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HQ:
Farseer. Has Singing spear, Doom and Fortune 133p.
Maugan Ra. 195 p.

Elites:
9 Striking Scorpions
Exarch with Scorpions Claw and Shadowstrike 207p.


4 Dark Reapers
Exarch with Tempest launcher, Crack shot and Fast shot 237p.

Troops:
9 Dire Avengers
Exarch with 2 shuriken catapults and bladestorm 152p.

9 Dire Avengers
Exarch with Power sword, Shimmershield and defend. 162p.

5 Pathfinders with long range rifles 120p.

Heavy support:
1 Fire prism with prism cannon and twin-linked shuriken catapults 115p.

2 War Walkers with scatter lasers. 120p.

1 Wraithlord with 2 flamers, eldar missile launcher and brightlance. 155p.


Total: 1596 p.

Thoughts? Ideas? Additions? Subtractions?

I'll mostly be playing against Tau, Imperial Guard and Space Marines. So any hints as to what to do would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

Drop the power sword and shields from the second avenger squad. They have no business in cc and those upgrades wouldn't make much of a difference. War walkers are great so keep those. If you're taking a prism, think two and drop the wraithlord. Fire dragons are a must, I never leave the craftworld without them and neither should you

Gonna have to agree/disagree with the above poster. Dire Avengers with a SS and defend can be used very effectively as a speed bump or a way to tie someone up to get your scorpions to them. Cannot tell you how many times i have been charged by genestealers or charged genestealers with my dire avengers set up like that and lived and then wiped them out with back up. But against Tau, Marines, and guard you really don't need it so i would also change the set up. I really don't like expensive wraithlords, seem to much like expensive very tough weapons platforms. For me it is a wraithsword and that is it or nothing. Also second the need for another fire prism.
I cannot see 5 pathfinders doing much besides being REALLY annoying...

Mengwai wrote:Gonna have to agree/disagree with the above poster. Dire Avengers with a SS and defend can be used very effectively as a speed bump or a way to tie someone up to get your scorpions to them. Cannot tell you how many times i have been charged by genestealers or charged genestealers with my dire avengers set up like that and lived and then wiped them out with back up. But against Tau, Marines, and guard you really don't need it so i would also change the set up. I really don't like expensive wraithlords, seem to much like expensive very tough weapons platforms. For me it is a wraithsword and that is it or nothing. Also second the need for another fire prism.
I cannot see 5 pathfinders doing much besides being REALLY annoying...

Nice hints, thanks. I have only played the game once and have yet to think of a strategy. What would be your way to setup the dire avenger squads? And anything else considering my opponents? Units, setups?

and on a side note, the pathfinders are mostly for objective holding once my scorpions get there. I just remembered I forgot to add my Wave Serpent to the list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SpringLevel wrote:Drop the power sword and shields from the second avenger squad. They have no business in cc and those upgrades wouldn't make much of a difference. War walkers are great so keep those. If you're taking a prism, think two and drop the wraithlord. Fire dragons are a must, I never leave the craftworld without them and neither should you

Check. I'll get a couple of f'drags then. I assume you want to use them in a falcon to get to the enemy fast? I am wondering how to keep them alive... As I previously posted I am not an experienced player yet, and still learning. I imagine this:

The falcon drives up, screeches to a halt. The dragons jump out, shoot some big thing and then... they die. How can I maximize their lifespan and killing-ness?

By...doing all that on a quiet flank.
Or dropping them off so that the tank blocks line of sight when dead (when not exploded).

Otherwise... that is their job. That is how they have been used for the longest stretch of time...and it's been acceptable so far.

An inefficient way would be to get more Dragons on a serpent.../shrug.

Options:

1) Dark Reapers are heavy support. This means you will have to drop a HS option. I would, even though theyre great, drop the walkers. The armies you said youd play against mostly are vehicle heavy so the prism and wraithlord (ultimate tank killing in CC unit) are a must.

