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Hi All,

I would like to make battlewagon heavy orks.

Usually I play kan wall, therefore I appreciate any help with mech orks.

Basically the list as I imagine would look like:

HQ:

Big Mekk - KFF - 85 pts
Bikeboss - attack squig, bike, pk, bosspole - 140 pts (hiding behind wagons till charge range, against heavy vehicles)

Elite:

11 Komandos - 2 x burna, Snikrot - 225 pts

Troops:

19 shotta boyz - 1 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole, boarding plank - 154 pts (Mekk goes in here)
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj - 130 pts

20 shotta boyz - 2 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole - 165 pts
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts

20 shotta boyz - 2 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole - 165 pts
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts

Fast attack:

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts (first turn scout, harrasment, against light vehicles)

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts

Total: 1499

I wonder if you have any experience of using Snikmandos in fast mech army like this one (may go on board in T4, when either my I will be after 2 rounds of cc or wrecked half way.

I consider dropping Deffkoptas and komandos for another Battlewagon with shottas, or two trukks with suicide slugga/choppa squads.

What would you put in battlewagon: slugas or shottas?

What would you amend in this list?

Thanks in advance !

m

The kommandos are good as they will make your opponent want to not deploy right along the edge, making them deploy closer to your wagons.

Shootas in wagons since you don't have the need to run.

I'll keep it english so that others can comment on that what I write here...

Well answering one of your questions sluggas are better that shootas when in BWs.
When you have BWs filled with boyz you want them to aproach the enemy as quickly as possible
and then charge dealing massive damage. With shoota boyz you will have one attack less on the charge
plus you won't be able to shoot them most probably because you'll be moving as far as the BWs can go.

I seriously think that the bikeboss will be feeling quite lonely out there. Seriously some escort should be there.
Usually bikebosses are accompained by biker nobz. So I'd go with that making it half mech half biker nob army
or drop the boss and put something in his place like Ghazzy or another KFF mek, or squeeze him somewhere
into the BWs. And if you intend to keep him this way... What does he need a bosspole for?

Buzzsaws on Deffkoptas are arguable. It does give you a chance to kill something but almost only while attacking
rear armor and that is a bit bad for 25 pts. However if you don't take it charging will be reduced only to a means
of triggering Hit and Run. Your choice, I guess.

I think you'll find kommandos generally satisfying. With Snik they're perfect for kicking
sniper/heavy weapons squads' asses hanging in the back like CSM Obliterators, Eldar Rangers and stuff.
Also his Str is quite enough to bash into the backs of vehicles with satisfying results.

That would be all.

Powodzenia w podbojach

Drop the buzzsaws to save points. A kopta can hardly win a HtH combat.No need to emphasise it is S6,not S8.

Second that. I played a game tonight with one of my buddies and my Coptas stayed tied for the entire game with one unit of Marines. It wasn't until the last turn that he killed them... shame.

Disagree about the Deffkopta. I think you've got the right idea for it: try to go first and go after a vehicle or two in your first turn.

Slugga boyz as stated are mandatory in a mek list, you won't get to shoot those shootas. Buzzsaws are good, as they are S7 on the charge and thus are pretty good at popping armor T1 with a turbo boost charge. Get the boss in one of the wagons. Also, try and get those kommando's to a full 15, it does make a difference. Last bit of advice is my own preference, have at least one trukk per BW. Trukks can move faster, and are great for hiding behind the BW's then flying out around them to get their boyz into charge range.

I agree with Aztralwolf and Sarigar on the koptas. 7 is usually enough to bust tanks at rear armor and lighter vehicles. Personally I think they are useless charging infantry, however they are decent tank destroyers. A 70 point kopta can destroy a 150 point predator on the first turn before the enemy can do something about it. Thats worth it I guess, though 7 str on the charge for 25pts sometimes hurts.

Buzzsaws are great on koptas. 3 S7 auto hits on the rear armor of non-moving vehicles are what you are looking for. They are a suicide unit; expect to lose them and their killpoints, but in exchange, you should kill or injure something more valuable.

Hi All,

Thank you guys for for advice.

Generally Ive tried to include most of your remarks in new list below.

Deffkoptas with buzzsaw stay in the list. I find them very usefull either in T1 assault (which with lt rokkita and buzzaw can easily pop up or at least stop enemy transport or engage unit of devastators for couple of rounds) or as a unit that distracts enemy during his T1 shooting (they scout in before T1).

what I did:

1. increased Kommandos to 15.

