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One word: idiots.

"A campaign on conservative talk radio, fueled by President Obama's calls to control exorbitant medical bills, has sparked fear among senior citizens that the health-care bill moving through Congress will lead to end-of-life "rationing" and even "euthanasia.""

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32247482/ns/politics

That ANYONE would belief crap like this is why our politics don't work..."Democracy is dependent upon the education and participation of the citizenry," said Franklin. When we have voters THIS stupid so as to believe lines like these, it's a wonder that anything, ever, gets done.

I saw on MSNBC the other night that 56% of Republicans have doubts that Obama is a United States citizen???

Seriously - I've said it before, I'll say it again, there ought to be some sort of competency exam one needs to pass before one is allowed to vote. Voting is a responsibility as well as a right...so for people who don't take personal responsibility to educate themselves when they have the opportunity, I don't see how allowing them to vote helps any of us...the flip side of that is that society is then responsible to make sure that every citizen has the ability and resources to educate themselves such that they truly have fair opportunity to otherwise taking away their right to vote isn't just as they never could have educated themselves in the place...

...but, of course, that sort of socially-responsible, long-term-thinking plan would require a government that actually functions efficiently and has the best interests of its people in mind as their first and only priority.

Seriously...the tripe that so many Americans seem to lap up like servile children should have ceased amazing me a long, long time ago, but I still find myself getting irritated when I read articles like the one I linked to. Just how stupid ARE people?

Americans are idiots and your flag says your an American which then must mean you are also an idiot and thus I can trust your indictment that Americans are idiots which may mean that we may not be idiots and that you could have a point but that would again mean that you are an idiot and I can't trust your point...and on and on.

Bravo

Very stupid. I have very little faith in random people off the street. Most aren't worth the time it takes to say hello.

I think there should be compentency exams for everything - from driving to procreation to buying a house. It would solve half the problems we have instantly.

Welcome to the U.S. enjoy your DERRRRR!!!

http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2008G.html

If we learn to guide each other, we can find ways to spark action. I don't truly see the point of paying attention to this nonsense aside a good laugh. Some things are just ridiculous, others just go to far, this could be seen as either really. DERRRR!!!

Democracy only works when the citizens that vote are educated. That only happens when their media is truthful. That doesn't happen any more.

We need new laws governing media decency and honesty. Yellow journalism on television has gotten way out of hand.

ShumaGorath wrote:Democracy only works when the citizens that vote are educated. That only happens when their media is truthful. That doesn't happen any more.

We need new laws governing media decency and honesty. Yellow journalism on television has gotten way out of hand.

You'll need to have a Constitutional Convention first.

Everyone knows the Boston Massacre was staged and the liberal patriot media (secretly controlled by the landed gentryocracy) blew it way out of proportion.

Ha, I laugh at the scare induced panic of euthanasia. It's as if they don't know what it really means.

"The biggest argument against democracy is a five minute discussion with the average voter."

Winston Churchill said that and boy do I agree with him.

The trouble is that people are, quite frankly, easily lead. All anyone in any position of influence in the media, such as a radio show, has to do to interfere with anything is just make up any collection of half baked nonsense and chances are it will be repeated as fact in pubs around the country within a matter of hours. Whilst this certainly isn't limited to just the right, it's certainly a staple tactic of right wing commentators.

It happens in the UK as well. There is a particularly odious little bastard by the name of Richard Littlejohn who's entire career has been built on half truths and hyperbolic venom repeated as fact. His catchphrase, without a hint of irony, is "you couldn't make it up" despite that fact that that is precisely what he does. Every sodding week.

guh huh huh

^

So what is to be done with the hundreds of millions of people who fail said competency tests? That would be just another drain on the tax payers. I agree that stupidity is on the rise, but there's nothing to be done about it.

nothing to be done about it...

nothing to be done about it...

nothing to be done about it...

nothing to be done about it...

Just keep saying that to yourself and it will become a reality...

We can do something about this...

It involves some thought, experience, and a bit of trial and error, not repetitive mantras about the world coming to an end. Life has always sucked, and all we can always do is change that to improve life a little bit more.

Ok, before insulting posts get underway, let's try and keep the discussion to finding an acceptable course, theoretical or otherwise, to the topic at hand.

I agree with Wrex

You can't blame the Americans. They were just born that way. *snigger*

Emperors Faithful wrote:You can't blame the Americans. They were just born that way. *snigger*

Take back the votes for the BNP before throwing nationalism into this please. You're not much better.

*snigger*

Thanks for proving me right.

Why? one simple answer.

When the 2 sides discusses an issue , they always forget what they were discussing and start going at each other's throat.

Cairnius wrote:
I saw on MSNBC the other night that 56% of Republicans have doubts that Obama is a United States citizen???

Meet...

Cairnius wrote:
Seriously...the tripe that so many Americans seem to lap up like servile children should have ceased amazing me a long, long time ago, but I still find myself getting irritated when I read articles like the one I linked to. Just how stupid ARE people?

Yeah, what were you saying?

As funny as I find this, we have similar problems with bogans. Oh how I hate the bogans...

Cairnius wrote:Seriously - I've said it before, I'll say it again, there ought to be some sort of competency exam one needs to pass before one is allowed to vote. Voting is a responsibility as well as a right...so for people who don't take personal responsibility to educate themselves when they have the opportunity, I don't see how allowing them to vote helps any of us...the flip side of that is that society is then responsible to make sure that every citizen has the ability and resources to educate themselves such that they truly have fair opportunity to otherwise taking away their right to vote isn't just as they never could have educated themselves in the place...

