Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hive Tyrant
Lashwhip/Bonesword
Scything Talons
Adrenal Glands (I)
Adrenal Glands (WS)
Toxin Sacs
Toxic Miasma
Warp Field
Total:170

Tyrant Guard(x3)
Lashwhip/rending claws
Implant Attack
Total:153

Hive Tyrant
Scything Talons(x2)
Toxin Sacs
Toxic Miasma
Adrenal Glands(WS)
Adrenal Glands(I)
Warp Field
Wings
Total:203

Lictor
Total:80

Carnifex
Twin Linked Devourers(x2)
Enhanced Senses
Total:113

Genestealers(x12)
Scuttlers
Total:228

Genestealers(x12)
Scuttlers
Total:228

Gaunts(x8)
Fleshborers
Without Number
Total:72

Gaunts(x16)
Devourers
Toxin Sacs
Without Number
Total:178

Zoanthropes(x2)
Synapse
Warp Blast
Total:130

Carnifex
Adrenal Glands(WS)
Adrenal Glands(I)
Reinforced Chitin
Bonded Exoskeleton
Extended Carapace
Mace Tail
Toxin Sacs
Scything Talons(x2)
Regenerate
Total:212

Carnifex
Adrenal Glands(WS)
Adrenal Glands(I)
Reinforced Chitin
Bonded Exoskeleton
Extended Carapace
Mace Tail
Toxin Sacs
Scything Talons(x2)
Regenerate
Total:212

Total:1979



We play to the last man, not the normal 6 rounds. That is why I spend so much on the fexes and such. Any ideas? Snide remarks are always encouraged, as well as things to make this army better

I think 3 cheaper fexes might beat 2 upgraded ones. Even if you like 'em heavy, regenerate and tail upgrades are certainly inefficient.

For your guarded tyrant, double linked devourers is probably the best combo available. My mate plays with one of those, and its 12 shots just piss off all his opponents to no end. The guard should not have lashwhips, which are junk IMO, and implant attack is pretty useless too.

Thanks for the ideas and oppinions.

For the Hive Tyrant, I agree with Bounty-Hunter, due to the fact that it doesn't have the Str value a Carnifex does, and if you want to use it to pop tanks, Warp Blast is better.

Hive Tyrant with the TL Devourers is nasty. Although it depends on what you're doing with your Tyrant for the guard. The Lash-whips are only trully effective when you're going Special Character hunting, if thats not the main goal, then yes drop them for something cheaper/more effective.

Whats the reason for the Lictor? I'd say drop the Lictor and add 8 more Fleshborer Guants with WoN, and make that 8 squad a 16 squad. 15 more targets to soak up fire way out weighs the single Lictor, imo.

I don't know why you feel the need to pump up the Gaunts with the Toxin Sacs, I would drop those and use the extra points to add more gaunts, if you want WoN with them that works better than the Toxin Sacs since they're usually used to hold Objectives or as a meat shield. No reason to waste points on a meat shield if you can just have more meat shields.

I also agree, tail weapons on a Fex are usually useless. Take them off and give it the Tusked Biomorph if you're looking for an extra attack or something. If you're playing to the last man than I understand the desire for the Regenerate and if those are the house rules you're playing than keep that. Although the I+ Adrinel Glands aren't needed on Fex's its so low already that not really a point in using the points on that. Also I notice you've given them all CC weapons. That's not bad if you can get them into combat and not see a turn of incoming fire, but seeing as how they're MC's I don't know who well you'd be able to do that unless your board is covered in Area terrian. Not only that trading at least 1 set of Scything Talons with either a Venom Cannon or a Barbed Strangler allows you to still have devastating CC abilities and also be able to reach out and touch some of your opponents forces with some Bio-Chemical Love at range. Makes them a real double threat.

Without my codex in front of me since I'm at work, I can't really suggest where the best points would be spent but I'd suggest more WoN gaunts. I'll look at my codex when I get home and make better (more educated point suggestions).

Cheers

You need to optimize this list a bit. There's a lot of junk you are using that could really be put to better use.

Lose the +I adrenal gland on the tyrants. Give them flesh hooks instead. Lose toxic miasma on the tyrant with guard since it doesn't work while he has bodyguards. Lose the lashwhips on the tyrant guard, they are better with scything talons in most cases. Gaunts with devourers and +S can't get WoN...they are too expensive. Just give them fleshborers and be done with it. Lose regenerate and tail weapons on the big fexes.

Add flesh hooks or feeder tendrils to your genestealers. Add flesh hooks to your carnifexes if you really want to keep them hitting before powerfists. Maybe add another lictor since you don't want your stealers coming in piecemeal. Or remove some other stuff from the fexes and add another one (elite).

Good luck

This is just my opinions of what I'd change. You have a lot of stuff piled on some units which you don't really need.

- Lose the Warp Field on the Hive Tyrant with no Wings. It has a Retinue of Tyrant Guard to take the fire from most things anyway, and most heavy weapons that'd be used are would be AP2 so its save is pointless for the most part. I know it gives a 6+ Inv save, but it's really not worth it if you have Tyrant Guard as well. With the points you saved by removing Warp Field, add Warp Blast. Tyranids are massively lacking in anti-tank, so Warp Blast is very valuable.

- To echo above, add Feeder Tendrils to the Genestealers if possible. Having Preferred Enemy can come in useful.

- See how many points you'd gain if you dropped Without Number on the Gaunts. You may be able to add a couple more Genestealers or something. This is more of a last-ditch thing though; WoN can be useful in some situations.

