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Quick question. I've looked in all of the FAQs and didn't find my answer. In the Eldar codex it states "Ranger Long Rifle: The Ranger long rifle is a sniper rifle equipped with highly sophisticated sights. Any shooting roll to hit of a 6 counts as having AP 1. In a Pathfinder unit, any shooting roll to hit of 5+ counts as having AP 1. Range: 36" S: X AP: 6 Heavy 1, Sniper, Pinning" and in the rule book we all know what it says about guns with the "sniper" ability, they get rending. Now does the eldar long rifle get both? Do I get AP1 if I roll 6 to hit AND wound.. and in the case of pathfinders, do they get AP 1 on a 5+ to hit and 6 to wound? Because that would be nasty.. Thanks in advance.

On a 5 or 6 to hit, that shot counts as AP1

On a 6 "to wound" you get AP2

The two don't cross over or cancel eachother out: the only argument would be whetehr you get AP1 and AP2 if you roll a 5/6 followed by a 6

nosferatu1001 has it exactly right. The only time the "AP 1 or AP 2" issue would come up is against vehicles anyway, at which point you have to ask why the hell are sniper rifles shooting at vehicles

You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

What I mean is the issue is does the weapon count as AP 2 or AP 1, as weapons only have one AP value.

It would be AP 1, because only a TH roll would be taken

adielubbe wrote:It would be AP 1, because only a TH roll would be taken

... Derp Derp. I really need to get some bloody sleep lol.

But yes, you are right there Though you could still get rending on a roll of 6 to Penetrate.

ninja'd by Gwar!

Drunkspleen wrote:

Gwar! wrote:

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

What I mean is the issue is does the weapon count as AP 2 or AP 1, as weapons only have one AP value.

and what Webbe means is, how do you roll a 6 on the to-wound roll against a vehicle for rending to kick in and make it AP2?

Yes yes I know lol.

However, the Sniper Rifle has Rending (because of the Weapon Type, not a Special Rule), so on a Roll of 6 To Penetrate it would become rending, which counts as AP2, but only against Squishy things IIRC.

of course, a rending roll of 6 to penetrate a vehicle gives you an extra D3 of penetration, rather than any AP value.

adielubbe wrote:It would be AP 1, because only a TH roll would be taken

I am confused by this statement. Are you saying that with the long rifle, should an AP1 shot be rolled to hit, you dont have to roll to wound? Thats the way your post sounds and so I'm confused, just wanted a little clarification. Its early, I may not be reading it right, lol

Edit: I guess you could be talking about vehicles and that is where I'm getting the confusion.

s2ua7 wrote:

adielubbe wrote:It would be AP 1, because only a TH roll would be taken

I am confused by this statement. Are you saying that with the long rifle, should an AP1 shot be rolled to hit, you dont have to roll to wound? Thats the way your post sounds and so I'm confused, just wanted a little clarification. Its early, I may not be reading it right, lol

No, This is my fault What he means is, against a vehicle, it will count as AP 1 only, because you do not roll to wound against vehicles

Gwar! wrote: at which point you have to ask why the hell are sniper rifles shooting at vehicles

I was losing badly anyway. Besides, the look on my opponent's face when I rolled 3 6's in a row to pop his Rhino was worth it.

(especially after 2 of his 5 marines died to explosion wounding)

Drunkspleen wrote:of course, a rending roll of 6 to penetrate a vehicle gives you an extra D3 of penetration, rather than any AP value.

Correct. The AP2 doesn't matter (against vehichles) as you'll get ap1 with hitting; however the rending adds up to 3 more strength against vehichles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

Right but on a 6 to glance/pen to get +d3 strength added because of rending.

Lynch wrote:

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

Right but on a 6 to glance/pen to get +d3 strength added because of rending.

It doesn't matter. It's impossible to get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound.

Webbe wrote:

Lynch wrote:

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

Right but on a 6 to glance/pen to get +d3 strength added because of rending.

It doesn't matter. It's impossible to get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound.

Rending against vehicles has nothing to do with rolling to wound or ap2. You roll a six for penetrating, then the shot becomes rending, then you add +d3 strength to the strength 3 gun and the roll of 6 (which is why you would shoot at a vehicle with a sniper weapon. You can penetrate av10 and 11.) It doesn't consist of rolling to wound and AP2 doesn't factor in at all.

Lynch wrote:

Webbe wrote:

Lynch wrote:

Webbe wrote:You never get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound against them.

Right but on a 6 to glance/pen to get +d3 strength added because of rending.

It doesn't matter. It's impossible to get AP2 against vehicles as you don't roll to wound.

Rending against vehicles has nothing to do with rolling to wound or ap2. You roll a six for penetrating, then the shot becomes rending, then you add +d3 strength to the strength 3 gun and the roll of 6 (which is why you would shoot at a vehicle with a sniper weapon. You can penetrate av10 and 11.) It doesn't consist of rolling to wound and AP2 doesn't factor in at all.

Sorry, I think I misunderstood you. The D3 was never the issue here so that's why I didn't think it was worth mentioning at all.

But, if any of the dice that roll 5 or 6 to hit a vehicle then rend, then a chance to get an AP1 glance or pen is actually pretty OK against rhinos/trukks/etc if there aren't any MC/infantry targets on the board.

Yep, so technically a ranger/pathfinder can wreck AV12 with the bonus from AP1.

Lynch wrote:Yep, so technically a ranger/pathfinder can wreck AV12 with the bonus from AP1.

Yeah, I love it when you get insanely lucky and wreck a dreadnought with them... it's priceless.