for games in Shanghai? Send a PM |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 15:49:57
Subject: Re:Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Boosting Ultramarine Biker
|
Normally my warriors do pretty well as my opponent is usually more worried about the 3 monstrous creatures on the table instead. A 6+ size squad with scything talons and deathspitters usually does very well. Assuming as well that they are behind a field of gaunts and they usually get ignored until the 4th or 5th turn.
In reality whomever you are facing will normally focus their small arms fire on the closer threat..in this case your squads of gaunts, and any large str/low ap weapons will be aimed at your monstrous creatures. When I play..usually by the time the warriors are withing assault range they have only lost maybe 3-4 wounds (1-2 models).
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 18:30:36
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan
UK
|
Railguns wrote:What? Warriors aren't monstrous creatures.
Yes, ofcourse. I know, I never mentioned they are.
Buuut.. from the way the new IG codex, specifically the order 'Bring it Down', is worded leads me to suggest that the new Tyranid Codex (one that hasnt been written/published) will include units comprised of monsterous creatures.
|
H.B.M.C. wrote:Friend of mine just sent me this:
"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ." Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!
Heh. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 18:36:47
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Fixture of Dakka
|
Razerous wrote:Railguns wrote:What? Warriors aren't monstrous creatures.
Yes, ofcourse. I know, I never mentioned they are.
Buuut.. from the way the new IG codex, specifically the order 'Bring it Down', is worded leads me to suggest that the new Tyranid Codex (one that hasnt been written/published) will include units comprised of monsterous creatures.
Yep, seems reasonable to expect units of Carnifexes in the next Codex.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 18:41:05
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Brainy Zoanthrope
Chesapeake, VA / D.C. area
|
How can you abuse wound allocation in Fifth edition for the warriors?
|
4000 all painted
Tau 3000 paints base coated
Tyranids 16k - 75% painted
Orks - 5000k - 30% painted? |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 18:41:20
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Huge Bone Giant
|
Lukus83 wrote:kirsanth wrote:
Edited to add: I like the armor as it lets them save vs bolters (etc.) and they will have a better CC save. But I only put it on half of them.
I do believe that biomorphs have to be identical on all models, but gun options can be different.
I meant half of the broods. But all weapon biomorphs can be varied, not only ranged.
Cover saves help, but there are times that they are well used in places and times that they are ignored.
Having a brood (or 2) with 4+ save (and perhaps leaping) can help.
ymmv
|
"It is not the bullet with your name on it that should worry you, it's the one labeled "To whom it may concern. . ."
DQ:70S++G+++MB+I+Pwhfb06+D++A+++/aWD-R++++T(D)DM+ |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 19:34:32
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Rampaging Carnifex
|
Razerous wrote:Railguns wrote:What? Warriors aren't monstrous creatures.
Yes, ofcourse. I know, I never mentioned they are.
Buuut.. from the way the new IG codex, specifically the order 'Bring it Down', is worded leads me to suggest that the new Tyranid Codex (one that hasnt been written/published) will include units comprised of monsterous creatures.
Ah, okay, that makes sense. Sorry I misread you.
That may infact be how they handle Nidzilla in the new dex. Take them out of elite and just have Crusher Broods running around.
Apocalypse has affected 40k, hasn't it.(i hope regenate is better than 6+ for one wound a turn for 35 points though.)
|
Dakka. You need more of it. No exceptions.
You ask me for an evil hamburger. I hand you a raccoon.-Captain Gordino
What are you talking about? They're Space Marines, which are heroic. They need to be able to do all the heroic stuff. They fight aliens and don't afraid of anything. -Orkeosarus
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 19:48:50
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
acreedon:
In 5th edition wounds are allocated to the entire unit, but saving throws are taken in batches, with each batch being defined as models that are identical: models with the same profile, weapons, wargear, and special rules.
If each Tyranid Warrior has different wargear, they no longer match the definition of 'identical', and each Warrior's wounds are saved against separately. If they were identical, then you would roll for the whole unit and removing whole models where possible.
For example, suppose that a unit of nine identical Tyranid Warriors suffered nine AP2 wounds, and a unit of nine non-identical Tyranid Warriors suffered nine AP2 wounds.
The first group would suffer four casualties, leaving four healthy Tyranid Warriors and one Tyranid Warrior with a single wound left.
The second group would suffer no casualties, leaving nine wounded Tyranid Warriors left.
While some people consider this 'abuse', I consider it to be an intended consequence of the system, intended to promote diversity in units. Automatically Appended Next Post: Railguns:
I expect you're right about the broods of Monstrous Creatures. Given that the Imperial Guard can now take squadrons of tanks, artillery, and so on, I think broods of Tyranid Monstrous creatures is the next step. I hope they reconfigure Tyranid Warriors and Termagants into a Platoon-like structure for Troop choices too, though rather than separate units include Warriors in Termagant and Hormugaunt broods.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/07/24 19:52:21
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 19:58:21
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Rampaging Carnifex
|
That would be an interesting take. It would also pretty much gut the Elites section down to Lictors, so they'd have plenty of room to expand that. Like during 3rd edition, when Hormagaunts were moved to troops it left Gargoyles as the only fast attack choice, so they added Raveners. I'm hoping for the return of Stranglewebs and spike rifles myself.
|
Dakka. You need more of it. No exceptions.
You ask me for an evil hamburger. I hand you a raccoon.-Captain Gordino
What are you talking about? They're Space Marines, which are heroic. They need to be able to do all the heroic stuff. They fight aliens and don't afraid of anything. -Orkeosarus
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 20:08:38
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Brainy Zoanthrope
Chesapeake, VA / D.C. area
|
thank you! now i understand warrior spam besides tons of deathsplitters.
|
4000 all painted
Tau 3000 paints base coated
Tyranids 16k - 75% painted
Orks - 5000k - 30% painted? |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 20:11:51
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
I figure they could bump the Zoanthropes up to Elite. That would make space in Heavy Support for lone plastic Hierodules or Trygons. I'm definitely expecting plastic Gargoyles.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 20:46:43
Subject: Re:Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan
UK
|
I mean, I havent played with larger uniquely equipped warriors but the deathspitter, is good all-around. Str6 is the optimum for everything really, wounds t4 on 2's, can instant death T3, packs a punch when dealing with transports and it has a very decent range (24" assault) meaning you can move & fire and be happy. But what do you do when a player starts rolling off two or three large(ish) sqauds. Im not saying max 8-9 models but roughly 5-6. Happy medium, taking advantage of MSU and wound allocation rules. Okay dakkerites; You have a 6-strong unit. All equipped differently with a ranged load-out (5 deathspitters and one barbed strangler). What will you shoot/charge at it?
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/07/24 20:46:59
H.B.M.C. wrote:Friend of mine just sent me this:
"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ." Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!
Heh. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2009/07/24 21:45:44
Subject: Tyranid Warrior Life Expectancy?
|
 |
Rampaging Carnifex
|
Anything that isn't a Vehicle or Monstrous creature first. Failing available infantry targets, then go for light vehicles. Heavy vehicles will laugh at those weapons, and Monstrous creatures/characters will most shrug that off. Try to force infantry out of transports with other units first, then fire away at them.
|
Dakka. You need more of it. No exceptions.
You ask me for an evil hamburger. I hand you a raccoon.-Captain Gordino
What are you talking about? They're Space Marines, which are heroic. They need to be able to do all the heroic stuff. They fight aliens and don't afraid of anything. -Orkeosarus
|
|
 |
 |
|