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Excellent, Brothers in Arms. My stunties are the military arm of my RT era Rogue Traders force (Even his flagship is captained by a squat pirate). I am currently getting my head around 5th and have chosen to go for a counts as IG force as this seemed the simplest route. If you use them primarily as Veterans it gets around the being better than the average guardsman problem and means you can have more special weapons (sigh) and slightly techy-er feel. My Exo chaps will be ogryns, Hover boarders as Rough Riders, Mole mortars as squad mortar teams etc. Luckily my RT force is substantial and so I can lift the bits out I want for 5th. Unfortunately all my chaps are bolter armed for RT but I'm figuring this won't be a problem.

I put a few picks up yesterday of WIP (have been playing rogue trader with them unpainted until I finish all the converting) and these should give you a feel of what I'm going for.





I'm going for more of a hard sci-fi look but you can never get away from the comic 80's GW space opera look entirely (although this seems to irritate some!)

meant to ask....are you converting your own, using (and probably having to convert) the older plastics or selling your first born for metals? Maybe you're someone crazy enough to still have them from the eighties like me. (I believe this is why my chaps survived Hive Fleet Buffet as they couldn't be found in the back of my cupboard ).

Oh and squat sentinels are easy and cool looking.

Have to side with Mick. If you have a couple of opponents (or one with a range of forces) who already play or you could convert to RT then I'd do that. My force was designed and has been re-assembled for RT (I owned some in the late eighties but mainly played WHFB, Bloodbowl and Epic) I started playing RT a couple of years ago and as long as you are willing to put in some effort you can get great rewards. The only reason I'm working out my 'counts as' force is so I can enter the doubles tourney (and show the world that not all the squats dissapeared) and play against one of my friends who has forsaken the old ways and turned to 5th (and of course meet new opponents who weren't around in the good old days....sigh). RT is different but much more to my taste and will always be my game of choice. The ability to create and adapt units and truly develop your forces really appeals to me and my playing style.

jinshiryuu wrote:
Playing RT would be great, since I have access to the Squat army list in the Compendium, and as you pointed out, you can mod your units to be what you want. But as I'm just getting back into things, I'm looking for something "legal" to use for pickup games until I have a core gaming group again. I did give some thought to the Ork codex, as well as the SM codex (and variant).

That's understandable, I'm aiming towards a 'counts as' because I mainly only play against one opponent at the moment (someone I've been playing against for my entire wargaming hobby) and I wanted to increase the number of new friends/opponents and enter some tourneys. I wanted to use my chaps as something more pokey than IG but decided it was easier not to; due to the amount of irrational squat hate out there (If they are slightly underpowered I figured more people would accept them). Also the original models didn't have PA but Flak instead so it would have taken extreme converting (on my 80-odd infantry) and they are already keeping me awake at nights!

jinshiryuu wrote:if I recall correctly, when they started developing the Squats for Epic, it seemed like their vehicles fell into "fast attack" and superheavy, without much in between.

Yep this is a problem. I'm currently making an epic force and the original (2nd ed) did have this problem. Luckily I discovered NetEpic and this has balanced them out slightly. I have a converted predator, Landraider (so WIP its still in its box) and Landspeeders in my RT force and couldn't work out how to shoe horn them into 5th. I've also got Trikes and Thudd Guns that are unusable as IG. I may have to consider the SM's as an alternative and swap them around from time to time.

Its going to be interesting to see what you come up with as I've been trying to get my head around it for some time.


This was my first model attempt after a hiatus of 10-12 years (with some occasional gaming but no real army building) and inspired me to wave the Squat Flag. Now my Avatar.



My new Veterans Lanspeeders (although I'd like to make enough to mechanise my whole force.) because if you're a Squat walking everywhere sucks.

sorry not trying to highjack (this is the first time I've showed anyone outside my constant opponent or my wife anything I've done). Can't wait to see you WIPs for converted squats. Might help motivate me more.

Oh and tyranids? Mellon.....Thats brilliant......if slightly sacrilegious (are we fighting from inside their stomachs?) That may be interesting, will have to see what the new dex in the new year brings.

Cheers for that.

Is the subscription mini the white dwarf in space suit I saw on another thread?

mmmm tempting.........

SW may be the way forward. Does mean you can have proper Devastator squads again.....Ah Squat tactical squads where any or all of them could take a heavy bolter. How you are going to mount a squat on a giant wolf though........

What ideas do you have for converting them? I've seen various ideas from fantasy dwarves to stuntifying cadians.

