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Eldrad
10 Warlocks (1x Embolden, 1x Enhance)
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

5 Dire Avengers
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

5 Dire Avengers
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

10 Storm Guardians (2x Flamers)
1 Warlock with Destructor
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

5 Fire Dragons
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

Vyper with Missile Launcher

Fire Prism
Holofield, Spirit Stones

Fire Prism
Holofield, Spirit Stones


That should be right on 1750, and the vyper was just there to fill points. This is the list I've been running and I find that my Seer Council dies too easily, the fire dragons are one hit wonders, and I have no bite anywhere really. I thought twin-shuriken cannons on the serpents would allow me to get more of them, but now I'm thinkin' that I really want a few more AT weapons laying around. Thoughts?

A few options that I see for a quick fix, without buying lots and lots of new models - mix and match to your content.

1 - Cut the Seer Council in half, ditch Eldrad to save points, put them on jetbikes, add another unit of mounted guardians or avengers.

2 - Cut the Seer Council in half, ditch the wave serpent and give it a Falcon (instant AT addition as well).

3 - Add some AT weaponry to your Serpents (EML, BL)

lords2001 wrote:A few options that I see for a quick fix, without buying lots and lots of new models - mix and match to your content.

1 - Cut the Seer Council in half, ditch Eldrad to save points, put them on jetbikes, add another unit of mounted guardians or avengers.

2 - Cut the Seer Council in half, ditch the wave serpent and give it a Falcon (instant AT addition as well).

3 - Add some AT weaponry to your Serpents (EML, BL)

I don't advise putting them on Jetbikes if you cut their size in half. In fact I wouldn't cut them in half at all.

When you put them on jetbikes you undermind the entire reason you are bringing a mech force in the first place: making your opponents anti-infantry firepower useless points spent.

If they go on jetbikes then they are the focus for EVERY weapon that wouldn't have otherwise been able to fire to any affect.

whitedragon wrote:Eldrad
10 Warlocks (1x Embolden, 1x Enhance)
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

I would double up on embolden's and enhances to make sure your squad has a better chance of remaining functional after a freak failed save. Then beyond that I would add 4 destructors, leaving 2 guys without anything to absorb the first wounds. This gives you a serious anti horde squad (4 Heavy Flamers, generally hitting on 3's and wounding on 2's with rerolls should Doom go off. Keep Serpent as is.

5 Dire Avengers
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

Love this set up and would only change one thing: Brightlances on your Serpent to give you the AT you are lacking.

5 Dire Avengers
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

Follow same pattern as above.

10 Storm Guardians (2x Flamers)
1 Warlock with Destructor
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

I personally don't like Storm Guardians in Serpents as they end up costing more than Dire Avengers. I would personally drop them for a 3rd Dire Avenger squad equipped the same as those above.

5 Fire Dragons
Mounted in a Wave Serpent with Twin Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones

Simple and effective. If you follow my advice you can end up fitting an Exarch with Dragon's Breath Flamer and Crackshot for the squad, as well as increase the total squad size to 8, making them much more deadly as 1's to wound don't matter because you have a reroll. The Heavy Flamer here gives your squad some serious flexibility. Even versus Marines I would take the Heavy Flamer, with rerolls to wound, over a melta weapon any day. The fact that they WILL fail saves makes it more effective in a shock troop role. It also gives you good ability to wipe out small horde squads or remnants of those that made it through. Keep the Serpent the same.

Vyper with Missile Launcher

These are useful but if you follow my changes you can drop it and use the "spare" points you bought it with beefing up your list where it counts.

Fire Prism
Holofield, Spirit Stones

If it is not shooting it is not doing its job. Drop the Spirit Stones.

Fire Prism
Holofield, Spirit Stones

Same as above.


That should be right on 1750, and the vyper was just there to fill points. This is the list I've been running and I find that my Seer Council dies too easily, the fire dragons are one hit wonders, and I have no bite anywhere really. I thought twin-shuriken cannons on the serpents would allow me to get more of them, but now I'm thinkin' that I really want a few more AT weapons laying around. Thoughts?

If my tweaks were used the list would look like:

-Eldrad
-Warlocks
-2 Enhance, 2 Embolden, 4 Destructor
-Wave Serpent
-Shuri Cannon, Spirit Stones
[650]

-Fire Dragons (8)
-Exarch, Dragon's Breath Flamer, Crack Shot
-Wave Serpent
-Shuri Cannon, Spirit Stones
[255]

-Dire Avengers (5)
-Wave Serpent
-Bright Lances, Spirit Stones
[205]

-Dire Avengers (5)
-Wave Serpent
-Bright Lances, Spirit Stones
[205]

-Dire Avengers (5)
-Wave Serpent
-Bright Lances, Spirit Stones
[205]

-Fire Prism
[115]

-Fire Prism
[115]

1750/1750

7 Skimmers
3 Scoring Troops
Balanced AT and AI

I'm nervous about running the Prisms without holofields or stones. They can still tank shock when stunned, or move fast enough to gain a coversave, and the holofield pretty much guarantees a stun result.

Also, I think that 8 Fire Dragons may be a bit overkill, and would work better as 2x units of 5 if you were going to go that approach. If you want to bake something, the storm guardians 3x flamers with Doom makes for some really nice char broil.

I like dropping the vyper, I figured that was going to happen anyway.

Giving Prism's holofields makes them WAY too expensive for their purpose.

I don't give them stones or Holofields because I keep them cheap. In 1850 I squeeze out some Fire Dragons and run a 3rd Prism. If you give them fields and stones you make them way too expensive to do this. One more prism, imho, is better than stones and fields on the other 2. It is the same mentality as old school Armoured Company (upgrades to a minimum to get more hulls on the field).

The only reason the Dragons are up to 8 was spare points, and honestly I don't know if you could go over the top with them. Splitting them into two units would lose you exarchs and flamers and NOTHING kills SM bikes better than Dragons with Crack Shot. Well a couple things do but damn dragons eat apart SM Bikes like candy. Also, splitting them into two units would require you buy another transport, which you don't have the points for. Storm Guardians with their two Str 4 flamers and one Destructor wielding Warlock would be HARD PRESSED to dish anywhere the same amount of damage to the units the Fire Dragons could.