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Me and a couple of friends have decided to get into Hordes and Warmachine after this years Fantasy 'Ard Boyz. Right now I'm looking at either Circle Orboros or Retribution of Scyrah. What are the typical playstyles of these? How competitive are they in tournaments?

Not enough info to really know on the Retribution yet, as we've only seen stats and rules for a small portion of the faction. So far it looks kind of like Cryx high speed and low armor, with cygnar defense and hybridized shooty/melee units. I'm expecting varying playstyles from the different houses within the Retribution also, so you could expect the Magehunters will be exceptionally fast and lightly armored, while the Dawnguard units will all be slower and more armored. Initial impressions of the Myrmidons (their warjacks) are that they will have a lot of nifty bells and whistles, but will require a lot of focus to operate and will therefore be difficult to use in numbers.

Circle of Orboros deals in high defense (hard to hit) models that almost universally ignore terrain. Combined with a lot of abilities built in to create terrain and counter-magic, this already makes a strong denial game. Their beasts & constructs have a huge number of options for chain attacks and power attacks, but are typically incapable of hitting very hard without some assistance.

Welcome to the Machine!

Circle is considered one of the more powerful factions in the game. There are exceptions, but in general they are highly mobile and have good assassination tactics. Most models in this faction are fragile, so you have to play smart. Some of their models create forests which is their primary denial tactic.

In the past, Circle has been fairly dominant at tournaments, placing second at Nationals two years ago. But as more and more models come out that don't have their LOS blocked by forests, the tougher things get for Circle. In MkII, rough terrain (which forests count as) also do not prevent charges, further weakening Circle's ability to protect their fragile troops.

Retribution of Scyrah hasn't been released yet. Their tournament viability is completely unknown at this point. From what has been previewed in NQ, it looks like they are going to take a versatile combined arms approach with a focus on assassination.

So what does a typical Circle army look like? I've heard the starter box isn't good and want an idea of what I should buy.

Very dependent on which Warlock you choose, but in general it will tend to be 2+ heavy warbeasts, 1-2 light warbeasts, then a fair amount of infantry.

Certain casters push the mold in one direction or the other. Some could do all infantry, some go all beasts. It's really up to you and what you're interested in fielding.

If your area has no WM/H veterans, then your group will definitely be best off starting with the Starter-boxes. They will ease you into the game very nicely. The circle starter box isn't entirely straightforward, and the Argus light warbeast is typically replaced, but there's a lot of depth there and it can do some pretty interesting things.

If you've got veterans around to mix into, then you can probably kick it up a notch and just pick a few casters that you like the idea of, then pick one of those to be the first you'll learn. You can then start purchasing models that will work well with your stable of casters.

We got no, Hordes or Warmachine, vets around here unfortunatly. So you say the starter set is good? Hmmmm, I tend to hear the same about dropping the Argus. Right now I'm thinking of going with one of the Krugers as casters, both models look sweat.

Hit the regular Krueger for now, the epic will be used for larger point games.

He works notoriously well with woldwarden constructs. I hope your friends like challenges.

Yeah there a bunch who enjoy a challenge, one of them especially.

Sweat! The normal one is the one I like more.

So woldwardens work well with him. What about solos and units?

Krueger is particularly well suited to work with almost anything thanks to his spells affecting everything in his control area, or being able to be applied to any 'friendly' model/unit.

In other words, there aren't many bad choices. Druids of orboros for counter magic, wolves of orboros or Gatormen posse for crazy melee threat, minion units or minion warlocks... it's all good really.

Try battlecollege or the dakkawiki for more detailed ideas.

Circle will be getting the MkII treatment in less than six months so it's difficult to say what will be a good purchase.

Perhaps you would be better to purchase models you like the look of rather than the rules for.

We'll know all about Retribution next month when the book is released.

Thanks for the help.

Now my cousion is starting the Legion of Everblight any tips and what not for him? He ussually plays extremly competitivly if that helps (plays Fatecrusher in 40 and Mono-Tzeencth Fantasy).

Same advice as for Circle, I wouldn't want him to be potentially sub par in six months.

The general idea of weathering MKII is:

1. Don't buy doubles of anything.
2. Don't buy something you hate simply because it's powerful.
2. Do buy something you wouldn't mind owning even if it wasn't so useful in games (looks)

4. Find something that sucks at the moment, it will be powerful in MkII.

Battle College has some good tips for MKI. I could speculate about MKII but I'd just be making (educated) guesses.

Circle are eally good at tournaments.

The UK champion won with Circle and didn't drop a single round on the day.