2)Drop reapers and Magaun Ra. Get 10 fire drags+ Feugan in a WS. This is a great shooting and tank killing unit, Feugan even is decent in combat.

3)Drop reapers and Maugan Ra. Include Karandrras, who can make your scorpions a deadly CC unit, and some warlocks for bodyguards of your Farseer.

All of theese options are good improvements, personally id go for option 2. Some of theese changes may increase points but since your 1500pt army totals 1600pts id aim for 1750pts.

Okey - here's the revised list:

HQ:
Farseer. Has Singing spear, Doom and Fortune 133p.
Phoenix Lord Fuegan. 205 points.

Elites:
9 Striking Scorpions
Exarch with Scorpions Claw and Shadowstrike 207p.

9 Fire Dragons
Exarch with firepike and Tank hunter. 195p.

Troops:
9 Dire Avengers
Exarch with 2 shuriken catapults and bladestorm 152p.

9 Dire Avengers
Exarch with Power sword, Shimmershield and defend. 162p.

5 Pathfinders with long range rifles 120p.

Heavy support:
1 Fire prism with prism cannon and twin-linked shuriken catapults 115p.

2 War Walkers with scatter lasers. 120p.

1 Wraithlord with 2 flamers, eldar missile launcher and brightlance. 155p.

1 Wave Serpent for transporting the Fire dragons. Has twinlinked shuricats and twinlinked scatter lasers. 115p.

Total: 1679 p.

That leaves me with 71 points... Maybe a few more Pathfinders? For 72 points I can get three extra Pathfinders which would leave me at 1751 points.

Too many eggs in one basket with the fire dragons. They're mainly anti armour, a vehicle will not survive 5 melta shots let alone 10. If you split them you have dual units for support, threat and target satuation. Also the fire pike isn't needed as much because all the others are 12", so you're paying 12 points plus for the fire pike to get one 24" weapon. Also tank hunters is over kill, your wasting points as the volume of meltas is enough for the job.

Problem with this entire list is lack of transport. Eldar out in the open won't last long and will relie on cover - with ap4 cover weapons around they won't last long at all. You really need mass wave serpents.

Wraithlord needs another for support, I would drop the war walkers really.

mercer wrote:Too many eggs in one basket with the fire dragons. They're mainly anti armour, a vehicle will not survive 5 melta shots let alone 10. If you split them you have dual units for support, threat and target satuation. Also the fire pike isn't needed as much because all the others are 12", so you're paying 12 points plus for the fire pike to get one 24" weapon. Also tank hunters is over kill, your wasting points as the volume of meltas is enough for the job.

Problem with this entire list is lack of transport. Eldar out in the open won't last long and will relie on cover - with ap4 cover weapons around they won't last long at all. You really need mass wave serpents.

Wraithlord needs another for support, I would drop the war walkers really.

What would you have me transport in the serpents? And how many would you like to see in the list?

Would transporting 5 fire dragons in one Falcon each be a good idea?

Draons - 10 dragons in a serpent is fine but dropping the exarch all together is a good idea. Tank hunter is rather overkill and firepike isn't going to make much difference if your dropping them off right. Keep 10 in a serpent with spirit stones and scatter lasers.

Farseer with SS - I'm assuminig your goign to have him tagged along with the DA, in which case the SS won't have much use as the DA won't be targeting vehicles.

DA units - as stated before PW and shimmer are rather pointless unless you planning to assualt teddybears. Do not be fooled by the statline/exarch gear, DA will get torn up in CC. Best config is 10 w/ bladestorm exarch in a serpent armed with Anti-Tank.

Wraithlord - My personal feelign is that the best wraithlord is a cheap and effective 100pt swordlord. The missle launcher and brightlance will indeed to some damage, but the wraithlord can easily be taken down by lascannon or railgun fire. For 100pts his cost is low enogh to justify him as a big nasty distration and run him straight at the enemy till you make contact.

