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Check this out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBAEP9-AKZM

So every codex that uses the words "[xyz] counts as troops" should be read as "[xyz] counts as troops CHOICE." Something tells me this is not going to go over well with a lot of people. Especially when GW FAQs this, and they will in light of the fenrisian pointless rule otherwise, but choose not to clarify whether the understanding applies to other codices which use similar wording.

The point of fielding Fernisian wolves as troops (Meaning as troop choices in the FOC);

You can field a crap-ton more of them, whilst keep the fast-attack slots open. Extremely simple and I thought pretty self-apparent. Silly man with dark hair, you missed that entirely.

Still.. at the end, after the rant, he mentions Termie Armies are all go! Im all for that

Razerous wrote:The point of fielding Fernisian wolves as troops (Meaning as troop choices in the FOC);

You can field a crap-ton more of them, whilst keep the fast-attack slots open. Extremely simple and I thought pretty self-apparent. Silly man with dark hair, you missed that entirely.

Still.. at the end, after the rant, he mentions Termie Armies are all go! Im all for that

Well yes, it was apparent but the RAW and RAI are very different. Other codices have used this language before and it had always been ruled that they were NOT troop choices. See e.g. Sternguard when Pedro is taken as a HQ.

The issue I was pointing out in my above post was regarding whether we should consider ALL codex language similar to the Co: SW Ragnar/ Fenrisian Wolf special rule as the same interpretation? Are pure Sternguard armies going to be permitted now because they count as troop [choices] according to the new interpretation as opposed to just [scoring units]? It is for this implied slippery slope argument that i said "this is not going to over well with a lot of people."

Deuce11 wrote:

Razerous wrote:The point of fielding Fernisian wolves as troops (Meaning as troop choices in the FOC);

You can field a crap-ton more of them, whilst keep the fast-attack slots open. Extremely simple and I thought pretty self-apparent. Silly man with dark hair, you missed that entirely.

Still.. at the end, after the rant, he mentions Termie Armies are all go! Im all for that

Well yes, it was apparent but the RAW and RAI are very different. Other codices have used this language before and it had always been ruled that they were NOT troop choices. See e.g. Sternguard when Pedro is taken as a HQ. "

The differance between these rules and pedros is he does not make them troops he mearly makes them scoring. you cannot buy 6 squads of sterngaurd and use them as troop choices.

Also I find this video fairly useless. The hting with canis wolf borns rule is yes he makes them troop choices. But fenresian wolves have the cannot count as scoring. Now you might ask why they put this rule in. Well lets see. Can a fast attack choice score at all for any reason. The answer is no they may only contest.

Now when they become troops they may capture yes. But wait there a moment, is that rule stating that they may not. Dang now it seems that I may purcuse 6 squads of them but they dont count as scoring. Well 6 is more then 3 so I suppsoe thats the reason why they put the ability to take them as troop choices. Seems fairly straight forward to me on that ruling.

Now the main differance between the logan and wolf gaurd and the canis and fen wolves rules is that the wolf gaurd are now forced to become troops choices. You cannot get 9 groups of them only 6 now as they are no longer elites choices. They may now score as they are troops not elites.

Now how is this different from Pedros rule which states that stern gaurd are scoring units and Logans rule which makes wolf gaurds troops. Basically the same thing you would say. No its not. Wolf gaurd will become troops while sterngaurd will remain elites. That is the differance.


Also im curious as to which other army/s your refering to where a unit becomes a troop choie but may not cap or where a unit can cap but is not a troops choice. (with the exception of pedro that is.)

Video is pointless to me.

Golga wrote:

Video is pointless to me.

The video is a retraction to a previous video that gave a wrong interpretation of the rule. Basically, they were saying that Wolf Guard wouldn't be Troop choices in the Force Org chart. This video was a correction to that.

Ah I see. Didnt realize that as the title is Ask BOW: Logan Grimnar Retraction!

Still waiting on Deuce to post back though on what I said. And he said to.

I dont have the codex so what does it say?

Golga wrote:The differance between these rules and pedros is he does not make them troops he mearly makes them scoring. you cannot buy 6 squads of sterngaurd and use them as troop choices.

Also I find this video fairly useless. The hting with canis wolf borns rule is yes he makes them troop choices. But fenresian wolves have the cannot count as scoring. Now you might ask why they put this rule in. Well lets see. Can a fast attack choice score at all for any reason. The answer is no they may only contest.

Now when they become troops they may capture yes. But wait there a moment, is that rule stating that they may not. Dang now it seems that I may purcuse 6 squads of them but they dont count as scoring. Well 6 is more then 3 so I suppsoe thats the reason why they put the ability to take them as troop choices. Seems fairly straight forward to me on that ruling.

Now the main differance between the logan and wolf gaurd and the canis and fen wolves rules is that the wolf gaurd are now forced to become troops choices. You cannot get 9 groups of them only 6 now as they are no longer elites choices. They may now score as they are troops not elites.

Now how is this different from Pedros rule which states that stern gaurd are scoring units and Logans rule which makes wolf gaurds troops. Basically the same thing you would say. No its not. Wolf gaurd will become troops while sterngaurd will remain elites. That is the differance.

agree with the above. the other benefit that people forget in making stuff troops but still not scoring is that you can deploy them in dawn of war initial setups (1/3 of all games if you use the standard mission table rolls). having a cav or beast unit that can start half way up the table so that they're in assault on turn one in all probability is huge.

I am going to have to say a no go on this, because every other race will say wtf why can i do xyz becuase i have the same languages.

As an orc player why dont i have 2 deffdreads as my troop choices and captures objectives with them.

This wording is in almost every codex and i feel that GW need to make a full ruling on it.

LIke: You can use as troops in normal way. Capturing table coners, but not taking up FOC

Or, Taken as troops, but thats it. No special rules

Also, this video is wrong in that the chief reason why people like the, can be taken as troop choice, rule is becuase it allows and army to be filled with a certain type of unit. Like having 5 deafdread in orc army, or 88 bikers for that matter. I am guessing sure they counts as Troops for FOC, but units are as regular in codex. There are also may other benifits for them to be Troop choice which have all been posted on here.

What pisses me off about GW is many times the taken as troop choice rule is for units you really dont care about having more of.

Like wouldnt we all like a rule that lets us take up Troop slots in FOC for Excorsist, vindicators, Hydras, or some other Heavy support.

Just to show you how obsured this conclusion is on the video, Why dont we have vehicle capturing objectives then. I mean they are counted as troops because of the special rule from X. I mean sure why not there space wolves right, just got their new codex, and are all OP right.

Not like GW isn't allocating its codex writing time to armys that need new codexes.