The people who choose the questions for the voting exam will be the same people who are currently vying for the votes of the idiots. It'll be the same people who build the disinformation networks that play to the worst fears of the idiots, selling them lies they want to believe.

So yes, it's true that a lot of voters believe some very stupid things. But the solution isn't a test that'll stop people voting, it's in improving the level of political debate, in increasing the level of intellectual honesty expected of others. So it isn't just about people believing goofy stuff like 'Obama is a secret Muslim', it's about people calling universal healthcare socialism. That kind of partisan ignorance shouldn't be accepted.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jimi Nemesis wrote:As funny as I find this, we have similar problems with bogans. Oh how I hate the bogans...

Yep, every country has idiots, no more and no less than the US. But the political debate (in Australia at least) doesn't play up to the idiots, target them with specific dog whistles.

No-one claimed Kevin Rudd or Malcolm Turnbull were secret muslims, secret foreign citizens, socialists, communists or anything like. The political debate could be a lot better here, but it isn't like the debate in the US.

dogma wrote:

Cairnius wrote:
I saw on MSNBC the other night that 56% of Republicans have doubts that Obama is a United States citizen???

Meet...

Cairnius wrote:
Seriously...the tripe that so many Americans seem to lap up like servile children should have ceased amazing me a long, long time ago, but I still find myself getting irritated when I read articles like the one I linked to. Just how stupid ARE people?

Yeah, what were you saying?

Yea, MSNBC sucks, but what else do the majority of Americans tune into? It's not like they are going to just say, oh well MSNBC let us down, lets all go to the library!

Naturally they should turn to the fair and balanced FOX News.

You could always watch CNN's exciting coverage of what people on twitter think.

I think we should have a competency test but if you fail you still get to vote, except your vote will be 3/5ths of an actual vote. I mean it's not like testing has ever been used to disenfranchise a group of people.

The American public and media have always been terrible. The stuff people accused John Adams and Thomas Jefferson of planning are as ridiculous as the accusations people throw around now. There's no fixing public discourse, all you can do is make it less terrible.

The funny part is that people are actually finding their own news now, and while they may not get the full scope on the interwebz, they can if they want.

The information is there, it is a few pages of cross referencing away, and most people will only be focusing on one bit of news at a time anyway. As soon as this type of personal news casting becomes more commonplace, the more news stations will rely on the people that they are supposed to be serving.

It is like seeing you waiter get thirsty and getting them some water, it just doesn't make any sense. Not making sense is something the news does with frightening regularity; the stories are yesterdays news recycled in a sensationalist way, while todays news seems to consist more of yesterdays news than todays news...

Yep... get your own news and call into those stupid freaking call shows telling them to just shut down, because no one loves the news anymore, especially cable news... uugghh.

This thread is just made of win, and by win I mean epic fail.

sebster wrote:The people who choose the questions for the voting exam will be the same people who are currently vying for the votes of the idiots. It'll be the same people who build the disinformation networks that play to the worst fears of the idiots, selling them lies they want to believe.

Precisely...which is why I say "I wish" rather than actually create a fringe movement to implement this sort of thing. My wish implies that the test would be set up correctly, but because I know that to be an impossibility I just relegate it to the realm of waking dream rather than a pursuit in reality.

dogma wrote:

Cairnius wrote:
I saw on MSNBC the other night that 56% of Republicans have doubts that Obama is a United States citizen???

Meet...

Cairnius wrote:
Seriously...the tripe that so many Americans seem to lap up like servile children should have ceased amazing me a long, long time ago, but I still find myself getting irritated when I read articles like the one I linked to. Just how stupid ARE people?

Yeah, what were you saying?

Attempts at wit are always appreciated. Thanks both for playing, and for setting up a proof of my argument.

There is a marked difference between a poll and direct statements made by politicians to the media.

Any graduate student who has taken a Research Methods course knows better than to take a poll at face value, but he or she also knows better than to entirely invalidate the results automatically just because they come from a poll. This is a fairly simple question - "Do you think Obama is a United States citizen?" There's not a whole lot of room for interpretation. This isn't some 100-question survey such that we need to look seriously into its design to verify the veracity of the results, or whether we want to look at them at all.

56% is too high a percentage to just blow off. Anything above 10% is well beyond "just the lunatic fringe," and clearly is indicative of a tremendous amount of just plain stupidity. In this case it may actually be more an indicator of servility, in the sense of Republicans lapping up what they are being told by some of their leaders that Obama has never produced his birth certificate which is an out-and-out lie.

The "tripe" I was referring to was, therefore, these sorts of statements made by some Republicans in Congress which then lead to these poll results. Comparing my choosing to read some value into those poll results with people doubting that their President is a citizen of the country he governs as Chief Executive as equivalent acts of stupidity is just a poor exercise in snark, to be sure...but that someone then cheers it on sort of proves my original point...


When I graduated from college with my B.A. my first job as a 20-year-old was working at a company that sold their products through telemarketing. Benefits of a film degree when you don't move out to NYC or LA.

I was a telemarketer for a month, then an appointment confirmer for a few weeks, then asst. manager of the office, and then got promoted out of the telemarketing room into the corporate office working in the finance department. It was a pretty odd leap.

When they offered me the job I took it right away, but then I asked why had they offered it to me? I was only working in the telemarketing office after all, and hadn't demonstrated any of the skills they were going to need me to exercise on a regular basis, I thought. Hence the question.

The owner, a huge 6' 5" Aryan-looking guy, classical percussionist, very sharp and very demanding, looked at me and said "It's a matter of intelligence recognizing intelligence."

I've never forgotten that moment because it explained a whole lot of things I'd borne witness to until then and has continued to explain a lot of things thereafter.