Fire Prism - these are a fail the majority of the time without a set of them, though to you benefit you didn't waste points on the holofield

Keep playing with it a bit. Not sure if you have purchased all this stuff or not already, but if not you'll want to do some proxy battles and get a feel for what you like before purchasing.

Everything on foot needs serpents, scorpions are debatable. I put my scorpions in a serpent with a farseer.

Falcons are ok, though serpents give more protection. Have a play on that one, thuogh I swapped my falcons for serpents with brightlances in the end.

@Bluedagger: I've bought everything except the Fire Dragons and Fuegan. This list (excluding the aforementioned firesnakes) was given to me by a friend who'd composed it for me, he said it was a rather defensive list and he might be right. I have yet to play more than twice with it even though I crushed my Tau-opponent that time.

@Mercer: I'll buy 3 more serpents once the paycheck lands.

On a general note I was actually planning on keeping my Farseer with my Wraithlord to assure he won't freeze. My plan for the WL was to keep him at medium distance and just wreck havoc. Maybe he won't be able to do that?

10 fire dragons is NOT fine. 5-6 dragons does the same job as 10. What you could do is use it as a dual purpose unit by giving the exarch the flamer and crack shot. I would not advise this with your current list since your lone serpent will at best deliver the dragons isolated from the rest of your units making them easy to kill for your opponent. Fueagn (or any PL for that matter) is a fail. They are simply over priced and takes up a slot that could be better used. You could get Eldrad or Yriel for those points...

One lone serpent will not survive no matter how good it its. Any serpent need stones, I prefer to field mine with stone and Shuri Cannon. I want my Serpents to deliver troops so 24" range is more than enough.

Both Wraith Lords and Fire Prisms should be take in pairs (at least) So Id drop the WL from your list.

Keeping some what to your original list Id go with

HQ:80
Farseer (Doom)=80

Troops:512
10xDAs (Exarch+Bladestorm+Dual Cata) = 152
Serpent (Stones+SCannons) = 110

9xDAs (Exarch+Bladestorm+Dual Cata) = 140
Serpent (Stones+SCannons) = 110

Elites:677
5xDragons = 80
Serpent (Stones+SCannons) = 110

5xDragons = 80
Serpent (Stones+SCannons) = 110

10x Scorpions (Exarch+Claw) = 187
Serpent (Stones+SCannons) = 110

Heavy Support:230
2xFire Prisms = 230

Total = 1499


Automatically Appended Next Post:
If you were planing to "only" get 4 serpents in total and already had a falcon I guess you could use the falcon as a DAVU falcon. minimize one DA squad and deploy them in the falcon. Now you have a scoring gun boat that can sit back and shoot. Make sure you get stones and holo fields on your falcon.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Deploying Dragons with a falcon is a big NO NO since in order to deploy them in melta range your falcon will it self be within melta range. No holo fields will help against that.

As tedurur stated, Falcon is typically a big fat no go unless it's a min squad DA unit to count it as scoring. I have done a Falcon Gunboat one time with a Farseer (guide) + 5 DA moving at 6" with Swordlords on either side. Worked well since the guide kept the BS3 from becoming an issue and the WL kept their Wraithsight in check.

If you don't end up with the above setup it's still a go idea to have at least 3-4 waveserpents around. You'll find jsut about anything you want to use really needs one to survive now-a-days.

I think you really want a Full Seer council in a serpent, maybe with Eldrad/Yriel. Then take 2-3 Wave Serpents full of DA's and a WS with 5-6 Fire Dragons. 1 Wave Serpent with some banshees if you have spare points. and then a Pair of Prisms. I would never leave home without Holo-Fields, prisms die FAR to easily without them. i generally lose a Prism at turn without fields, and Iplay armies with little anti-tank.
Cam


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I think you really want a Full Seer council in a serpent, maybe with Eldrad/Yriel. Then take 2-3 Wave Serpents full of DA's and a WS with 5-6 Fire Dragons. 1 Wave Serpent with some banshees if you have spare points. and then a Pair of Prisms. I would never leave home without Holo-Fields, prisms die FAR to easily without them. i generally lose a Prism at turn without fields, and I play armies with little anti-tank.
Cam

