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Hello everyone this isn't an army list but more about questions about dwarfs.

So a friend and i are thinking of playing fanasty and we found a starter army kit of orcs and dwarfs which is nice becuase those are both armies we would like to play. I would play dwarves.

My questions are can are either of the armies "top tier or power armies"?

Are dwarfs decent?

Are these good armies to use to learn how to play fanasty?

Any tips and advice for playing dwarfs?

acreedon wrote:My questions are can are either of the armies "top tier or power armies"?

By greater consensus, no.
O&G are generally considered disadvantaged due to their Animosity rules which tend to disrupt your battle lines and plans.
Dwarfs are better off, being as they are unhampered by anything like Animosity, but suffer a lot from having movement 3, which tends to leave combats to be dictated by your opponent.

Are dwarfs decent?

I personally don't think they're that bad. T4 all around helps a lot, not to mention that they tend to have good armor and can grind down enemy infantry very well. They also can't be march-blocked which is great, though made somewhat useless by the M3 stat. They have some of the toughest to kill non-special characters in the game.

All that being said, the army book lends itself to Gunline builds, which can be boring to play with/against and in general can be pretty readily out-flanked/out-maneuvered.

Are these good armies to use to learn how to play fanasty?

Personally, I feel that Dwarfs are slightly less ideal to learn fantasy with merely because their lack of movement and ability to constantly march really dilutes an important part of the game. Overall, though, neither are bad to learn with, per se. I think Empire is probably the ideal army to learn the game with, though.

Any tips and advice for playing dwarfs?

Avoid Thorek and gun-lines if you can - it makes for very boring games.

I dont wont a gunline army, i play tau in 40k and its not my style. I like speed and assualting, any army suggestions?

Speed and assaulting = opposite of Dwarfs .

High Elves, Dark Elves and Warriors of Chaos can be good for that. As can Empire and Brettonia, I suppose. Tomb Kings are probably the fastest, but I'd really recommend against starting WHFB with them as they're a very finesse army.

Of these, I'd say Dark Elves have the best book, though HE and WoC aren't that much worse. High Elves are a bit more forgiving because they have the army-wide rule that gives all High Elves the Always Strike First rule which is immensely useful if you misjudge a charge with infantry.

sounds like dark elves will be the way i go, as long as they have cool models that is.

For Speed and Assaulting, you should look to the Elves.

Wood Elves, particularly, as the hit REALLY hard when you know how to plan it.

hmmm i will go with whatever has cooler looking models/isn't impossible to paint

Wow, super. Player talked out of Dwarves in under five posts... Good luck with Elves.

RZ

If you want a fast assaulting army that looks good and isnt impossible to hate then O&G arent bad, its true that animosity sets them back a bit, but waves of wolf riders and boar boyz backed up by chariots and characters on wolves/boars/chariots/wyvern are great fun.
they look good, they are hard hitting, and fun to play.


If you want a more serious hard hitting fast army then have a look at brets

Red_Zeke wrote:Wow, super. Player talked out of Dwarves in under five posts... Good luck with Elves.

Well when he's looking for a fast assault-oriented army, it's not particularly difficult. If he had said an army that can take a beating, stand its ground, and dish the pain right back, that'd be different.

I feel your pain Zeke.

No one loves Orcs, Goblins, or Dwarfs anymore...

:(

Who's hating on either of those guys?

It was merely a general question. I was not committed to dwarfs but i do not like playing gunline. I like to move things and feel important....

Hey, you can have a fast-moving, hard hitting Dwarf army...You just need a guy named Thorek and a certain Anvil...

*lays finger alongside of nose*

acreedon wrote:I dont wont a gunline army, i play tau in 40k and its not my style. I like speed and assualting, any army suggestions?

The elves or any real cavalry based army can fit this goal. Wood elves are generally effective with a lot of shooting, they are very fast, but i've never run into a situation where I've felt overwhelmed by a wood elf player in combat. The Dryad army doesn't work well any more because magic bases attacks ignore their ward save.

High elves have some heavy hitters. Dragon princes, tironic chariots, and lion chariots all have the bonus and weakness. Dragon princes have fast, lots of attacks, and a good points investiment. They have an excellent armor save. They are low toughness, and just a single wound. Tironic chariots are very fast, can be heavy hitting, but cannot break ranks, die to anything str 7 or higher. Lion chariots are fun, lots of attacks, stronger then tironic, but your really investing points. Of note high elves can have a lot of shooting and magic, but your paying points to get it going. Your army will tend to be small if your looking for fast.

Dark elves, are similar to high elves. Their fast cav is arguably better with their weapon options, and hatred abilities. Their heavy cav and chariots are slower, but have their own bonuses which are clear in their army book. You'll have more models in dark elves, but still a smaller army in general. You will have more core options here as well.

Orcs do have a very fast mentality when you factor in their waagh ability and the waagh spell. These can take a infantry based army and if done correctly have it across a board in under 2 turns, fighting on turn 2-3 with lots of attacks, cheap and effective infantry and what may consider is one of the best magic lores in the game. The clear down side, animosity can grind your army to a hault. There will be games you win based on rolling 6's for animosity checks, and lose because on turn 6 you need to charge and you roll a 1. This is the life of orcs. They are fun, a great point investiment, and no player i know ever goes "awesome i get to play against orcs" in a GT because they are challenging for the opponents in many fronts.

Tomb Kings cav or chariot army might be something to think about. Your army is fast because of your magic phase. Lots of bound spells that can move the army keeps it mobile, gets to the flanks, and disrupts your opponents game. The army causes fear which is great, but your paying for what you get. They are the only army that you can actually have as ALL chariots. I've played against it, its challenge, still fun because their chariots have a horrible armor save, but the idea of resurrecting chariots to me is hysterical. Knock them down, and they come back.

Well i wouldn't play orcs because that is what my friend is going to play. Thank you for the overview. I will check out the models and pick one eventually. Do any of them have an outdated codex or are due for an update?

Tomb Kings are the only ones who haven't had an update yet of that group. However, it's surprisingly still a credible list.

The local hubub is skaven are going to be redone next for fantasy according to the regianol manager for westren canada, (he hates us, his name is Ward and we call him the patron saint of warhammer, for he gives ward saves lo.) Skaven however are a horde army with a lot of very unpredictable warmachines, as was explained to me, I have never been on either side of a rat clan so I know not.

Skaven are up next, come november new list will hopefully be on time. Skaven are a horde army with excellent shooting options and excellent magic. They have above average movement, and some rules that help leadership. They have horrendous armor saves, and overall are a low toughness army.

To be successful with skaven, you need to be able to rank and flank, play with guile, and know when to flee to set up a trap flank charge. Their basic magic spell is destructive to the enemy and them as well. They are not an easy army to play and win with, and that's why you have a lot of people play them. Their warmachines can be incredibly successful against an opponent one phase, then misfire and torch their own unit the next.

i can't paint another horde army.... i just can't do it..

I just started WHFB with a dwarf army. If deployed and played right they are tough but not overpowering. I have played a couple of games and deployment really can make or break you. Even if you don't go gun line you will still be castleing in and looking for side charges. Runes when used right are great, but it requires you to know more about your enemies. Dwarf troops are tough to kill but are not very killy. Guns placed well with rune of forging can cut holes in other armies, organ guns are nice and can thin out units.
I'm sure there are easier armies to learn game with, but dwarfs are solid, not the best ,but far from the worst.