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I apologize if this is a very basic question, I am new to the game and still learning. I had a discussion with a friend of mine concerning measuring range against skimmers (which are on elevated bases.) My friend was using a Valkyrie Skimmer which is elevated a fairly decent height. The discussion was whether a range must be drawn to the physical base of the vehicle? Or should it be to an area at ground level beneath the vehicle?

You measure to the hull, in all cases except assault, where you may go into btb with the flying base.

40k is a 3D game, you measure the real distances, not horizontal distances.

Thanks, so much. That was what we figured but there was a tad bit of uncertainty,

Gwar! wrote:You measure to the hull, in all cases except assault, where you may go into btb with the flying base.

40k is a 3D game, you measure the real distances, not horizontal distances.

Ive been had!

that would have put me in half melta range...

sonovabich.

Falconlance wrote:

Gwar! wrote:You measure to the hull, in all cases except assault, where you may go into btb with the flying base.

40k is a 3D game, you measure the real distances, not horizontal distances.

Ive been had!

that would have put me in half melta range...

sonovabich.

Huh? Usually elevation makes it harder to get into melta range, because the hypotenuse is longer than the base of the triangle.

Yeah but the valkyrie is bigger than a baneblade its easily a couple inches wider on each side than its base.

Gwar! wrote:You measure to the hull, in all cases except assault,

...and (if you're using the GW FAQ's) when measuring distances for dis/embarking and contesting objectives with a Valkyrie.

Falconlance wrote:Yeah but the valkyrie is bigger than a baneblade its easily a couple inches wider on each side than its base.

But you measure to the hull, which isn't "a couple inches wider on each side than its base".

Steelmage99 wrote:

Falconlance wrote:Yeah but the valkyrie is bigger than a baneblade its easily a couple inches wider on each side than its base.

But you measure to the hull, which isn't "a couple inches wider on each side than its base".

Arent the missle pods attached to the wings? I cant draw line of sight to and shoot something that can draw line of sight to and shoot me?

That is correct. It is one of the few examples of this unfortunate effect, but it doesn't invalidate the rule as a whole.

Actually, thats one of the issues with the valk/ vendetta that the FAQ didnt really address. Some people claim that the extensions of the hull that mount the weapons and the hover engines are not targetable, while others claim that these wings are indeed targetable. I dont think the debate here on dakka really decided people one way or the other as well, so make sure that you know which way the TO will be ruling at any event.



Sliggoth

Well, technically nowhere on the Valkyrie can be targeted.

Aircraft don't have Hulls

Lol, would love to see it ruled that way at a tournement:

"So I cant shoot that thing thats covering the sky?"

"Thats right son, you have to charge over there and assault its base instead"


Have to bring that one up next time the IG player shows up



Sliggoth

@ GWAR- PBY-5s, CL-215, PanAm Clipper, Spruce Goose, etc, etc all have hulls...

Edit: damn seucrity protocols at work won't allow pics...

If you want to get technical with hulls, only ships have them. Which means invincible vehicles.

thebetter1 wrote:If you want to get technical with hulls, only ships have them. Which means invincible vehicles.

Actually armored vehicles have hulls too. The two main components being the hull and the turret. It's not just a GW thing. Hence the military term "hull down" for an AFV in cover with only the turret exposed.

And now we can start the argument about whether or not the legs and arms of a walker are included with the hull only for the purposes of measurement, or really are stated to be "hull".

Aircraft don't have hulls? Somebody better tell Lloyd's of London... thats part of aircraft insurance.

If we're going by strict dictionary definitions, then yes, only boats have hulls.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hull

However, I think you'll find that colloquially, any metal vehicle could be described as having a hull.

If you scroll down to the 3rd definition of hull on that page you'll see that defintion d says something like "The main body of various other large vehicles, such as a tank, airship, or flying boat."

Basically, Gwar is wrong, and planes have hulls.

lol english.

40kBreadguy wrote:Basically, Gwar is wrong, and planes have hulls.

Actually, Planes have Fuselages. Ships have Hulls. So please, get things right before making a fool of yourself.

From the GW Imperial Guard Errata:

"Access Points. The text should read:
Valkyries and Vendettas have one access point on
each side of the hull and one at the rear."

As the side access points border the hull, this seems to indicate that the wings are not counted as hull. If so, then a meltagun will have to be closer than two inches to the base to be in 6 inch range, given the valkyrie's 5 inch stand and a meltagun unit 1 inch tall.

Even if the wings are considered part of the hull, the specified locations in the FAQ are still valid descriptions.

jcage wrote:From the GW Imperial Guard Errata:

"Access Points. The text should read:
Valkyries and Vendettas have one access point on
each side of the hull and one at the rear."

As the side access points border the hull, this seems to indicate that the wings are not counted as hull. If so, then a meltagun will have to be closer than two inches to the base to be in 6 inch range, given the valkyrie's 5 inch stand and a meltagun unit 1 inch tall.

You don't measure from the firing infantry's eyes or gun, you measure from its base.