2. took bike from bike boss and make room for him in BW

3. added 3rd deffkopta

HQ:

Big Mekk - KFF - 85 pts
Boss - attack squig, pk, bosspole - 100 pts

Elite:

15 Komandos - 2 x burna, Snikrot - 265 pts

Troops:

19 slugga boyz - 1 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole, boarding plank - 154 pts (Mekk goes in here)
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj - 130 pts

19 slugga boyz - 1 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole - 154 pts (warboss goes in here)
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts

20 slugga boyz - 2 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole - 165 pts
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts

Fast attack:

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts (first turn scout, harrasment, against light vehicles)

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts

Total: 1497

Im still concerned with only 3 scoring units? Maybe I shoud switch one deffkopta for gretchins? Or one battlewagon and deffkopta for two trukks with sluggas?

What do you think about this one ?

thanks for input,

m

I like it. My only suggestion, more of an alternative, would be consider dropping a unit of sluggas and one kopta for a unit of burnas to put in the wagon instead. The roving burna wagon is hell on wheels and great against everything except vehicles.

LeperMessiah wrote:I like it. My only suggestion, more of an alternative, would be consider dropping a unit of sluggas and one kopta for a unit of burnas to put in the wagon instead. The roving burna wagon is hell on wheels and great against everything except vehicles.

Quoted for truth.

This unit will run you 225 for the burnas, ~100 for the mek with KFF and burna, and ~110 for the wagon, rpj, rolla, armor plates and shoota.

The net result is a unit that can take out 200 points of marines in 1 hit, with less than a 4% chance of being disabled by lascannons, and less than 25% chance of being knocked out by meltas even when they hit rear armor.

The template attack will typically claim the lives of 1 or more entire units of soft targets every turn starting turn 2. You can even turn the burnas into armor cutters for tough 6 save 2+ targets in Nidzilla once the genestealers are dealt with. It is very versatile, and rarely claims less than it is worth in total body count, particularly since it tends to claim more than 1 unit per turn since all you have to do is barely clip a couple of models to annihilate multiple groups in one shot.

- Kill 1 whole space marine group 10 strong? Clip 4 models for a total of 64 auto-hits. Unit dead.

- Kill 1 whole genestealer group 12 strong? Clip 2 models for a total of 32 auto-hits, ignoring their armor and cover with 16 total wounds.

- Kill 50 imperial guard in a single unit? Clip 5 models, and the entire unit disappears in a puff of smoke.

- 10 strong terminator squad? Yes, you need to clip 8 of the group to destroy it, but that's not too hard to do, particularly since you can tankshock the group into a clumped up position prior to firing. Just hope they don't luck out when they death or glory.

These numbers may seem broken, but it is what it is. Expect firing from open topped vehicles to be changed in 6th edition or that they take on new (and probably significant) nerfs to counter-balance this fairly common strategy.

It tends to draw a lot of fire, but again... a lascannon in the hands of a bs 4 marine has just slightly over a 3% chance of disabling the tank. If that tank goes down, offload and jump in another wagon. You can even leave the mek behind for repairs if it was just immobilized. About the only effective counter that I've seen to it is a broadside group, marker lights, and a significant amount of rapid fire levelled on the exposed group once the wagon is gone. Short of that level of commitment from your opponent, there is little that they can do other than 4 leaf clovers that will eliminate the threat from the board.

I find a BW with mek and burna's paired with a BW with ghazzy and boyz really messes with an opponent. That gives them 2, front av14 targets, that they REALLY wanna drop quick, that are moving VERY quickly to their front lines. Add in some snikrot kommando's and their world just got REEEEEEAAAL small. They won't have very long to stop you, or lose the game.

Indeed. I would also add that dropping one group of boyz and a copta for the burnas is very worthwhile, point for point. The killing power of the burnas far outweighs the killing potential of 20 boyz, for less than 100 points more in cost, and the copta can't compete with a deff rolla's ability to eliminate light (or heavy for that matter) armor.

You can easily see from above how clumped up units within transports will get vaporized as their vehicle is stripped from them via 1D6 S10 auto-hits (assuming your FLGS goes with that rule interpretation), followed by the template claiming every man, woman, and child inside during the shooting phase.