- Your Devourer/Toxin Sac Gaunts can't have Without Number, as they cost 10 points each (4 base, +2 from Toxin Sacs and +4 for Devourers). Without Number requires a base cost of 8pts or less, as far as I remember.

- For the Heavy Support Carnifexes, consider ditching the +1I Adrenal Gland. Spine Banks count as frag grenades in CC anyway. Also, consider lowering their points cost- you MAY be able to get more units on the field, rather than using abilities like Regenerate which are extremely random. I have a 'Fex with Regenerate too (the head looks awesome), but it really isn't that useful.

- Honestly, with the current Codex, I would consider ditching the Lictor for more Synapse creatures. You can never have too much Synapse

I know looking at my sig says I only have 900pts of 'Nids, but I only just restarted them. I collected them back when Old One Eye/The Red Terror were usable characters too.

At lurking guant- the regen has saved my game once apon a when, and a certain little squad of without number guants and a fex managed to wipe a full dev. squad


the tyrant is a special char. hunter. that's his only purpose, the winged might get it though. invuln is useful when your opponent is shooting it every round with dev. squad. from the rhino. lictor is there to get the stealers in if I muff up my reserves roll. the toxin sacs are gone from the guants ( WON is 9pts.) I was at school doing this by memory. sorry about that mix.

I don't do warp blast tyrants because I own three zoanthropes, and always synaps/blast them. plus the only thing they have been able to do is keep that venerable dreads multi melta from the fex. but I will take everyones comments into consideration before friday. I know I will be playing against orks, and assult space marines for sure.

WoN requires 8 points or less, not 9- I just checked in the Codex now. (WoN itself adds another 3 points if you take it).

I still honestly don't think a 6+ Inv save is worth it from Warp Field. Considering the high points cost to give a Tyrant Warp Field, and the fact that most Heavy Weapons tend to have AP 2 (therefore piercing the Tyrant's armour), I just don't see the benefit. While the 6+ Inv will save you occasionally, it's a very low chance of repaying its points value, especially if you have Tyrant Guard with the Tyrant.

It's fine to have Warp Field on the Winged one, as that is unable to take any Tyrant Guard, so it'd be picked out by enemy fire much easier.

Likewise, unless you've lost a lot of Wounds, I don't see the benefit of Regenerate (as it's only a very low chance of success) on the Carnifexes.

I know abilities like Warp Field and Regenerate look good, but you have to think whether a small chance of saving you is worth the points cost in a regular 40k game. In Apoc, use whatever the hell you want

That's my opinion anyway- it may be worth running a few practice battles with different builds to see what you find effective, given the advice people have suggested.

Oh, and my username's Neith, not Lurking Gaunt (that's just my ranking here )

yea, sorry about that Neith I'm on my cell at school while I am checking this. the big thing I hate is tons of dakka, that's why I play nids and orks. because they are great at it. I will try with extended carapace on the walking tyrant, but that two plus save is ungodly useful. its kind of like 'hahahah where are those ruinous powers at to give you ap 2 weapons?' then I.G. shows up and I get screwed. hopefully they will correcct the inv. options in the new codex, considering EVERYONE has a good inv. option but us. but I might try for a mega dakka army and shoot a lot. I think I am gonna free up 288 (iir) pts. and get devourer ravener. 36 shots a round, and 5 attacks each in melee

Victimized Tyrant wrote:yea, sorry about that Neith I'm on my cell at school while I am checking this. the big thing I hate is tons of dakka, that's why I play nids and orks. because they are great at it. I will try with extended carapace on the walking tyrant, but that two plus save is ungodly useful. its kind of like 'hahahah where are those ruinous powers at to give you ap 2 weapons?' then I.G. shows up and I get screwed. hopefully they will correcct the inv. options in the new codex, considering EVERYONE has a good inv. option but us. but I might try for a mega dakka army and shoot a lot. I think I am gonna free up 288 (iir) pts. and get devourer ravener. 36 shots a round, and 5 attacks each in melee

Wait till the new codex before you field those Ravenors. You really need to consider the strength of your weapons. Devourers are St -1, so on Gaunts that's going to be strength 2, and on the Ravenors that's going to be strength 3. The higher strength of the Deathspitter will be a lot more useful than the Devourer.

A full squad of 6 Ravenors:

Devourer: 36 shots, 18 hit. Against MEQ's, 10 wounds.
Cost per model (with rending) 50 points each, 300 for the squad. Range 18". No AP.

Deathspitter: 6 Shots, 2 hit dead on. Depending on squad density, on average I can get about 5 MEQ's with one hit. More for bigger units like Orks. 4 more to partial blast template hits. 14 hits, 9 wounds.
Cost per model (with rending) 46 points, 276 for the squad. Range 24". AP 5

and for fun:

Spinefists: 18 shots, 13-14 hit. Against MEQ's, 6-7 wounds.
Cost per model (with rending) 46 points, 276 for the squad. Range 12". AP 5


Devourers (atleast to me) only make sense to have on Tyrants, Warriors or Carnifii. The Gaunts and Ravenors just don't have the strength to make it worth the points.

Foolwhip has a valid point when it comes to weapons and creatures to field them on. The High Attack Power that is required to make some of the more advanced weaponry work to its maximum effect is something to consider always when building a 'Nids list.

I never take Venom Cannons on Warriors and seldom on Tyrants, neither have the Strength stat to make it worth while and its beastly expensive to field. They're better off with CC or Devourers/Deathspitters. Where they're Strength stat better fits with their roles and capabilities.

The saying: Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. Is something to keep in mind when designing an Army for 'Nids. Yes we have a lot of configurable options for our army but not every option is a good one for cost to effect ratio.

Just somethings to moll over when you're thinking about your list.

Cheers