A lot of people have broken down a lot of the playstyles of some of the casters, but I would recommend just picking models you like. You'll be more motivated to play with your favorite models instead of good models. And while there are models that are accepted as being better than others, if you use models that are not seen too often, and you have practice with them because you like them, you will have an edge because you're opponent may not know the tricks of the more unusual models. For example, while people always assume the Argus is really weak, it only costs 54 points and if you practice knowing when to use his bark, being able to arm/head lock models and knowing how it's animus can throw people off with some out-of-turn movement to retreat or advance and attack. Catching people off guard with some unusual combos is just as, if not more effective than using popular builds.

^ this.

I just started playing in July. All my games have been MkI vs a group of guys who have been playing since the game started.
None of them plan on making the switch until the book drops. Maybe longer since one guy plays all the Hordes factions.

I have Cryx and I am taking Revenant Pirates and Satyxis. It has taken my opponents a little to get used to them because no one uses them.
The intarwebs says those units suck. But thanks to the lack of familiarity, I am getting decent results from them.
Rengrave's reign of terror is still situational thanks to the pervading Fearlessness of the game.

YMMV. But if your group has more Hordes players than WM, you could maybe get people to hold off on the switch until Hordes MkII gets released, not just Playtest.

Okay after talking it over with the guys were are all going into Warmachine. With that I think I'm gonna do Khandor. Which Warcaster would be good for them, if I want to go Jack Heavy? And What if any Warjacks ar no gos.

EDIT: Also that friend who was planing to play Legion is now going Cryx with Lich Lord Termius. Is that goos and what other things work well with Terminus?

Khador Warcasters that work well with Warjacks in MkII? All of 'em PVlad and Karchev would be you berst bets. The battleforce is a good buy, you get Sorcha a Juggernaut and a Destroyer.

Terminus used to play well with Revenant crew, I think Mechanithralls and a Necrosurgeon have probably replaced them in MkII. Seethers play well with everyone.

NICE! Those were the two I was interested in. Their models just looked sweet.

Thatnks for the Khandor and Cryx advice. Doyou have any more?

My tenative plan is to first get the battlebox, then lad, but I don't know what unit I should get after that. Any ideas?

I'm not up on MkII Khador infantry but if you're going jack heavy then you'll probably get some use out of some Khador mechanics. Winterguard with attachments are much loved in MkII but the sculpts are poor. Ironfang pikemen were popular in MKI.

I thought about mechanics, and then either Pikemen or one of the Man-O-War groups.

If I'm going Jack Heavy about how many units should I have? The Jacks are expensive and will take up a lot of a 500 or so point army.

You should download the MkII beta rules and play those. No point in playing MkI for five months.

Where can one download those at?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/247228.page

Should be fine to play Mk I for five months. In fact, if you play every week, you should
be able to get 15-20 games in before the end of the year! By then you'll be comfortable
with movement, boosting, etc.

Mark II will force you to rethink your army, but it won't take away the lessons learned
from learning the stats/dice mechanic.

Right now my plan is Battlebox, Vlad, Mechanics (Chief and assistant + the other 2 assistants), then either Winter Guard (2 boxes of units and Standard+officier), or then some Pikemen (a box or two + standard and officer). After that another warjack, possibly Behemoth.

Thanks for the link.

arinnoor wrote:Right now my plan is Battlebox, Vlad, Mechanics (Chief and assistant + the other 2 assistants), then either Winter Guard (2 boxes of units and Standard+officier), or then some Pikemen (a box or two + standard and officer). After that another warjack, possibly Behemoth.

Thanks for the link.

manhunter X2

Widow makers

Koldun Lord is a great combo marshaling a Destroyer

Heres a list wrote up. Is it any good? Or even legal for that matter.

Vladamir-76

Destroyer-126

Juggernaught-105

Behemoth-172

Drago-105

Battle Mechanic, +2 Troops-23

Battle Mechanic, +2 Troops-23

Iron Fang Officer and Standard Bearer-35

Iron Fang Pikemen, +2 Troops-77

Total=742

It's legal.
But that is a lot of jacks to run with Khador.
I haven't seen Mechanics used, but if they can jack marshall, that'll help. yep, they can.
That list may work even better in MkII since jacks are harder to disable.
Have you considered taking just one Mech, and then a Manhunter?
You can take 1 Manhunter per caster. Not 2 like I saw suggested.
Giives you a solo to deal with other solos, or at least a little flexibility.

oh and check out http://www.tabletopcommander.com/

Great army builder for WM/H. even has price lists. tho that can be depressing.


A friend has been advocating Vlad, Drago, and 2 Berserkers at 350.
That little list could get me to play another army.