I would never suggest more than 1 unit of burnas used this way though, unless you are afraid that the initial group will be destroyed. I usually find my burnas cruising around with no targets left to devour at the end of the game, as whatever they didn't take out, the boyz did.

I like most of the list, but I agree with the point about Burnas. Infantry hate Burnas. I would also suggest dropping the BIg shootas from the Sluggas, and maybe only give one to each of your Wagons. Take those extra points and give your boss a PK, and 'eavy armor.

I think two squads of 20 boyz each or nearly 20 boyz each tend to be enough for objective missions. With so many boyz usually you need just one mob to hold your objectives. Besides it's easier to eradicate your opponents troops and some support and then go for the objectives then try to struggle the entire game.
Last time I played against plague marines. 3 squads of 5. by turn 4 my opponent had no chance of winning because I simply ground his troops to dust. Unfortunately for me he did contest my objectives in the last turn but that was just due to my unlucky rolls when I tried to destroy the contesting vehicles.

I didn'dt use burnas so far, maybe its high time I did

I did drop one deffkopta and instead of one boyz got 12 burnas in BW. I also added 10 gretchins for scoring purposes. I could drop them for more burnas but I guess 12 should be enough. Gretchins would be in reserves. What do you think?

List after your last bit of advice about burnas would look like:

HQ:

Big Mekk - KFF - 85 pts
Boss - attack squig, pk, bosspole, eavy armour - 105 pts

Elite:

15 Komandos - 2 x burna, Snikrot - 265 pts

12 Burnas - 180 pts

Troops:

19 slugga boyz - 1 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole, boarding plank - 154 pts (Mekk goes in here)
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj - 130 pts

19 slugga boyz - 1 x big shotta, pk noob, bosspole - 154 pts (warboss goes in here)
battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts

10 gretchin - with runtherd 40 pts

Fast attack:

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts (first turn scout, harrasment, against light vehicles)

Deffkopta - buzzsaw, tl rokkit - 70 pts

Heavy Support

battlewagon - deffrolla, 2 x big shotta, rpj, boarding plank - 130 pts (for burnas)

Total: 1498

I didn't add Big Mekk to burnas because I would like to make three equal squads to shot at instead of two.

thanks for advice, m

Now i was going to be posting a thread with my own list that i was planning on playing, but it was far too similar to this. Though i like grabba klaws.
I don't want to hi-jack this, but 2 lists on the same page seemed pointless (i apologise if anyone disagrees).

My major difference is that i am playing a battlewagon which has "Thraka" (my own boss) and 4 kombi-skorcha MANZ.

My question to everyone is, say i take a list like this:

Thraka
4 skorcha MANZ
Battlewagon, plank, ram, armour, paint, grabba klaw, big shoota

20 boyz w/ Klaw nob
Battlewagon ~same~

Snikrot, 11(in lists i have atm) kommandos w/ 2 burnas

10 Grotz

What is a better 3rd unit in a wagon.

Now i defo want Big Mek with KFF and burna!
But hanging with 19 boyz or 12-15 burnaz?

Obviously boyz = objective holding and i get points for more grotz or something else (i have always ran a one-of buzzsaw kopta).

But are the burnaz so hardcore that my 3 scoring units, will be enough?

Interesting comments by everyone btw.

Also, an additional question, what is everyones favourite Battlewagon upgrades.

Edit: so i noticed after posting this i did this off the second list you had posted, and not the most recent with burnaz and such, id still think it worth looking into however, burnaz are great, and i field them a lot too, but yea, more vehicles is always good.



So, i went through and did some maths, have you considered going the route of trucks?

if you cut out the 20 slugga boy battlewagon and its passengers, the 19 sluggaboyz in the bosses intended wagon and 2 deffkoptas, you get 589 points.

with 589 points you could get this

12xboyz /w nob with power klaw and bosspole, in trukk with red paint and reinforced ram.
12xboyz /w nob with power klaw and bosspole in trukk with red paint and reinforced ram.

7x nobz including painboy, 2x power klaws,
5x eavy armors, 2x kombi skorchas waaaagh banner, bosspole. They ride in the second wagon that had its boyz cut for points.


replace the nob squad into the wagon #2 that had boyz emptied. boss with them for a squad that will eat faces of almost anything. Also you gain an extra vehicle to attack another target, than a solo wagon, 3 more nobz with powerklaws, and the trukks biggshootas.

though you should mabye find 10 points to give the trucks boarding planks if your local meta is mech heavy.