I think you really want a Full Seer council in a serpent, maybe with Eldrad/Yriel. Then take 2-3 Wave Serpents full of DA's and a WS with 5-6 Fire Dragons. 1 Wave Serpent with some banshees if you have spare points. and then a Pair of Prisms. I would never leave home without Holo-Fields, prisms die FAR to easily without them. i generally lose a Prism at turn without fields, and Iplay armies with little anti-tank.
Cam

Fire dragons are a good investment note that 2 squads of 5 can sometimes be better than a squad of 10 sincce they cant get killed in one go. Wrlocks are good to but i dont thik you need a full council.

If you are getting your prisms shot up despite the fact that they have a 60" range then you are doing something wrong. A single dragon squad is not a good idea. Almost all AT gone to one exploded Serpent is obviously a bad thing. Taking a full council with Yriel at 1500 pts would be a redicoulus investment. 650pts minimum in one squad is just crazy.

In all of your lists I notice that your Farseer is given two powers but not spirit stones, make sure you give him the stones so you can use two powers a turn!

If you count the points you will see that the farseer does indeed have Spirit Stones

Its quite hard to be 60" away on a 4' x 4' table.

Why not a farseer with a warlock bodyguard . The dragons will need a transport otherwise they simply die a horrible death in transit on foot (had a go wit them the other day, wasnt pretty)

Against tau ive heard that fast attack and CC work best as they lack in effective assualt troops. the Prisms would be nice to keep their heavy weapons busy which is the bread basket of the tau, but work best in pairs.

Otherwise im a fan of the scorpions as a CC option with their ability to infiltrate with their exarch powers makes them a wicked choice, even more so when their PL joins them . Hawks are great if they keep moving (deep striking) otherwise they are a tad on the expensive side.

What bout using a harlie troup? put them into a transport and get them close enough to assualt any troops, with a shadow seer they are harder to target. Scorpions can be used to counter strike.

But like i said im new and still working on my list for the eldar. Goodluck with yours

I skipped reading the other postings to say" Guide and Doom" Suck on the recieving end. Damm psykers with witchblade are always kicking butt with my SoB and Templars marines.
Eldar have a lot of killer units. You are on the best 40K site.

resinmann wrote:Eldar have a lot of killer units. You are on the best 40K site.

Hazaah!!

Lots of good points in the previous posts, to stress a few:

Fire dragons do best in medium sized units, 6-7 are very good, and dont bother with an exarch. Fire dragons go in, kill the most important armor/ heavy infantry target they can find and then distract your opponent for a turn while he kills them. A serpent is almost always a better ride for them than a serpent, since its going to end up inside melta range of the response.


Eldar armies in general love tranports, waves serpents in general are better transports than falcons. War walkers, prisms and wraithlords are in general better heavy choices than falcons. So if you have a falcon already, try a conversion to a prism (did one with a couple tubes from a local hardware store and one jewelry bit for the prism itself) or ask politely to have it count as a serpent.


Dark reapers are a very fun unit, they can occasionally be very useful, but overall they are expensive for what they do. Eldar have some truly excellent units available in the heavy slot, its rare that dark reapers cant be replaced by something else cheaper and better.


Make certain that your farseer is tooled up a bit. He has two powers and I believe that you said he has spirit stones. Make sure that he also has runes of warding and runes of witnessing. Cheapest way to shut down opponent's psychers is with those cheap little runes. And if you are planning on using two powers a turn you need the other runes yourself.


Sliggoth

resinmann wrote:I skipped reading the other postings to say" Guide and Doom" Suck on the recieving end. Damm psykers with witchblade are always kicking butt with my SoB and Templars marines.
Eldar have a lot of killer units. You are on the best 40K site.

Booyaa!!