Lennysmash wrote:
Was not in the hobby long enough to remember the Squat profiles properly but what about using Thunderfire profiles for Thudds and Mole mortars combined, ie one gun two roles.

I seem to remember a sly nod to the much missed squat artillery in the WD designers notes when this came out.

jinshiryuu wrote:
A lot of the Space Wolf decorations can be used as well, since GW started using the "saxon" imagery for Squats back when the pups were still what would be called a "codex" chapter now.

Seem to remember something about the SW being one of the few SM chapters that had any respect for the abhumans (only squats though) because of their drink/fight/eat style. This may have been waffle by other forum goers or something random I remember from an ancient WD. Like the idea though. Barbarians in space fits well, as long as people realise this doesn't mean "backward" but rather fierce, professional/competent and brave. When the Norse (Viking being a Verb i.e to go Viking meant raiding and expedition-ing and was simply picked up and used in later history texts as a noun) were prominent they were a force to be reckoned with (my surname is proof as it still exists in england and it's etymological root means "spear carrying chosen bodyguard of the lord" from the anglo-saxon/norse languages). Just because you're violent and angry doesn't mean you're stupid. My force are professional mercenary raiders, we wouldn't last in a protracted fight (I've discovered this trying to take hills through footslogging against the namby pamby eldar) so the hit hard, fast and decisively is something I see as a key Squat strategy.

I'm all excited now...going to have to read the SM codex and see what I think. Oh and I've been toying with the idea of using a sentinel cab as the front of a gyrocopter for RT. Easy to add to, squats fit and has the sort of look I'm going for. The fantasy dwarf range has some faceguards that are suitably archaic looking if thats any use.


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Oh and have a look at unite all actions squats at

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g141/uniteallaction/40k/My%2040k%20Squats/

just found them, they're a different take on the theme to mine but interesting (more inline with what GW were starting with 2nd - slayers etc)

Stunty marines are brilliant but the simple level of converting I'm doing now is almost making me cry. Just the sheer numbers.....hehehehehe

jinshiryuu do you have a points limit target for this project or is it going to just keep expanding as you go along?

jinshiryuu wrote:I'm coming back into all of this after a long hiatus, and things have gotten a lot more competitive than when I left. Although I'm starting to see that a lot of that may be a vocal minority and most players are still pretty laid back.

Yep this worries me too being an oldy (wow thats strange to admit, I still get ID'd when buying drinks) but I think there is a strong difference between what/who you see in the average GW and alot of players.

Mellon wrote: I wouldn't worry too much about if your models are 27mm high instead of 33mm... Just keep things reasonable and you should be fine.

Thinking about this the average guant probably doesn't stand much higher than a squat, and I'm no fan of built up models unless they're for display. I amused myself for hours when true LOS came out thinking of all the poor people who had to rip apart their favourite mini's and re-base them. My regular opponent told me I wasn't allowed to make a squad of veterans wriggling forwards on their stomachs

You've inspired me and hopefully I'll have enough time this weekend to finish the Landspeeder crew and consider painting them. One question...where do you guys stand on the squat colour scheme? I like the original earth/natural colours idea (and secretly love bright coloured helmets) but want them to be slightly more gritty. I'm considering washed/highlighted Gnarloc green with red helmets and maybe grey flak. Will be based on grey as my epic/confrontation (fore-runner to necromunda) models all are and its shows up mini's beautifully.

Ahh excellent, I've seen these before in passing...wondered about the armour placements....like the idea for modern versions of pavises.

One thing...no matter how much some people bitch about the squats; a well made army, decently painted simply screams 40K to me and seems to be well respected by most decent gamers (Mannahnin etc). Read a brilliant post recently about how old farts (that's us jinshiryuu / mellon - although as i'm guessing you are a lady thus your age is no matter for polite conversation but rather for a duelling field ) always complain that GW stopped supporting a "useless and obsolete" race (squats) yet still waste their money on their products. The chap who wrote this collected Dark Eldar. Didn't have the heart to slate him/point out that without our early involvement and expenditure he wouldn't even have a hobby. Thought I'd leave it ten years and see how he felt then

All this positivity is great as I've had mixed reactions from GW staff in the past concerning my force. Some really love it and some just plain blanked me/attempted to be sarcastic from that point on.

I'm going to have to organise a few practice games with the couple of friends that play 5th and see which force I like the most. (although the IG were my first force in the eighties/nineties and I think I'm smitten).

