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So I recently played a match vs 3k Eldar (me) vs 2x 1.5k CSM/SM (them) in which I won with one objective to none. Being Eldar I was using the terrain, coherency, and fast moving to keep cover saves up on most of the army. Since we did 3k and them having a split force we chose to take 4HQ 4Elite 6 Trp 3 Fast 4 Heavy, and with that I took 2 farseers, Eldrad, and an Autarch. To make a long story short I was able to constantly keep a lot of cover saves up and fortune on an average of 3 units.

After the match was over there was animosity on their side about me claiming so many cover saves due to 1/2 behind terrain, shooting through coherancy (not checkboarding), etc which I didn't quite understand. I've yet to play in a tournie, but do people get really angry about using the terrain and cover rules fully to your advantage?

They were probably just mad they lost. IMO you just had some good generalship.

There does seem to be a certain type of player who thinks that the 'fair' way to play the game is to just march your troops up the center of the board and hope for the best.

Using cover to your advantage is a very large part of the current rules.

Playing against a whole lot of 3+ armor they didn't care to get in cover since their armor is better, but eldar are suquishie IMO anything not mech really has to use cover. The big thing that annoying one of them was a 3 D-Cannon artilary unit with a warlock for conceal and a farseer for guide/fortune. 2 land raiders, a vindicator, a whole squad of berserkers, a rhino all fell victim to it while I got lucky with my 5+ cover and fortune.

Don't worry, their annoyance was probably more with you as a person, than the cover saves themselves. They were likely just taking out their anger on the game.

But seriously, we can't all have 3+ armour saves. 'Nids, Eldar, and even Orks hugging cover being seen as bad sportsmanship is ridiculous.

Ah yes, the "British" way of warfare. The only people who get annoyed that you do not play "fair" are the people with not a shred of tactical ability.

Eh, I do have a problem with cover sometimes but not in the manner in which it has been described here. Mostly my issues with it are in board set-up where a lot of the people I play against want to literally cover 3/4 of the board in cover in the forms of area terrain (forests), ruins, little walls all over the place, fences, etc... so that a straight shooting army with some quality AP gets nerfed out the rear end while they happily have Obliterators in cover, Lichtors coming in, etc...

Good generalship, making your own cover via smart movement, etc.. is just that--good generalship.

Was it using cover that annoyed them, or the way you used it? I mean, were you and they disagreeing on whether something was in or out of cover, for example, because only halfway up to the knees was behind a wall? Or was it more that they did not like you hiding in woods and behind walls at all?

I wouldn't be mad about you hugging cover, but I would be annoyed playing against eldrad and two farseers in the same game. Nothing against you, I just hate eldar.

Fifty wrote:Was it using cover that annoyed them, or the way you used it? I mean, were you and they disagreeing on whether something was in or out of cover, for example, because only halfway up to the knees was behind a wall? Or was it more that they did not like you hiding in woods and behind walls at all?

This is what I want to know. If you were just using cover to your advantage then more power to you, if you were constantly lagging the game by insisting every model in your army got a cover save during every round of shooting (when it may have been debatable) then I think that's a little bit off.

With friendly games I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. If it's unclear whether it's truly half a unit or vehicle is obscured then I usually give it to them. At the same time, if my Guardsmen are attempting to claim cover and it's in debate, I will generally let their cover save be +1, or let my opponent roll off for it.

The people I don't like are the ones who will never budge an inch and always claim a cover save (regardless of how sketchy it is) while refusing to allow it to be a worse cover save or roll to determine if it is or isn't. These people try and bully their way through the game and it makes it no fun for anyone. Cover is easy to get, but it's got to be within reason.

Now I'm not saying that this is what you did, but that would be a hypothetical situation where I would understand their frustrations.

DoW

Naw they were all legit I had one or two were I asked to do a LoS look to see if they were iffy, but then conceeded. Most were 3 guys visable with 7 behind a big ass rock, or 2 visable the rest were behind another unit ( open hole in the cannon foder guardians). Seer council on foot and fortune was an annoying point too.

Basically the big stuff on the table was.. (not listing the whole 6k battlefield)

Eldar:
Seer council with Eldrad
Wraithlord ML/BL
3 Dcannon
2 serpents and DA
2 6 man jetbikers
3x 5 hawks with Skyleap
2 Prisms

CSM/SM
LR w/ Termies
LR w/ Zerkers & chaplan
2 Demon prince
2 vindicators
3 Dreads in Drop pods
MoTF w/ beamer
Big CSM walker (forget the name offhand)

So it's not like it was a one sided match at all

Using cover is one thing....
Abusing cover, another.

(Oddly lyrical, no?)

No, they were pissed because they didn't have the foresight to stop you from using 2 farseers AND Eldrad. They should win you most games.