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Hello Dakka!

I thought about this for a while already. The rules state in many cases that units are allowed to deploy near the enemy only at a minimum distance, often 12", sometimes 18".

Now, my question is: Is this meant as exactly 12", so exactly that it is theoretically possible to move 6" and assault 6", given the fact that you move directly and precisely at the enemy unit?
Or is this rule rather made to prevent first turn charging, telling us that the distance between unit and enemy needs to be slightly greater than the possible moving and assaulting distance?

I'm asking for several reasons. First, I saw the second option in some posts here on Dakka, although I can't quote the exact posts they were in. Second, it is simply unclear to me; if GW wanted to allow us first turn charge, they could've set the distance at 11" or 17" in the other case, making it perfectly clear for everyone. On the other hand 13" or 19" would also be clear, no charge for normal (and normal fleeting, 6 inches running) infantry units.

I have no real opinion on what might be the correct one and think this question is rather important, because some tactics rely on first turn assault, while some defensive tactics would also benefit from not being able to be assaulted first turn.

Hope for some input!

Witzkatz

If you deploy 12" away (has to be out of LoS), move 6" and then charge 6" then you will be in base to base contanct and be in assault.

Nobody can guess what GW want to happen (they dont tell us) so we can only play by the rules we have. If a model has enough charge range to get into base contact with an enemy model then it can charge it.

It's perfectly possible for a turn one charge, though rare because you have to move around whatever cover you were hiding in (or be lucky on your terrain tests).

if an infiltrating unit can only move a max of 6" to move and another max of 6" to assault it would be impossible to get a first turn assault off.

Reason is on page 75 under the heading for the USR Infiltrate. "....The infiltrators may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 12" from any enemy unit...."

this is one of the biggest misread lines in 40k since 4th ed. Most people read this as simply 12" and not what it actually says more than 12".

padixon wrote:Reason is on page 75 under the heading for the USR Infiltrate. "....The infiltrators may be set up anywhere on the table that is more than 12" from any enemy unit...."

Padixon has a good point - theoretically, if someone was to move into base contact, then they couldn't have been 'more than 12" away". I change my mind.

More than x" does not mean x" or greater.

If it says "more than 12" then a normal unit cannot charge.

12" if no LOS 18" if there is LOS because of the fleet special rule.

Thanks for all the answers!

Due to translation mistakes, my german rulebook isn't as clear as the original one seems to be. It says something about "not nearer than 12" " somewhere in the middle of the infiltration paragraph and later talks about "more than 12" away" when it comes to infiltrators in buildings.

It seems now very clear to me that option 2 is correct. However, I don't want to stop any kind of discussion on this topic if there is additional info to be found.

For now, thanks!

Also, if it helps, the only army I can find (I hope people find more) that is GUARANTEED a first turn assault is Space Marines. Scout bikers (infiltrate 18.1", scout to 12.1" away, can move 12" to .1" away) and Shrike w/ assault marines (infiltrate 18.1", fleet 1" to 17.1", move 12" to 5.1", assault 6", but that one is without difficult terrain.)

Also, i can't imagine trying to discuss rules through language translations, more power to you sir!

Lash raptors and some Nids can too

Really, what nids? i play nids... hormaguants are close, but not a fully guaranteed.

Lash raptors though, ow, yeah...

The only nids that can infiltrate are Broodlord /w his Stealers, thou they then loose fleet, so no dice there. Outside of that i cant think of any way for them to do it.'
Though Horm and Ravagers could get 1st turn assault. 6" move, 6" Run (fleet) and a nice 12" assault to make for a fun distance of 24" though this hinges on you getting a 6" on run.

The second option, as clearly stated in the rules.

Apart from Shrike and Lash Raptors, IG can easily get first turn charges. Gotta love those Ogryns in the midst of someone's Fire Warriors...

Dark Eldar Wyches in raiders with the combat drug for 12" assualt can get a first turn charge. Move 12, disembark 2, fleet d6, 12" charge.

You MUST deploy over 12" away, however first turn charges are entirely possible all across the board - DE having been the biggest culprits of this for a long time.

Looks like there are a few units able to pull it off, didn't think it would be so many! However, I'm wondering...the poll, which still is in favour of option 2, gained more and more votes for option 1, without supporting this decision with arguments in this thread. I'd be interested in their rules interpretation, as it might add valid points to a discussion.

Isn't getting within 1" of your target considered assaulting? Even if your > 12" but < 13" away you should be able to assault no problem...

scarab5 wrote:Isn't getting within 1" of your target considered assaulting? Even if your > 12" but < 13" away you should be able to assault no problem...

No. Models are simply not allowed to move within an inch outside of the assault phase, generally speaking.

Also, in order to successfully assault a unit, you must have 1 model in base-to-base contact, other wise the declared assault fails.