Mellon's right about steam punk (especially if you use some select WHFB bits like faceplates etc) but i also like high-tech or at least advanced tech. Harder to do though as the ground between SM's and Tau doesn't leave alot to work with. If you're doing resin/casting then this would make it easier and you could achieve some nice plate/carapace armour for them. My epic chaps are green and red and this works nicely at that scale, may have to be brave and paint up a 40K one just to try it out. Don't want to go mad with colour but have seen some nice versions using bits of the traditional style, see below for my favourite by the amazing fleshtuxedo

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2134/2180412547_044a9bdfff.jpg%3Fv%3D0&imgrefurl=http://flickr.com/photos/66936279%40N00/2180412547/&usg=__mUDsC-m2H1RmGtxJgxdEh27UcMA=&h=375&w=500&sz=118&hl=en&start=7&um=1&tbnid=OZyq9UbZf2qryM:&tbnh=98&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3D40K%2Bsquats%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

That's fair enough the "shame" of playing vanilla style eldar outweighs the "shame" of wargaming on the whole (my regular opponent is a namby pamby space elf lover!) if she likes the more archaic look try steering her towards eldar exodites (or just be plain grateful she loves you and your little men). weekend has gotten away from me and no progress. Time to sit down for the evening with a tray and work whilst my wife commands the remote like a over zealous commissar!

Fear not wasn't suggesting that you aren't grateful! (I know my place and am grateful my wife lets me occupy it ) I have recently (1989) taken up a small interest in WHFB and use 10mm (warmaster size-ish) instead of 28mm. Works well especially if you cheat and base them on individual magnets (available in sheets) and use metal movement trays. Lacks some of the beauty of heroic scale but is cheaper, looks grander and more sweeping and takes up less space. plus side to elves in 28mm is she could still use them in RT versus the squats, simply give them power/refractor field and run at the enemy waving swords and screaming! like the British did for hundreds of years (although admittedly we didn't have the fields and most of enemies idea of high tech weaponry was sharpened fruit!).

On the Original thread I like the pre-heresy idea as it gives you a perfect get out clause for any killjoys that say squats don't exist anymore and would fit in with the lost in the warp theme. Need WIP pictures (even if just scribbles)....no pressure

Jon Garrett wrote:Speaking of Chaos Squats, I spotted this a while back. Might be useful to you.

These are lovely and show squats can work in a variety of formats. I have a feeling however that this chap MATT BIRDOFF- THOUSAND SQUATS having won was not mentioned in White Dwarf and after the Tourney they (GW) tried to deny/ignore his army choice/his existence. There was definitely something about it in another thread. Naughty naughty GW

Those chaos chaps are lovely and if you intend to cast your own would be excellent.

I'm thoroughly confused now, I had originally wanted to do SM list but didn't think I could justify it as I'm using the original plastics primarily (have loads of metals but not sure I like them enough!) and they aren't fantastic (flak armour), more IG looking than anything. And I actually bought the IG codex grumblegrumblegrumble. And now the_emperors_renegade turns up like some avenging angel and promises an actual codex. Oh god I'm soooo confused/distracted/unsure.

Arrrrrgggggggghhhhhh!

I like the mocked up mini termies. Especially because you've used the chaos launchers on one (much better than the imperial ones.) And studs are good. sometimes on the inside

That's fantastic, there's nothing wrong with the CSM idea either (bar the codex issues ). IMO Squats aren't supposed to be staunch imperialists; as they were originally abandoned during the warp storms that cut off the home worlds. They have a serious axe to grind with a number of races (eldar, orks - both of which used to be trading partners) and I see them as fiercely independent, mercenary warriors. That's why my chaps are the military wing of a Rogue Traders force, he no longer sees eye-to-eye with the imperium and their attitude towards the expendability of their populace. Also gives you good background fluff to find a reason to shoot at anyone you feel like.

I like the mini-marines but I feel if you could just change the helmets to be less SM then they'd almost instantly feel like a distinct, individual force. I like the idea of using some of the new bare headed SW heads (although not some of the more stupid styles...that's going too far even for mohicaned, smoking mini hells-angels in space!) IMO the look you've gone for really suits the high-tech feel squats would have personified if they'd made any headway past RT and been developed properly as a codexed race. Unfortunately I feel the Tau filled this gap and appealed to the manga generation, hammering the last nail into the squat coffin.

A sad but beautifully succinct summary of the stunted ones. I'm looking forward to the inevitable WIP blog to see these guys as actual minis. If you're anything like me finding the time/money and avoiding the procrastination (work) tends to slow things up somewhat.....The egginators need serious work...have 10 but want to arm them differently and will probably use Terminator arms cut down so I can have thunder hammers and storm shields. More I read the SM codex the more I believe it will work nicely for your squats.

Pig Iron makes nice heads but I'm not sure if any would suit.